Bible Reading Part 1, Forgiveness

So we're thankful to be here and it's nice to be among friends and I hope and pray that by the end of this day we'll be changed. I hope we'll have a fresh appreciation of what we've been brought into by the grace of God and I hope also as we leave we might be able to put it into practice with other people. So these are the goals before we even start.

To leave this little gathering changed, melted, that's my word, melted by the love of God. Shall we pray? Our father as we bow in thy presence we give thanks unto thee again for even an opportunity to gather to open the holy scriptures to hear thy word and our father that is the voice that we crave that is the voice that we long for this afternoon though there'll be much help given by men we pray that the spirit of God would guide every thought to the glory of God to the building up of his people and our father for the edification of the saints that we might put up put out our last days in full energy for him our father that our hearts might be touched and the coldness driven out and that we might again be a people that is in love with our first love help us our father this is our cry we are dependent upon thee we ask for a great sense of thy presence as we look in these great portions of the love of God to us receive our thanks now give the much needed help we ask in the savior's precious name to take up a topic these fast in our bibles it's hard to pick just a scripture or two to read and i'll just read a couple to start with forgiveness and no doubt many others will be brought brought forth i'll read a couple of favorites ephesians chapter one please ephesians chapter one verse number six to the praise of the glory of his grace wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved in whom we have redemption through his blood the forgiveness of sins according to the riches of his grace wherein he hath abounded toward us in all wisdom and prudence having made known unto us the mystery of his will according to his good pleasure which he had purposed in himself that in the dispensation of the fullness of times he might gather together in one all things in christ both which are in heaven and which are on earth even in him turn to chapter four please the ephesians chapter four verse number 32 and be kind one to another tender-hearted forgiving one another even as god for christ's sake have forgiven you now to the book of colossians please chapter one colossians chapter one verse 12 giving thanks unto the father which hath made us meet to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light who hath delivered us from the power of darkness and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear son in whom we have redemption through his blood even the forgiveness of sins who is the image of the invisible god the firstborn of every creature for by him were all things created that are in heaven and are in earth visible and invisible whether they be thrones or dominions or principalities or powers all things were created by him and for him and he is before all things and by him all things consist and this will get us a start to our reading i'm not one for taking up much time to build a porch when there's so much talent and so much gift in this room today and i have come to understand that i have way more questions on these topics and answers and so we do look for much help from our brethren today and just keep in mind it's the person responsible to lead the reading to draw out from the gifted men among us what the scriptures are teaching so uh that's my job so i'll just be the referee as it were and look for much help in this little reading and the outline if you've got the outline it's just some simple thoughts and we don't have to go by it completely but it'll get us at least started and hopefully keep us on track but forgiveness just by definition is a release from bondage the remission of penalty a pardon or release of responsibility and as far as our sin is concerned this is a tremendous thing brother for god to have forgiven us and so as we just start with this let's concentrate on the position that we've been brought into first because before we'll ever be able to put it in practice we need to understand even better what we have in god's presence so let's start there and we'll work our way down my brother-in-law tyler gave me some help a long time ago he said when we study our bible to look at it in three ways and he'll admit this wasn't original with him but it was it was very very nice look at him through a telescope first look out into heaven and see what has been accomplished and then he said look at a microscope second what the minute things on earth and then thirdly look through the look through a stethoscope what is it saying about our heart and so as we look through and look at forgiveness as far as what god is as far as how god is concerned brother come in and tell us just what happens god is the source of forgiveness let's start there brother would you agree that the first time the word is mentioned in scripture that there's a print there off their principles i can gather from that so the first time the word forgiveness occurs in our bibles i think is genesis chapter 50 i don't know if we want to turn there together but perhaps i'll just read it verse 15 when joseph's brethren saw that their father was dead they said joseph will peradventure hate us and will certainly requite us all the did unto them and they sent a messenger unto joseph saying thy father joseph's father did commend before he died saying socially he said to joseph forgive i pray thee now to trespass of thy brethren and their sin for they did unto the evil and now we pray thee forgive the trespass of the servants of the god of thy father and joseph wept when they spake unto him isn't there a lovely principle there that the father is making provision for forgiveness he's begging joseph to forgive the brethren through them bringing the message to forgive their sin and so as you said forgiveness originates with god but not only that we see from this passage that joseph wept so we see the compassion and heart of god coming through here so that did not appreciate the forgiveness that god has given us is a slight to the god who forgave us because we are actually attacking his character again saying god is not he's not he's unable to forgive me or i'm unable to forgive because of whatever is a slight against god himself because he's the originator it comes right from him it makes him unique from every other every god every false god in 2001 you probably heard this story an afghani woman was uh had seven children and she was uh caught for some uh a crime of killing her husband who was beating her and she came before the tribunal and she was pleading for mercy and forgiveness and they said the quote is uh her guilt is greater than can be forgiven so he shot her in the head because uh muhammad and allah are not a forgiving god see that's that's false god so the god of the bible is one who forgives because it comes from him an offense has taken place god has been offended and here's the offended god coming out to the offender and offering forgiveness be like a policeman coming to a a person who was done a uh you know got caught for speeding saying i stopped you for going you know x amount of miles over the speed limit and i just want to call you i want to i want to forgive you that's how that's how you know we may laugh at that this is what god has done for us he's come out to us because he's we've offended him and he comes and offers us forgiveness and everything is done in a righteous basis it has to be yep that's the the basic scripture in regard to that without shedding of blood is no remission no forgiveness and so when we're talking about god's forgiveness we can't separate it from the death of christ that's it without the shedding of blood no no aspect of anything else concerning christ except the shedding of blood could give us forgiveness so in deuteronomy 14 and 18 says the lord is long-suffering and of great mercy forgiving iniquity and transgression and by no means clearing the guilty visiting the iniquity of the father upon the children in the third fourth generation seems to be a contradiction in that verse to me that