| Poster | Thread |
| | Re: | | I have heard many many arguments against rock music being a legitimate form of Christian music. As someone pointed out on this thread, if you took some people's arguments about the beat, you would also have to eliminate a lot of music by Steve Green, Keith Green, Michael Card, etc... And also most modern worship music. Modern worship music utilizes the same rythyms and back beats as rock music. There is no different other than the guitars may not be as dominant. I see no difference.
I actually heard one sermon from another site (a fundamentalist site... and I consider myself a fundamentalist) where the preacher claimed that any music that is pleasing to the flesh is evil. Really? What does that mean? We should only listen to music we cant stand? That doesnt make any sense. If I'm in the right mood, classical music is very pleasing to me. Sex, in the context of marriage is very pleasing to the flesh... is it then wrong, using that argument? Eating is very pleasing to the flesh, yet I dont see anyone claiming that eating is of the devil.
There are so many contradictions coming from the other side of the argument... it's very confusing to me when someone argues against particular styles of music.
And most everyone here knows enough about me, my stand for holiness, my fundamentalist bent... doesnt the fruit of my life seem to contradict the arguments against Christian rock music? One of the most Christ-like people I have ever met is Glenn Kaiser... who is the lead singer for the Christian hard rock group Resurrection Band. Michael Bloodgood, lead guitarist for the Christian heavy metal band BLOODGOOD is a pastor of a Calvary Chapel Church in Washington state.
Krispy |
|  2005/8/11 8:39 | | Tears_of_joy
Member
Joined: 2003/10/30
Posts: 1554
| | Re: | | Quote:
Actually I have listened to both of those... and I disagree with him on this point.
Hi Krispy,
Year or two ago there was one thread raised by brother Aron (CJaKfOrEsT) - he was the challenger. Can you read please his humble testemony after the discussion was finished. Thanks.
Here is the link [url=https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?mode=viewtopic&topic_id=2872&forum=35&start=50&viewmode=flat&order=0]Christian rock music...?[/url]
In Christ,
Kire |
| | 2005/8/11 9:02 | Profile |
| | Re: | | [i]I apply a rule, that if I walk away feeling free after my arguement with someone, holding no animosity against the other party, then there's a good chance I'm in the will of God.[/i]
Good rule, and if I apply it I can safely say that I'm in the will of God since a) I feel completely free after this discussion, and b) I am "holding no animosity against the other party".
Having said that... I am NOT an advocate of dances, in church or out of church. On this point, I do agree with Daniel. And I do agree with the fact that music CAN be dangerous. How? Like anything else, it can become idolatry. I knew a kid once in a church we used to attend who swore he just couldn't memorize scripture... blamed it on ADHD. Yet he knew every lyric to every song by his favorite Christian band. IDOLATRY.
But the same can be said for anything. Everyone knows I am a football fanatic. I used to be a linebacker. I now coach. I watch NCAA and NFL all the time. I read books on football strategies. But if I am not careful... it can become an idol because I put it before Christ. I've been guilty in the past. Thank God for a wife who steps up and confronts me when that happens.
This can happen in church. We put programs ahead of Christ. Preachers ahead of Christ. etc etc...
But the baby can not, and should not, be thrown out with the bath water. If we remove something that could [b]potentially[/b] be an idol... human nature being what it is, we will make something else an idol. If something is an idol... cut it loose and let it go, by all means. But I have a problem with condemning something all together because of the potential alone. Jobs, money, cars, spouses, kids... they all have the potential to be idols.
Krispy |
| | 2005/8/11 9:50 | |
| | Re: | | I tried earlier to post a recent pic of Stryper to offset that incredibly horrible pic Compton put up of them from the mid-80's... let's try it again...
I think they look a little more mature (and manly) these days...
[img]http://www.stryper.com/images/promo-reborn3.jpg[/img]
Krispy |
| | 2005/8/11 11:54 | |
| | Re: | | Quote:
KrispyKrittr wrote:
If I'm in the right mood, classical music is very pleasing to me. Sex, in the context of marriage is very pleasing to the flesh... is it then wrong, using that argument? Eating is very pleasing to the flesh, yet I dont see anyone claiming that eating is of the devil.
There are so many contradictions coming from the other side of the argument... it's very confusing to me when someone argues against particular styles of music.
And most everyone here knows enough about me, my stand for holiness, my fundamentalist bent... doesnt the fruit of my life seem to contradict the arguments against Christian rock music? One of the most Christ-like people I have ever met is Glenn Kaiser... who is the lead singer for the Christian hard rock group Resurrection Band. Michael Bloodgood, lead guitarist for the Christian heavy metal band BLOODGOOD is a pastor of a Calvary Chapel Church in Washington state.
Krispy
krispy i am not trying to hurl a pebble but, those who have an affinity for all types of music would do well to question whether they do love the hymns just as much as they do heavy metal. I know you do brother, but be wary that i would assume about 90% that do do claim it would say otherwise. And I SECOND THE ARGUMENT THAT Fanny had some shallow hymns, at least they didn't speak to me at all. but believe me, if we were to take the pool as a whole, you would agree there's no comparison. I am going to take this discussion even a little bit deeper. I can't stand, whether hymns or contemporary music when the key changes in the middle of the song. Does anybody relates to that? |
| | 2005/8/11 12:09 | |
| | Re: | | Quote:
krispy i am not trying to hurl a pebble but, those who have an affinity for all types of music would do well to question whether they do love the hymns just as much as they do heavy metal. I know you do brother, but be wary that i would assume about 90% that do do claim it would say otherwise.
