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 Francis Chan

 2010/4/10 8:08

Joined: 2006/11/7
Posts: 1178

 Re: Francis Chan

Hello codek,

Although I love Francis Chan because the Lord has really been emphasizing living the sermon on the mount to me, I would suggest anything George Warnock has written because it gives it all such great balance. Here is the link where you can read all of his books online:


 2010/4/10 8:32Profile

Joined: 2004/7/7
Posts: 7504

 Re: Francis Chan

The same affect has been happening when I listen to Paul Washer.

Perhaps you have not listened to enough of Paul Washer's sermons? I never picked up what you saying about Washer.

Salvation means you have been redeemed from a lifestyle of sin to serve an holy God. God cannot tolerate sin and this is one of the jobs of the Holy Spirit. His job is to convict you in these areas so you can more effectively serve the LORD.

My thoughts...

Sandra Miller

 2010/4/10 8:46Profile

Joined: 2009/1/21
Posts: 1564
Locport, Illinois


Washer believes that the person is regenerated by the holy spirit first which then they willingly repent and believe the gospel,in his sermons he speaks of the fruits or a changed life continually proving their salvation, but know one reallyy knows who is saved we can only look and say it looks as if that person is saved or it looks like they are not, that person might know but we will never know. The scriptures are pretty clear that we must repent of our sins turn from our wicked ways and believe the gospel,that repenting is probably first begins in the heart and mind and later will be shown if true to be in your daily walk as a professing christian.Repentance and faith go together because when you turn to Christ for salvation you our repenting knowing you can't live the same way anymore and don't want to.

John Beechy

 2010/4/10 10:20Profile

Joined: 2005/11/26
Posts: 496

 Re: Francis Chan

I think I know what you mean, Codek.

Most repentance preacher preach more about sin/false conversion than they do about faith and helping the Saints receive God's promises that is needed to help them overcome the world.

I know there are many false converts, but it seems that many preacher focus on ministering to false converts than the Saints(I can understand having to preach more like that if you preach at a Benny Hinn conference or one of the many harloty churches). So the Saints are not being really ministered too. It seems that Paul was more worried about ministering to saints than false converts in the church. If their truly His sheep we can have confidence that if we preach life and remind them of God's great promises that His sheep will hear and help them overcome their struggles. Not that we don't ever point out sin and help them see their lukewarmness, but remember not to leave them in sin and remind them of God awesome promises helping them again to haive faith in these things that will help them to overcome and live victorious!

Most sheep struggle because they have forgotten who they are in Christ.

The churches in the bible seem to have forgotten quickly who they were in Christ and the promises of God that Paul had to remind them a lot of it. When we forget who we are in Christ we easily fall back to works, being under law, bound in bondage again, fallen from grace. (Galation). We start focuses inward and seeing all our weaknesses instead of looking to Jesus and remembering that He's our righteosness, our perfection and as we believe on these promises of God and remebering that Jesus has overcome the world for us and we have victory in Christ we will naturally start to overcome all things. It doesn't become works anymore!

When we see ourselves going through works again, being under law, struggling its because we are too inward focus and have lost the simplicity of really believing Jesus.

How do we attain faith again that overcomes the world- Knowing HIM (2Peter). Meditate on His promises for His Saints and remember what Christ did for us on the Cross and that through His ressurection we have been given power/life to overcome-Praise the Lord!

1 John 5:4......And this is the victory that has overcome the world- OUR FAITH.

God Bless, Lisa


 2010/4/10 12:37Profile

Joined: 2006/6/19
Posts: 927



Listen to Paul Washer's "You are Dearly Loved by God" (it is here on SermonIndex) for the other side of Paul Washer. It will greatly encourage you.

With care in Christ...

Taylor Otwell

 2010/4/10 14:10Profile

Joined: 2009/6/25
Posts: 34


Hi Codek,

If you are worried others are preaching works base salvation and are concerned about your salvation you need to be on your knees asking the Holy Spirit to assure you through his word and not listen to preachers.

Hi Lisa,

As for Paul Wahsher we probably don't get to hear all his messages at his home church, all the times he speaks at Bible studies, etc.. so to say he seems to emphasize on false conversion might not be true.But even if he did focus on it, let him speak as God leads him.
God raises modern prophets at the right time to communicate his message. How many Paul Washer's are there today? His voice needs to be heard, especially if God has given that message to him. You can listen to other preachers who you want for an encouraging message. Most prophets of old had what would seem negative ministry, but it was needed at the right time.

In love

 2010/4/10 16:58Profile

Joined: 2005/11/26
Posts: 496


Hi truthinlove,

Did I say it was Paul Washer? I did not even have Washer in mind.

I said a lot of repentance preachers. I did not name names.

I understand the prophets of old preaching hard words. I'm not against hard words if needed. Even the old prophets balance God's message with reminding Isreal of God's precious promises and great love/mercy for them too. I believe we need both. Not just one without the other. But, it seems a lot of messages are more focus on sin than faith. So you have a lot of the sheep focusing on more than the other leading too unhealthy inward focus and fleshly striving, always looking at themselves than Jesus. Now, in the New Covenant we have greater promises, grace abound, we can believe in and overcome! Thanks to Jesus our Savior!!!


 2010/4/10 18:02Profile


 2010/4/11 5:05



I only heard about maybe 7 sermons from Paul Washer. You are right! I need to listen to more and I will do when I get some more time. Thanks.

Just to give you a heads up, I think I listened to over 200 sermons in the last 6 months.

 2010/4/11 5:20

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