he's long-suffering of great mercy and forgiving and yet by no means clearing the guilt if god is going to clear the guilty he has to do it righteously and that's his that's where we have to start when we come to the day and age in which we live god has cleared the guilty righteously has he not through the person the death of his son so was considering god as the source of forgiveness god reaching out to guilty mankind everybody is guilty and god deals with as individuals on a one-on-one basis he doesn't save people in groups he doesn't save people and families though families do get saved but the forgiveness of sins is an individual thing and god having found complete satisfaction in the work of christ and reach out to individuals personally and there that is that is tremendous to think that all of us have been brought into this relationship that are saved here of being forgiven that into that position now i don't know where you would you had something different in mind there or where are you going i would just think of the perfect substitution of christ there has to be a perfect substitute where god was unrighteous and for offering forgiveness okay forgiveness is only offered on a righteous basis is forgiveness dependent on repentance is forgiveness dependent on repentance yeah even though it's god is forgiving god and yet to forgive the sinner the guilty guilty has to repent there is definitely man's responsibility isn't there god can has no can only do so much and that he has done he has sent his son he has punished the lord jesus as far as sin is concerned but if the person never acknowledges it as their own receives them as their own personal savior the work of christ really means nothing to that person you brought up the thought was not uh giving the guilty not for uh i mean there you go i mean they had people get uh so in colossians chapter two you have the righteousness for how god can be righteous and forgiving sins in verse 14 it says blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us which was contrary to us and took it out of the way nearly to his cross so we have the idea there of a bill of debt that is actually being paid by another person so god is righteous in forgiving sin because that death has been made right with us so the forgiveness that we enjoy in this day of grace that we have is this forgiveness different than the forgiveness that anyone experienced in the old testament are you referring to as far as what the sacrifices did for that person's sins and what the work of christ has done for ours yeah i'm thinking of romans 3 actually verse 25 that there was a righteousness for the remission of sins in the past with the forbearance of god and in those sacrifices they never really accomplished the forgiveness that we have today god went along with those people he forbearance he went along with the sinning nation based upon the sacrifices but there was never a righteous sacrifice where god could actually say to them your sins and iniquities i will remember no more forever because they had to repeat the opposite right because there wasn't a righteous sacrifice they could not accomplish the forgiveness that god has in christ for us in the word itself remission if we look at that word it's interesting you brought that out because that is the only case in the new testament where the word is uh hermeses i can't pronounce these greek words perhaps very well but it is the only difference and it has the idea of passing over there and that's the exact content of that through the forbearance of god the past sins and all the other cases it's apices and that is in the case which is the pardon and the liberty doesn't that make it that much more responsible for us to forgive each other because we're in grace even in the old testament when they made those sacrifices it was written they will be forgiven so in a sense it's almost the same forgiveness they were forgiven there's no doubt about that is there they were forgiven but they had to continually make the sacrifice but the lord jesus on one his own blood is a forgiveness that stands that's beautiful to me the publican who went to the temple to pray and said god be merciful to me for a sinner he went forgiven justifying uh and on the basis of repentance if we look at second corinthians chapter seven you'll see solomon's praying to god and he asks five times if if there be a pestilence or if there'd be a flag or a hand and your people turn to you and pray and ask for repentance forgive them and the lord god appears to him afterward and uh and says um in verse 12 the lord appeared to solomon and then in verse 14 i will hear from heaven and will forgive their sins and will hear their land so it's it's a repentance-based approach isn't it i don't know where to inject this question but way before genesis 50 in genesis 3 adam and eve the only ones on earth were they forgiven of their sins i would say through the provision that god made in the killing of the animal that their recovered what do you think i would agree with that i think we get a lot of divine forgiveness said all right in chapter three of genesis because god is looking at his son coming to fully satisfy him at the cross so he's forgiving them he's covering them he's uh justifying them all in that sense in the old term old testament language in view of the coming sacrifice of his fully totally forever satisfied so the old statement uh they're sitting down to credit i want to digress for just a moment i hate doing that bobby but we're taking for granted something here that every that everybody knows but we haven't mentioned it and that is just simply that's what we really deserve let's just take a moment if we sit here in a comfortable chair and nice suits and nice dresses and nice hats where should we be each every one of us should be in a place of suffering a place of judgment you agree with that okay where are we now we're talking about forgiveness brother so it's not much of a digression but i wanted to point that out because we take that for granted we really should be suffering for our sin and the love of god being the source god himself being the source of our forgiveness has provided point b the sacrifice the lamb but our brother has just said is that forgiveness means absolutely nothing the bible there are principles that means that it never deviates it never changes our brother henderson has quoted that key verse without the shedding of blood there's no remission now we're trying to get a background for our gospel preaching you talk to unsaved people and you'll tell them of the sacrifice why does it have to be that way god said without the shedding of blood there's no remission i don't know i just know this god said that there's no forgiveness without shedding of blood and it's just that way because god said that as you go back to the end of your bible the principle is established immediately as our brother has pointed out in the early chapters of genesis god makes it clear able-bodied lamb solomon at the dedication to the temple 20 000 oxen 120 000 sheep rivers of blood you go to solomon say what does this mean one simple thing beginning of the bible to end there's only one way of approach to god and that is by sacrifice and bloodshed and we are brought into it in whom we have redemption through his blood the forgiveness of sins the reason that there must be the shedding of blood is because the death penalty for the penalty for sin of death and in order for god to righteously deal with sin there must be bloodshed there must be the death and here it is the blood of the lord jesus christ to our brother's point that i find out genesis chapter three that was very very i enjoyed that because the lord god said in the day that you eat thereof you shall surely die that sentence was carried out uh not we sometimes spiritualize it but we we overlook perhaps or at least i have that there was an animal that died and that that sense of death that was justly required it was actually carried out except other people forgiven on the basis of that death uh the word forgiveness as you mentioned has three different connotations one has the idea to send away and that's used 146 times in our new testament and it shows the authority of the one to whom the cat is older they have the