Thank you for giving me the benefit of the doubt... that doesnt happen much. :-D
In fact, I do love the old hymns. One of my favorite CD's that is constantly getting played in my house is called "How Sweet The Sound" by Charlie Daniels (who has been a staunch born again Christian for about 10 years now). He did his version of 25 hymns, and it is a powerful powerful POWERFUL CD. He does some in bluegrass, some in country, some very reverently, and some in southern rock.
By the way... I highly recommend this CD to everyone.
But I can only speak for myself, and I can not control what other people do. And if someone doesnt care for the hymns... ya know what? I dont consider that a sin. I think they are cheating themselves, but it's not a sin. It's not a requirement that if you're a believer you must love hymns. Most of the hymns we sing are written by either Americans, Brits or Germans. What about the Chinese Christian? What about the African Christian? Do we place a requirement on them to accept our westernized brand of Christianity? I sure hope not, especially considering that God is more middle eastern than He is American.
My point is this... Paul said to be all things to all people so that we may win a few. This does not mean that we cross over into the immoral. Someoen posted on this site some time ago about a so-called "Christian" organization that is using porn to win people. WRONG! I checked out their website... and while they do not advocate porn, their methods cross the line BIG TIME.
But I was talking to a missionary friend of mine about the topic of music. It's interesting that as a man who has to cross cultural boundaries all the time in order to reach people... he completely understood Christian rock, and the potential it has to reach people.
Back when CCM started, in the early 70's, it's impact was wide and powerful. The lyrics were unashamably Christian. No compromise kinda stuff. You cant listen to a Larry Norman record and walk away wondering what he believes. Or how about Keith Green? Any doubt that he was a believer?
Today, mainstream CCM is so watered down it hardly reaches anyone, tho sales are high. Why? Because it's become a market. I dont like that. I've written against it on several threads.
But it's not the style... it's the unequally yoking together with media giants whose sole purpose is to make $$.
There is plenty wrong with Christian music as an industry. No argument there.
But the bands I listen to recorded in the late 80's early 90's for the most part... and if you read up on these bands, they were getting paid next to nothing. They had a passion to reach the lost that the church was not reaching. Their lyrics were straight up in your face, and proclaimed the name of Christ boldly.
People may not like the style, but they cant deny the heart of some of these bands. Not all of them were in it for ministry, but most were. Stryper, I believe, was at one time. They lost focus and took their eyes off God. They admit that, and it contributed to their demise in 1990. I've read a lot of articles about them now that they have gotten back together... and their heart is more pure than 90% of what passes for CCM on Christian radio right now.
Like anything else... we have to look at the fruit, as well as the method.
Krispy |
| | 2005/8/11 13:16 | | Compton
Member
Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 2732
| | Re: Acceptable music =evangelical music? | | Krispy said
Quote:
the baby can not, and should not, be thrown out with the bath water.
Absolutely. Music is a gift from God. Surely, like many gifts, it can be abused and even wasted, but it is still a gift. I believe this gift is given uniquely to mankind, and to no other creature, for spiritual expression. (I don't know of a single animal that makes music or even comprehends rythym. Even song birds don't really "sing"...)
Now when I say spiritual expression...I don't mean it has to be about "spiritual" things. Many times artists may write songs from their experiences that seem unimportant or shallow to me...but it would be a mistake to think they were unimportant or shallow to God. The tendency among Christians to want to listen to only Christian music seems to come from an arbitrary division between the sacred and the secular.
I know this thread is concentrated on Contemporary Christian music as opposed to secular contemporary music. Obviously modern pop music,(rock, pop, country, rap ect.) is some of trashiest immoral musical expressions in history. Yet secular top 40 songs are not the only alternative to contemporary Christian music. There are countless musical styles that don't even contain lyrics. Yet, even if they do contain lyrics, do these lyrics have to be evangelical before they honor God? Can't even a love song, if it is written from a healthy perspective, be honoring to God, though it never mentions His name?
I believe the chief end of man is to glorify God. Perhaps the way we glorify God through song is not necessarily in writing only about him, but in writing about all of life in a way that honors him.(IMHO)
MC
_________________
Mike Compton
|
| | 2005/8/11 13:33 | Profile |
| | Re: | | Excellent post, Compton. I concur 100%!
Krispy |
| | 2005/8/11 15:15 | | philologos
Member
Joined: 2003/7/18
Posts: 6566
Reading, UK
| | Re: | | Quote:
Like anything else... we have to look at the fruit, as well as the method.
sometimes we have to look at the root too?
_________________
Ron Bailey
|
| | 2005/8/11 15:40 | Profile |
| | Re: | | Quote:
sometimes we have to look at the root too?
Point?
Krispy |
| | 2005/8/11 15:51 | |
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