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Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : Once Saved...Always Saved???

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LoveHim
Member



Joined: 2007/6/14
Posts: 562
Indiana, US

 Re:

brother phillip,

please keep my quote in context. i was saying that for me to have an atitude that i have much better knowledge than you and that whatever you may say is nothing is mere arrogance and pride. i do not believe that to hold the position of perseverence of the saints is arrogant or prideful. c'mon brother, please keep my words in context.

obviously i believe that a believer will not lose their salvation. i've been posting it for like 20 pages or something.

* what Christ has finished for us, He will finish in us.

* i believe in the perseverence of the saints, but many are not saints and so they will not persevere. (both quotes from spurgeon)

love you guys.

 2007/7/2 11:13Profile
MrBillPro
Member



Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 3365
Texas

 Re:

After David committed the sin of adultery and murder... He said he lost the joy of his salvation... Not his salvation..


_________________
Bill

 2007/7/2 11:28Profile









 Re:

Quote:

LoveHim wrote:
dear ormly,

i said that i believe that a truly born again person will not fall away or lose their salvation. they will continue in the faith and persevere because of Him who is doing the persevering within us.

you said that don't i see that we do the persevering.

brother ormly, i don't think that i ever said that we do nothing and we'll be fine. we continue to work out our own salvation with fear and trembling, but it is He who works in us both to will and to do for His good pleasure.




Absolutely...... and as we perservere He does just that that we might have union with Him.

Quote:
from our perspective, we are doing the persevering. from God's perspective, He is the One causing us to persevere.




Only by revelation of Himself is He able to do this. It is the revelation of Him, the "Pearl of Great price" that we see that does the captivating, i.e., we WANT it at all cost. Can you see that?

Quote:
so do i believe if one is truly born again and converted, that they will not lose their salvation? yes.




I personally don't believe anyone is born again without the revelation of Jesus Christ made real to them, that it be in them. We might talk of this also, ok?

Quote:
they will not lose their salvation because they will continue to persevere in the faith. what God has started, He will be faithful to complete. we have been born again of incorruptible seed. we have been filled with the Holy Spirit of promise. He has given us a new heart and a new spirit and He CAUSES us to walk in His ways. He who is born again cannot live a lifestyle of sin.



I know all that. FWIW, God doesn't give a new heart. He gives a new life... Himself.

Quote:
we will overcome, not because we are good, but because HE IS.



He has already overcome all He is going to overcome. It is now that we must overcome by His power as we abandon ourselves IN Him [as Adam was supposed to do] We overcome our nature by the walking in the way of the cross. Need scripture for that?

Quote:
if anyone disagrees with me, that's fine, we're still brothers and sisters in Christ right? this is still a forum to exchange thoughts and scriptures right??



Indeed. But lets strive for accuracy, ok --- rightly dividing God's word that will enable us to see things from His perspective?

love you guys.

 2007/7/2 11:50









 Re:

Quote:
Only by revelation of Himself is He able to do this. It is the revelation of Him, the "Pearl of Great price" that we see that does the captivating, i.e., we WANT it at all cost. Can you see that?



The Pearl of Great price is "the Church", that Jesus paid at all cost.

Katy-did
;-)


PS:
Matthew 13:44 The kingdom of heaven is like treasure hidden in a field, which someone found and hid; then in his joy he goes and sells all that he has and buys that field.

Matthew 13:45 Again, the kingdom of heaven is like a merchant in search of fine pearls; on finding one pearl of great value, he went and sold all that he had and bought it. (NRSV)


We cannot BUY our salvation. Jesus shed His blood, and we have been bought with the precious blood of Jesus Christ. 1st and 2nd Peter....Not with Silver or Gold.

 2007/7/2 11:59









 Re:

Just some extra's to back up. I believe even Scofielf taught this in the footnotes of the KJV Scofield Bible. Unfortunately Mormons have perverted the doctrine, and now we are afraid to even suggest such a thing for fear of being accused of the same.

Ephesians 1:14
Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.