authority to send that that uh to send away on the basis of who they are there is their authority and there's 17 times the next one is used uh that's in ephesians one verse seven let me look at it's the release or dismissal and there is a captivity that is involved in the debtor he's in a captivity now the one who has been offended the one who makes the offering he releases that that cat or the one who's in debt he releases the dismissal well the next one we come to is in ephesians 4 32 that you've read uh is to give an unconditional favor and that's 23 times in the new testament and that's the cap the capacity of the offended because we are uh born again we have the capacity to forgive unconditionally in view of what christ has done at the cross and how god has forgiven us through christ so those three areas are really what forgiveness is we say i can't forgive that what we are saying is that there are certain sins that god cannot forgive you know that's that to me that's that's uh have you had someone say i can't forgive them what they're saying is god had there are certain sins that god cannot forgive that's how striking it is in the very basic context so we make these brash statements we think we're tough no we're actually in a sense blaspheming great character work of god himself on james 3 verses 11 and 12 the same principle applies you become a law or a god unto yourself you're saying that there's something greater in you than there is in god that you can withhold forgiveness from that brother that's serious blasphemy let's uh let's touch on the security of our forgiveness before we get into this practical too heavy what is the security can we be forgiven today lose our forgiveness tomorrow how does this all work when we sin do we need to be forgiven again how does this all work and now we're talking positionally here the security of our forgiveness this is under the strength of god's their sins and their iniquities will they not remember it anymore and there's the question of course how do people um is is forgiving the same thing as forgiving and it's not because it's on the strength of god's will this is something that you will not you will not remember he's not forgiving but will not remember in relation to the uh positional forgiveness and dealing with our sinners called uh um penal forgiveness you know or the judgment due to our sin that is what the lord jesus has done satisfied god the cross paid the uh the the debt release on the payment of his shed blood we are we are we are released when we come to first john you know if we confess our sin he is faithful and just to forgive us our sin and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness is paternal in the family forgiveness the relationship is still there one forms a relationship in relation to judgment there's pain through christ on our salvation that forms a relationship and nothing in this world or the world to come can take us from it's ours forever but the other is at paternal it's within the family the sins that we do that cause uh our our father's heart to be grieved as it were you know we acknowledge that was sin that i did there's that paternal forgiveness and thought how does he forgive us to the same person that saved us to begin with so you hear the question or the maybe the argument from a different circles that's presumption how can you say that you're forgiven the authority again is the word of god it's all from god it's yet it is on what god who god is and what he has done and or the person of christ being resurrected it's it's done forever it's done and it isn't it isn't that we're being presumptuous it's we're resting on the holy word of god that's unchangeable they don't understand that they can't see that pray they will someday but it our forgiveness is rock solid in order for us to ever lose forgiveness christ would have to leave heaven leave the throne the devotional thought though our lord sat down with the right hand of the majesty and high and he has wounds in his body from calvary it's a devotional thought but yet it's a doctrinal thought father looks at him and i am accepted in the blood there's a security because of the complete and total satisfaction of god like the public and praise god be merciful to me the center what he was actually saying as an israelite is god be merciful to me upon the grounds of the bloodshed of unmerciful and that work of christ was complete god's satisfaction he's that great hand of god that's our security because god is satisfied brother paul if a believer sins do they have to ask god for forgiveness to say uh please forgive me for this first uh first john one doesn't say we have to ask for forgiveness he asked for a confession so we confess what we're doing is agreeing with god who has already made the statement it is said we come we agree with him and on that agreement is well said the beauty of the forgiveness is enjoyed again i just asked that for clarification of what forgiveness is should we need to believe we're here from position standpoint we do not have to ask for forgiveness of sins but when we send there's an expectation of our confessional statement for reinstatement of community right how long do we have to wait before after we confess to enjoy communion 15 minutes 15 minutes it's instantaneous isn't it or it could be we are very religious creatures and so we think well god that was such a bad sin i'm gonna have to punish myself for a week and we put ourself under a certain type of penance and what we're saying is blood of christ isn't quite valuable enough i have to add my part too that's how religious we really are as individuals i bring that up because they're i have met christians and they are living under an umbrella of dread not knowing what is available to them it's not to think lightly of sin that is absolutely just not that's not the point it's to think rightly of it it's to think rightly of what sin is and what god has done to deal with our sin and we when we understand that it's it's confession and that it's immediate enjoyment of that community again would you say that it would be the ownership of the sin and ownership of the guilt and that ownership of god's provision that he has done to take care to satisfy this divine justice that the blood of christ never will lose its value it's a continual cleansing forever it's what keeps us in the light is what keeps us in fellowship with god positionally speaking it's not based on me it's based on my god of sacrifice satisfied with him as son that's where expiation comes in that's something old testament didn't know about the total absolute putting away from the very mind of god any concept of sin in that believer spot judicially speaking that's why i can come to him when i sin and confess it and it's taken care of me immediately that's what gives me the security and i can do that what encouraged me about doing stuff is 113 in whom i also after that you believe you're sealed by that holy spirit of promise until when so i think will i do wrong no until the redemption of the church's position my brother and i are coming to a key and important first is related to our security word security just brings to my mind peace and rest and safety it's all in that purity in the verse that they're quoting is the blood of jesus christ active sacrifice cleansing that's an important test cleansing from all sin that's past present and future it has cleansed me it keeps on cleansing me i was raised in a christian hall i never took the name of lord in vain but there are people that have been otherwise there's still the power in the blood it cleanses their mind from the guilt of a past life christ has that power and we don't need to confess it over and over again god says confess it if you confess it 10 times 100 times you never heard your last 99 times it doesn't say that if we confess our sins uh we are faithful and just it says he is he is so he does this what we are doing is we are relying on him and that's what he wants he wants us to rely on him he is still the source he is still the source always will be so is there any question that on on that first point of our position are we all clear on that are we all enjoying that before we move on because if we're not enjoying this we might as well keep here till we all are enjoying this god the source in his love the lord jesus christ the sacrifice the blood that was shed the payment the propitiation the security that we have in him and the power of his endless life brotherness rock solid to guarantee our forgiveness so if we're all clear on that move on to the next section about god reaching out to humanity through us the personal the microscope knowing that the work has been accomplished i want to look at the preaching of forgiveness and the receiving of forgiveness and there's different verses listed there because they talk about different things and if some brother could help us on that it'd be greatly appreciated the first one is in luke chapter three this is about the preaching of forgiveness and we'll go down there's just three or four of these they're a bit different luke chapter three we'll just jump in at verse three and he came into all the country about jordan preaching the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins so how does this verse affect us today what does it mean to us what did it mean to them someone differentiate please what this verse is telling us what is repentance repentance is a change of a change of thought first of all it's releasing a change of attitude so does this verse apply to us in our preaching i guess is my question the answer of course is no we don't preach the baptism of repentance so how does this affect it it is written in the new testament just to clarify for us what this meant in the context well if you look at that word for the remission of sins it's unto the remission of sins so it seems to be still looking forward to some sacrifice that would put away sins right so it's a view of a coming at the coming messiah carry the weight of the lord he's saying that there are those uh that are going to recognize their unworthiness to be in that kingdom and they're going to acknowledge i have sins and i need to repent of them i need to i need to acknowledge i am unworthy to be in this kingdom this coming kingdom of which the messiah is going to set it up and so how they outwardly acknowledge that by the baptism unto repentance that's why the lord when he was baptized heaven had to be open this is no sinner like the rest of these people that are baptized unto repentance this is he is absolutely different this is my beloved son who might well please no need for repentance with them he's so he's totally distinct we on the other hand we preach repentance why because there needs to be establishment of a relationship with a god whom we have offended see there's two aspects of forgiveness one is to is to confess or repent repent is the right word in view of establishing a relationship with the person we've offended and the other is the person has to have an attitude to forgive the one who has been offended isn't this the baptism of john here back with john and we read about uh apparently maybe acts 19 where there were a few that had john's baptism baptism that these people participated in denying their judaism and their association with the christ which uh soon become profound didn't last very long we get a little clarification don't we in acts 19 that we don't get in the passage of this read acts 19 verse 4 then said paul john barely baptized with the baptism of repentance saying unto the people that they should believe on him which should come after him that is on christ jesus so he was preaching christ for the remission of sins this baptism signified their willingness to receive the one who could take away their sins what's your connotation of baptism is that identification identification believers baptism would be identification with the person of christ yeah that's what the old jesuit saints when they brought a sacrifice they put their hand on that sacrifice they're identifying with that sacrifice that that animal was dying for me that's all how god can accept it they came back year after year for one reason they still have conscience of sin you read that in hebrews i think chapter four but we don't we can come now because our sins are forgiven you're talking before about relationship and fellowship when you're born into the family of god you're in there because of relationship when you sin and act on your own behalf to satisfy yourself that has to do with your behavior and that has to do with your fellowship that's what you can lose your fellowship but you got to regain that by confessing good point you cannot cannot lose your relationship that's right so chapter four of luke these are the words of the lord jesus verse 18 the spirit of the lord is upon me because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor he has sent me to heal the brokenhearted to preach deliverance to the captives the covering of sight to the blind to set at liberty them are bruised to preach the acceptable year of the lord and the word forgiveness is in there a couple times in different forms but anyway i guess my point in doing this is that we understand in the day and age in which we live how to preach the gospel we don't preach the gospel as far as the baptism of john but when we preach the forgiveness of sins it's always through the blood of christ the remissions of the sins through his blood now here's the lord jesus and this is what why he was sent to heal the brokenhearted to preach deliverance to the captives i think that's one of them and then the senate liberty is the other one that forgiveness is identified with we won't spend much time there chapter 24 verse 47 verse 46 thus it is written and thus it behoove christ to suffer and to rise from the dead to third day and that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations beginning at jerusalem and ye are witnesses of these things so then is this really the beginning of the gospel that we preach the lord jesus is giving the commission to go and preach the remission of sins in his name the basis of his death and resurrection that precedes the and forgiveness the pharisees they said who can forgive sin but god only so the authority of the name the lord jesus who is god he's able to forgive sin on the basis of repentance and repentance and remission should sin should be preached in his name or on the authority of his name so acts 13 would be then that through this man has preached unto you the forgiveness of sins lovely verses so now what about the reception the receiving of forgiveness they would just continue on x 13 there because we don't go out and preach you're all forgiven by him all that believe are justified from all things and so there there must be that personal faith to bring us into the good of we preach forgiveness is possible to all based on the death burial resurrection of grace but the only ones who come into the good of that forgiveness are those who believe acts 10 verse 43 that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins so faith is through faith right i was thinking repentance towards god and faith towards our lord jesus christ what i think the word repentance i think of the ownership of guilt like the people on the cross he says to the young one we received the dual reward of our deeds he's owned at that point there was a change of mind change in his position like once he was a mocker about each other now he's taken sides against himself and says forget what we rightly deserve he's owned his guilt he owned that god is just that he's in the place of justice right where he's happy and now and he fears god and now he's now he needs forgiveness and the lord jesus came to assurance that he was by his word so when i when i see joseph all right when i say that they can next vote 24 or loop 24 of they preach repentance and remission of sins that the day we live in ownership of of judgment that i deserve seems to be something that people don't really want to take okay then we have and thus we have a result of easy believism i see myself as guilty now i have a problem so in our gospel preaching what dangers do you see you see anything creeping in among us that we should address right now um preaching preaching against sin i mean people you could you could use the law people use the law to preach to preach that this is what's right now this is where you offend it and you have to own guilty guilty as charged so what we're saying then is basically