1 Corinthians 7:23
Ye are bought with a price; be not ye the servants of men.

1 Corinthians 6:20
For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's

1 Peter 1: 18
Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed ( PURCHASED) with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers;

19But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:

20Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,

Love in Christ
Katy-did :-)

 2007/7/2 12:37
LoveHim
Member



Joined: 2007/6/14
Posts: 562
Indiana, US

 Re:


brother ormly,

i don't know what FWIW means?? you say that the Lord does not give us a new heart. i write this because of ezekiel 37.

ezekiel 37:26-27

v26- I will give you a NEW HEART and put a NEW SPIRIT within you; I will take the heart of stone out of your flesh and give youa HEART OF FLESH.

v27- I will put my Spirit within you and CAUSE you to walk in My statutes, and you will keep My judgements and do them.

is this nt a promise of the everlasting covenant that the Lord has made with us??

is this not we have in our walk with Christ?? The Spirit within us?? a new heart of flesh and not a heart of stone??

that is what i'm talking about. brother ormly, i am trying to be as accurate as i can, rightly dividing the Word.

 2007/7/2 12:45Profile
MrBillPro
Member



Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 3365
Texas

 Re:

Quote:

LoveHim wrote:

brother ormly,

i don't know what FWIW means??



My guess would be "For What It's Worth" ;-)


_________________
Bill

 2007/7/2 13:10Profile









 Re:

Quote:

LoveHim wrote:

brother ormly,

i don't know what FWIW means?? you say that the Lord does not give us a new heart. i write this because of ezekiel 37.

ezekiel 37:26-27

v26- I will give you a NEW HEART and put a NEW SPIRIT within you; I will take the heart of stone out of your flesh and give youa HEART OF FLESH.

v27- I will put my Spirit within you and CAUSE you to walk in My statutes, and you will keep My judgements and do them.

is this nt a promise of the everlasting covenant that the Lord has made with us??

is this not we have in our walk with Christ?? The Spirit within us?? a new heart of flesh and not a heart of stone??

that is what i'm talking about. brother ormly, i am trying to be as accurate as i can, rightly dividing the Word.



Is He not speaking of the Israelites after they come into their land? Why would you then suppose it means that we receive new hearts?

 2007/7/2 13:27









 Re:

Omley,

2nd Corinthians 3, is the New Covenant you are speaking of. Remember the Corinthians are Gentiles in the Church age. One big wonderful package of what God is doing in our life, changing us from Glory to Glory.

2nd Corinthians 3:

3Forasmuch as ye are manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart.

4And such trust have we through Christ to God-ward:

5Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think any thing as of ourselves; but our sufficiency is of God;

6Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life.

7But if the ministration of death, written and engraven in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not stedfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countenance; which glory was to be done away:

8How shall not the ministration of the spirit be rather glorious?

9For if the ministration of condemnation be glory, much more doth the ministration of righteousness exceed in glory.

10For even that which was made glorious had no glory in this respect, by reason of the glory that excelleth.

11For if that which is done away was glorious, much more that which remaineth is glorious.

12Seeing then that we have such hope, we use great plainness of speech:

13And not as Moses, which put a veil over his face, that the children of Israel could not stedfastly look to the end of that which is abolished:

14But their minds were blinded: for until this day remaineth the same vail untaken away in the reading of the old testament; which vail is done away in Christ.

15But even unto this day, when Moses is read, the vail is upon their heart.

16Nevertheless when it shall turn to the Lord, the vail shall be taken away.

17Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty.

18But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord.

Wonderful Covenant promise of which Gentiles are partakers of the Covenant(s) of Promise. Ephesians.

Love in Christ
Katy-did
;-)

 2007/7/2 13:51









 Re:

Omley,
Here it is:
Ephesians 2:
8For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

9Not of works, lest any man should boast.

10For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

11Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands;

12That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:

13But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.

14For he is our peace, who hath made both one, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us;

15Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace;

16And that he might reconcile both unto God in one body by the cross, having slain the enmity thereby:

17And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh.

18For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.

19Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God;

20And are built upon the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Jesus Christ himself being the chief corner stone;

21In whom all the building fitly framed together groweth unto an holy temple in the Lord:

22In whom ye also are builded together for an habitation of God through the Spirit.


Love in Christ
Katy-did

PS: I guess I am to apologize for using scripture or even knowing it, but when I first received Jesus Christ, and surrendered my whole life to Him, He did something He said He would do, Romans 12:1&2, transform/sanctify me through His Word. I couldn't get enough of reading the Bible..He put so much salt on my tongue, that I wanted to drink and drink and drink. I even slept hugging my Bible at night. That's how much I love the Word of God, and guess who that is? You know!!!

;-)

 2007/7/2 14:06





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