people need to understand their position in the sight of god before they're saved as lost as condemned as guilty before they can ever be saved two dangers would be one would be uh preaching just that you need to be a follower of christ i hear that a lot from people that uh i don't necessarily have comments that they're saved they say they're followers of christ and the other one would be a over dependence on the choice on the word choice which you have a choice and you have to make a choice in that you go in for salvation salvation is not a choice and sometimes we need to hear a whole dependence on it's your choice to be saved it's not it's a it's your choice to strive to enter in but it's it's god who does the saving if it was based upon your choice you can use it like that what i've seen in my experiences is that uh the wrong way to present the gospel is just talking about the love of god because that won't bring repentance it's got to be the law is preached which will convict a sinner of their own need and then the other thing that i see in the world around us today in the western hemisphere anyway is this prosperity gospel that if you come to jesus everything is going to be great and so timothy was exhorted to preach the word and do the work of an evangelist and so we stay on those grounds where he did his promise i have one problem brother and then you hear it sometimes in the gospel you only have to commit one sin to keep you out of heaven that's not true that sin has already been committed in the garden and i sinned because i'm a sinner but i've heard that over and over again yeah don't know yeah you're going to send me you said you're born sir yeah yet the lord said i have not appointed you unto wrath but to obtain salvation one thing you gotta remember when you're preaching the gospel it's the holy spirit that does the work i remember talking to minor hawk many years ago when i first met him because i used to meet people that say to me doc don't talk to me about the bible because i don't believe it so i got disgusted and i wouldn't say anything so i went to and i talked to minor hawk i remember one night over a blue river and i asked him that question what do you do if they don't believe it he said to me he says it don't make any difference whether they believe it or not you preach it it's the holy spirit and it's god that's going to save them my our obligation is to preach the gospel the death barrel the resurrection of the lord jesus christ now the spirit of god does the convicting we read that in john's gospel that's a function of the holy spirit of god is convicted of sin of racism judgment so it's in his hands it's our responsibility to sow the seed that's right and you'll run into fertile ground and you run into bare ground and you run into all kinds of ground that's not our responsibility that's not our responsibility just go out there preach the word when you read about people that sometimes they get offended and people say well i don't like to talk so because i might offend them i tell them what did they do with the apostle paul they stoned him and everything when he got done preaching and we get upset because somebody says we don't like it so we gotta go out and preach the gospel and understand but remember it's ask the spirit of god to do the work and he'll do it when you're preaching and when you're preaching you'll find people that are ready to be saved and some that don't care but maybe they'll care later on you never know when you when you hear about people hearing the word of god sometimes they're offended but maybe three four years later they'll come back and they'll hear the gospel and get saved so you don't know how god's going to work just go out there and preach the word part of preaching the gospel is preaching repentance and forgiveness but they have to be told what they need to repent of why do i need to repent so sin has to be brought into the gospel it has to be and if they're offended because of it here's what mr crosswood said years ago i'm glad that i was offended when i heard the gospel amen you better be offended because you offended a holy and a righteous god but it's not my place to try to make them feel that offense like brother paul said he sold the seed of the gospel and let the spirit of god do his work so we got about a half an hour left and there's several questions here that have been handed me and i felt obligated to put them on the list here uh we're getting to practical forgiveness now we understand that what god has done for us we understand the work of christ we understand how forgiveness is preached we understand it's received by faith now how do we put it in practice as believers we're going to switch gears here we're going to put it in shoe leather what does god expect of us in our relationships with one another i guess that's the way to make the statement the one question is uh does my brother have to repent before i can forgive him or my sister before i forgive her now these are all good questions and i hope as we go through this practical part how do i word this we get rid of the bitter spirits among us there's a lot of us today and we hold grudges and there's a lot of garbage we hang on to and i hope by the end of this little half an hour we're able to understand how god would have us to deal with this this is very serious stuff because there's nothing really that'll destroy you quicker your brother your sister than a critical spirit maintaining a bitter spirit is like drinking the poison and expecting the other waiting for the other guy to die i'm gonna put it that way think of that that's exactly it so this will help us in enjoying our salvation this will help us in enjoying one another this will help us in our assemblies this will help us in our gospel this will help us in our worship this will help us in every aspect of life if we can really understand and so we need much help on this hand we keep in mind that as we talk about this today every one of us will be tempted on it so well brandon also to help move this forward a little i think there's a personal one-on-one forgiveness and then there's also the acknowledgement in terms of assembly fellowship as an example just to start it there was a man who was he hurt me badly after i was saved and he never asked for forgiveness and he died five years later did you tell him that he had hurt you um no i didn't but he knew he had these others had told him but the point i'm getting at but here's the point i'm getting at you see what happened was uh i was only saved a little while and i prayed for that man first it was the prayer that uh because of the anger in my heart but i prayed for five years till the lord took him in the last three three and a half years i loved that man like a brother no he didn't know it because when i would approach him he wouldn't accept but he never ever acknowledged what he had done and yet through it all he was totally forgiven what i learned was this if i would have not forgiven this man i would have put myself behind bars in my own little jail cells and the bars would have been the bars of resentment and i would have been captive to that feeling so i had liberty through christ when i through the holy spirit had power to forgive him and then then it opened up as a blessing i prayed i got to know his family his grandchildren is everybody around his life even the place he worked for i prayed for all those people anyway enough said before we start let's remember this again really what we are this is where it starts we've been forgiven so much so much so let's keep that in mind as we continue our discussion let's read another verse here the same verse you put a brand and i'll just be part of it our tender hearted forgiving one another even as god for christ's sake have forgiven you brethren where do any of us have room for conditional forgiveness does that fall anywhere in our new testament conditional if we are doing that what are we doing we are sinning that is sin to hold conditional forgiveness i can't i i cannot i will not forgive him that is sin to do something but just call it what it is but it's so much easier to be a spectator and a critic to somebody than it is to go on and advance and learn about things and sometimes that stubbornness within you will like cal said you know just put bars up for you so you have to learn not to be a spectator and a critic you have to give people the benefit of the doubt and you have to question them about their motives before you go hurting the holy spirit or your relationship with him verse 30 of season four we agree the spirit of god as a grieving cross we agree the spirit of god coming with this conditional forgiveness of others because we we are associating uh the name of the lord jesus to to our gathering to uh to uh in our life in matthew 18 the two aspects of forgiveness are are in that section the first part of uh before matthew 18 20 which we all love is the man who has trespassed against us you go to the individual one-on-one and you say you've sinned against me and here there's the acknowledgement or the need to be forgiven to acknowledge i need to be forgiven after matthew 18 and 20 it's a man who has he's owed 10 000 talents and he's forgiven and he comes he takes the man by the neck well just 20 bucks and he comes into gravity pay me what you owe me here's a man who won't forgive so we have before the name of the lord is mentioned the need to acknowledge i need to be forgiven after the name of the lord is mentioned i need to i need to acknowledge i i have to forgive who's in the name of the lord jesus christ so when our we have an unforgiving spirit we are dishonoring the name of the lord jesus christ if we if we say i don't need to be forgiven i haven't done anything wrong we are saying i am dishonoring the name of the lord jesus christ it's about the name of the lord jesus that's how serious this is in contrasting that with the apostle peter he said the lord i have sinned you know and there's that one that had been given so much and yet he could not find forgiveness within his heart so then when we come to luke 17 where it talks about if he repented forgive him how do we put the balance onto what we've just said brother you've asked a very good question does my brother have to repent before i'm forgiven and going back to genesis chapter 50 i think we can agree that the brethren of joseph really didn't truly experience forgiveness until they come and ask for it but five chapters earlier joseph had expressed that forgiveness to them so he was willing to offer forgiveness long before they asked for it and they came and asked for it and finally could rest isn't that the way it is with god that he is already prepared to forgive all we have to do is ask and then we are forgiven and it ought to be that way with us in our personal relationships as well that i'm ready to forgive i've already done that in my heart because too often we say i'm not going to forgive until that brother repents that's withholding forgiveness that's not preparing for it and when you've done that in your heart then you're free yes you don't have to live in remorse and regret and bitterness and anguish no more but as soon as that brother comes and says hey i'm sorry hey that that is you've gained your brother that is just a smile on your face and say it's been dealt with five years ago brother thanks for coming though i love you to death that brother then he he then enters into the blessing of more forgiveness he can't enter into that until he repents but yet the forgiveness is there and if he never comes in repentance you've still dealt with it in your own soul and you can move on and the individual who is holding on for on repentance they they're like in the tormentors they're they're tormented things are just not right in your life and they are they are hindered in their spiritual development because they are not acting like christ so then when it comes to forgiveness who is it really for is it for the one that has been offended or is it for the one that did the offending or both it's for both and it's for testimonies but this this is very practical i'm glad you mentioned that but i want to talk to believers who have gone through divorces i want to talk to believers who have been hurt at work or in other parts of your life these principles are true that forgiving the party that offended you is at the basis of uh successful enjoyment of fellowship with god we have spiritual examples in our new testament of people who knew that the offenders would not come and repent but it did not stop them from forgiving having a forgiving spirit to begin with well we all we the lord jesus was one father forgive them for they know not what they do he had the attitude of forgiveness even though he knew that they were going to come and repent at that point uh the steven in act seven uh the apostle paul in uh second timothy chapter four i think it is he didn't want those things laid to their charge why because he in his heart he had forgiven but the relationship couldn't develop until there was repentance see and that's just like a relationship with god cannot start until there's repentance in our part in a relationship amongst brethren cannot develop or continue to develop until there's repentance of that sin or that guilt so really what we're saying is forgiveness can happen on with one person but it's two for reconciliation that's even yes very well two for the two for the relationship to develop there's uh god for christ's sake i've forgiven you so that's back to the beginning of the bible god is a sword god forgives sin but i think i'm right when i say this god cannot undo what's done but he can forgive that's true the story of brother gold about someone died i think this is right uh we know the name wb by someone did something in his life that was very detrimental must have been to his character or whatever when he was dying mr vine the man come to him and pleaded and begged for his gift mr vine forgiven then he said i have something i want you to do he said i just want to do it took the pill open the pill full of feathers now you take it to window and you open it up he did this the feathers were gone over he said now what you have done to me they can never be repaired it's like the feathers they don't see so we cannot do we have to be careful and we don't offend people that's it reflects back to us i know uh prickly others to say but when it comes to god and his forgiveness how can we come to a real forgiveness in our lives i've had unsafe people and i know people said this why can't god just forgive me out of pure love i'm sure you are brother not we're not talking about a wishy-washy forgiveness because we're repentance we can zero in on that i could tell you about my repentance but when it comes to why can't god just forgive me i'm pure love if he could the problem is i can't forgive myself now why is that because in my past there's others here that would tell me for sure my past is polluted it is stained by sins i can't forgive myself what happened i come to the cross i can't understand it i can't explain it that's why i got saved see god mr hamilton you say a seeking sinner seeking saviors through me god wants to meet you at calvary to forgive your sins and he's standing beneath the cross there's something about that word it's a healing balm as i stand beneath the cross and the crisis in my place and the forgiveness of sin floods my soul to me it's the sweetest word in all the language forgiveness i have a question did you say that um joseph's brothers wanted to be forgiven no that they that joseph wanted to forgive them oh yeah five chapters before they asked for it yeah and i think i'm glad you brought that up because i think in our interpersonal relationships as husband and wife and my wife's sitting next to me so i'm about to expose myself here we sometimes have an incapacity to forgive those that have offended us that are closest to us right away we have to brood on it we have to we have to you know and the worst thing that can happen is when the other party in the in the relationship my wife comes to me and is willing to acknowledge what's gone wrong and i'm not ready to forgive because then then the whole thing just snowballs and then i'm the one that needs to come to her and acknowledge how hard-hearted i've been and it's just ridiculous so the best time i understand i'm gonna get i'm gonna hear about this later the best time for me to acknowledge that i need to forgive her or she needs to forgive me is right away right and that takes us back to genesis chapter one god said right the first prophecy ever recorded was uh to the lord jesus speaking to the serpent saying the seed of the shall produce i had provision for for uh for forgiveness being made right there so you could say you profited a lot more for forgiveness than not on let me a long ride home so would it help us to understand if we just ask is forgiveness a feeling or is it a fact it's a fact that brings a feeling sometimes but what happens when you think you've forgiven someone and all of a sudden you hate them again i'm not you haven't forgiven have you forgiven if you haven't forgotten is it important i'll brand finish your thought i'm sorry well my thought is this i can forgive someone and still have a feeling because we're not god and we do not have the power to put it in this in the sea of our forgetfulness so i can forgive someone and in three months time that thought might pop up in my head but the whole point of forgiveness is fact it's like love love is not a feeling love it's a choice and when i have when i have chosen to forgive someone and that feeling comes back that doesn't mean that they're not unforgiven it just meant that you're feeling come back what do you think of that that true false indifferent what do you think probably the flesh okay that's not right right but does that still mean they're not forgiven or does that mean they're forgiven you're forgiven but you gotta remember when you when you got saved you died right now i'm talking interpersonal here i'm talking with against my the life we now live is christ in us and we can't uh we can't forgive anybody unless it's christ in us it doesn't the same way i used to have a hard time with the verses that the love the lord your god with all your heart soul mind and tell love your neighbor yourself and i said to myself that's humanly impossible then i found out it's christ in me that doesn't and that makes a world of that's why paul could say i crucified with christ nevertheless i live yet not i but christ liveth in me in the life i now live i live out by the faith of who the son of god who loved me and died for me and that's what you got to understand if you get in order to forgive people it's christ and forgives them and then you you've forgiven and then you have the bad feelings three months now you ascend against another other individual could we let paul finish that thought before we get away how is that because you you have you have forgiven and you have released them from a repayment of an obligation to you so you've released them from that that obligation you have released them to god okay i guess what i'm thinking is just say you're in the cross i'm in ontario and i've forgiven you for something there's nothing and i say okay i'm gonna forgive paul and all of a sudden out of the middle of nowhere it pops up in my head that rascal paul you know how does that how does that fit i you know i'm not gonna hold i'm holding you i've released you from all responsibility but that thought just come back out of the middle of nowhere you know but i thought it was done if that thought has no basis no right basis then your thought is is a simple one and then you need to confess that and move on further take it to a higher level i've heard the word release here and that's that's very good you release someone and in addition to that you show kindness to them you show love to them now if we are in fact involved in the spirit of god and every single believer here believe that then with an exercise before god we should be willing to get into the presence of god and pray for that person to whom we may have a problem with not only pray for them but to show kindness toward them and if we really get sincere about this i i think our problem of wrong thoughts cropping up will really this is the spirit of god is able to accomplish that course again if it's something we're trying to do on our own then we need to uh look godward and and uh put an feel like this was done before god and to pray for that believer you know the people you pray for it's pretty hard to uh have hard feelings and then every opportunity show kindness to them and i think that might help us that's what i was saying earlier jim people you pray for it's hard to have hard feelings against them that if there is a magical or it's a divine principle that's better choice of words it's a divine principle it really works another thing with this thing copying up is really an act of carnality it's nothing to do with that which is spiritual and the power of the spirit of god working with it is trying to accomplish what he wants to accomplish you know i've come to the end of chapter four trying to get get control of them again trying to get them back we produced them now we want to get them back because that's the power that's not related to forgiveness anyway shape or form right say brandon serious anymore at this point but what if i got one more yep what what about if where does the where does the breach of trust have been into this someone has offended you and you forgive them does that mean that you have that everything is like it never happened before or has the trust been breached and the trust need to be reestablished yeah i don't have to trust him i have to forgive but i don't have to trust bernie wants shame on me or shame on you that's what experience is yeah that is something i want to pick up my brother dave osborne i've worked with him in the children's work for 24 years and there's young men on the board we learned lessons they used to have hard feelings against him and he'd have hard feelings against me and sometimes you don't even know why you have hard feelings i don't know if that makes sense but that's what happened but you know what we learned and i want this is what i want you to understand sometimes um just going to be and he would do it to me likewise but saying words like you know i don't know who's right or wrong in this situation but if i've done anything to offend you i i'm sorry you know and i tell you that that works and i just leave it at that yes you can't you can't bring the scrambled eggs back together again and you can't no trust it seems like a deceptiveness though if we say i forgive but uh no trust there's there's some kind of deception that's lurking in your brother it doesn't in some way it does but the same code my friend said to you if i burn you twice if i burn you once there's a it's going to take you a while before you can trust me with it with your checkbook and all of a sudden it's empty you're not going to hand me your checkbook again well those are practical things but i was listening to ewayne and i think it's a good question but i was thinking of joseph again who there may be more of course the lord jesus is a higher example but look what his brethren did to him and how he ended up loving him showing his love so i think that's the thing even if the other person doesn't repent and keep on pouring out the sin against you just to continue and the lord's as believers of this age are called for a higher level our goals should be the forgiveness of god which is on display in week 15 when the father receives the son back and receives him back as a son as in some way more of a son than he ever was before and if you look at that as the children of promise and song but that is the forgiveness that we should be going it's never going to be perfect we can never forgive somebody with that full trust but god can't to go back to the story of joseph lately joseph had had the moral right he had the physical right and he had he was the second leader of the most powerful country in the world so he had the uh the world right to put his brother to death and really he would have gained in power in the world by doing it because he would have said this is what my brothers didn't mean and that's what they got and the whole world would have feared him and yet what does he do he cries and he and he seeks their love and he forgives him in a way that when they come to him this five chapters later he's almost like upset that they haven't received the forgiveness that he had for them see so it was full and free and and it was i mean it's very the reason joseph is because of how well that's displayed there in that story of how he actually forgave them completely it takes it takes more moral fiber to forgive them than it does to hold your trust now this is in terms of the picture uh when there's a fault between two one won't acknowledge the other one won't acknowledge and you're wrong no you're wrong and it can't seem to get to a climax in the first Corinthians it says okay now why why don't you take the wrong mama if you take the wrong even though you may be right why do you not rather suffer yourself to be wrong so go to the brother or sister to tell you the moment so how do we know when we've truly forgiven someone let's be very clear on this this is a vital issue how do we know when we have truly forgiven someone in a hypocritical way we pray for them and show kindness to them with all regard as to how they respond to them so when their name comes up in the Bible and they're in the church and they're in the synagogue and they're in the there's no there's no rise of that in your seniors in your heart there you just you've been released and so there's no animosity there's there's nothing i had a real problem in this i'll be i'll be walking in there's a there's a man who cost me tens of thousands of dollars and there's a man who's sitting in this room right now that i was talking to this about and you know he told me point blank look me right in the eyes all i think you need to forget that man and i didn't like it at that time when he told me i think the brother knows where who he is and uh he left and i can take you to the spot in my place on a package of lumber where i had to bow in tears in repentance and a confession before god and i and i released that man to god now his name came up later it didn't bring a gritting my teeth i did pray for him i did thank the best of them because i had forgiven him and i tell you that that was it was the most joyful thing in my soul is to be able to bow and forgive the man who cost me tens of thousands of dollars but before that time out and you could do that when you pray did you say to the lord can you help this idiotic fool to come to a census because we say that if we pray for people well sometimes our attitude towards the prayer isn't correct neither oh i i did not pray that way actually when you pray you keep on praying until you're in the mind of great okay that's what that's what god doesn't change your attitude change yeah that's it he changes you that's right that's what you want so at what point do you return business with him uh i never used cod you know like that's what we're talking about here they're all forgiveness thing and when you got off the point you trust the person again and you say you've forgiven them but like do you still protect yourself and not continue business or do you show the forgiveness that we're talking about and attempt to do business again i wasn't able to to do any business but went out of business and went into something totally different but i did meet him again and it was a matter of a handshake a warm handshake and conversation there was there was honestly there was no animosity in my heart toward him and it wasn't me that did it because i would have i would have so brandon you have a question here i think it's an important one how can we preach while holding an unforgiving spirit towards our brethren so just going on if there's a residue that of resentment in my heart against the brethren that's the context here i think this was a question the other thing that i want to say what you brought up right at the beginning there let me digress we not only deserve the wrath of god but we actually deserve to be in hell in the lake of fire right now not when we die the wrath of god was deserving the first moment we came to acknowledge in our own sin and god's long suffering allowed us so the forgiveness that you brought up earlier where we've been totally forgiven so if we go and i grab something by the throat it's on us you know we that that penalty is what we deserve right now like we should be there right now that's one of the ways that you look by other's faults is i'm not helping you lord thank you it's very easy to see when you feel it in the context thank you no i want to go back to this question and then i have a comment if nobody else comments how can we preach while holding an unforgiving spirit towards our brethren are you aggrieved with the holy spirit you can't preach in the in the power of the spirit you can preach in the flesh you get along pretty good you got a lot of earth you can memorize you can fool everybody but you know that you're alone up there that's right and if the brethren in my assembly know that i have an unforgiving spirit they should not allow me to preach on the platform nor should they allow me to pray publicly 1st Timothy 2 and 8 makes it clear pray with holy hands with all one's heart that's how you pray in the spirit if i have an unforgiving spirit toward my brethren there should be no public place for me in the assembly until i get cleared up you know the scripture paul brought matthew 18 really is i should go to my brother and then with the idea of winning my brother that's the attitude and uh duane mentioned earlier did i go to that man well he wouldn't give me any time of day i would like to have gone to him but sometimes you can't go to the man because he won't see you just keep praying there's a divine order because our brethren have chosen that choice for all of us as we keep moving for a review and learning of forgiveness and repentance luke is an excellent reader which is in the gospel of luke and then he comes in the book of acts and luke is the writer of facts and he speaks of repentance and he makes it clear that repentance always precedes salvation and he makes it clear that tacitus how come he got saved so quickly as he said where there's genuine repentance there'll be immediate response but the lord on the cross and luke says that he said forgive them so i would say before how can you preach it i don't know how you do that unless tell me because it's really a contradiction the only way i can generally forgive a person is by standing beneath the cross and when i do that i can do it and paul said i preach christ crucified we're preaching christ crucified and christ redeems us we stand beneath the cross so brandon is time for a break the question is i can forgive but i can't forget a christ honoring what's your thoughts on that because i've heard it out how many times i can forgive but i cannot forget what they did all right can i jump in with a little practical yes if i'm not inclined to forget then i'm inclined to rescind my forgiveness if i dwell on what that person has done to me that puts my forgiveness in jeopardy and i think god choosing not to remember is perhaps the best way to put it i have to make an effort and believe me it's a hard one sometimes i have to make an effort not to dwell on the things that people have done to me because i have extended forgiveness and so i can't go there that has to be compartmentalized and put away just the way god has put it away god can't forget anything but he can't choose not to remember is there a distinguishing mark between not forgetting or is there a difference between not forgetting and not having confidence in a person yeah i think i don't know if that's directed at me but the record of scripture says that the lord jesus who is god and god is a forgiving god did not entrust himself to certain people because he knew what was in the man so there's a difference between forgiveness and trust right yeah of course you see forgetting is what we should do but having confidence that has to be regained this is that anybody in the south wing with anybody one quick question how often should we forgive well i remember peter said until seven times and the lord said until 70 times seven and want to quickly share a thought i appreciated with that one time and i've never heard it expressed but the lord jesus in his wisdom there 70 times 7 is 490 and there's 483 prophetic years completed there's seven years left he was talking to a hebrew the church will be raptured in that 490 years it'll be the day of the lord and there'll be no more sin no more need for forgiveness so that to me is endless we should always forgive lifetime of forgiveness until he comes