| Poster | Thread | PreachParsly
Member
Joined: 2005/1/14
Posts: 2164
Arkansas
| |  2007/3/8 12:02 | Profile |
| | Re: JEW ERROR AND REPLACEMENT ERROR | |
Hi Preach,
I looked for Ron Bailey here as a listed speaker under 'B' and couldn't find him. :-o So how did you do that?
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| | 2007/3/8 16:00 | |
| | Re: JEW ERROR AND REPLACEMENT ERROR | | Re: Michael Brown
bartle,
I want to listen to 'A Baptism of Tears for Israel' but don't have time tonight. If I don't post a comment soon, please ask me about it. Thanks. |
| | 2007/3/8 16:06 | | PreachParsly
Member
Joined: 2005/1/14
Posts: 2164
Arkansas
| | Re: | | Quote:
dorcas wrote:
Hi Preach,
I looked for Ron Bailey here as a listed speaker under 'B' and couldn't find him. :-o So how did you do that?
Hmm... I just went A-F on other speakers and clicked his name. :-D
When you are looking for an "other speaker" it is alphabetized according to last name, but when you look for his name in the list of speakers it is alphabetized by first name. That may have caused some confusion.
_________________
Josh Parsley
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| | 2007/3/8 16:41 | Profile |
| | Re: JEW ERROR AND REPLACEMENT ERROR | | Hi Preach, thanks.
Quote:
When you are looking for an "other speaker" it is alphabetized according to last name, but when you look for his name in the list of speakers it is alphabetized by first name. That may have caused some confusion.
After I posted to you, I did wonder if that was the problem. I never have understood alphabetising under first name.
One doesn't always remember a person's first name or initials, or know which of their initials one might be supposed to search under. (G W North is a good example of this, in that people who really [i]knew[/i] him called him Wally, not George.)
EDIT: Quote:
They are also on this site.
But if you go to Ron's site (link on p3 of this thread), it will have good speakers you have never heard of, who are worth a listen. 8-) |
| | 2007/3/9 5:23 | | PreachParsly
Member
Joined: 2005/1/14
Posts: 2164
Arkansas
| | Re: | | Quote:
But if you go to Ron's site (link on p3 of this thread), it will have good speakers you have never heard of, who are worth a listen.
I agree! I have listened to several sermons on his site from different brothers.
_________________
Josh Parsley
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| | 2007/3/9 10:22 | Profile |
| | Re: JEW ERROR AND REPLACEMENT ERROR | | Re: I disagree. (respectfully and gently)
After I'd replied to this post, with thoughts which were on the top of my mind, I realised slightly sorrowfully, that I had not acknowledged the personal history you'd shared here, and how illuminating it was.
There is one question which keeps coming into my mind, which is hard to articulate because I don't want to phrase it badly.... but it is around the matter of Jews having a role in the end times. My query is this: in referring to 'the Jews', are you, (possibly because - possibly [i]only[/i] because - of the way Dr Brown interprets scripture) referring to [i]regenerate[/i] Jews, or [u]un[/u]regenerate Jews?
I ask, because it causes me consternation to 'hear' what it sounds like.... that Jews who have not received Jesus Christ as Saviour and Lord, are somehow going to climb up into the sheepfold some other way. This is what it sounds like.
This is where the genuine suspicion that there are some Jews, like Dr Brown, who think 'Jews', because of their ethnicity or religion, are indispensible to God, and somehow will be saved supernaturally, not having had to apprehend the cross like the rest of us.
It sounds just like he is saying Jews are exempt from acknowledging the historical mess for which they were responsible, partly [i]because[/i] they were God's chosen people through whom He planned to bring salvation to the world.
I know that it says in Daniel that a third of Jews will be saved. This may well be the largest proportion of an identifyable group, in the whole of human history. Amen. I have no problem with this [i]per se[/i]. God's word is God's word. If there is a problem it, it is because this doesn't seem to be enough. Where is the collective sorrow for Jewish sins, for which Messiah died? Isn't this what the world is still waiting for? Isn't this the pivot on which Rom 11:25 turns?
'For I do not desire, brethren, that you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest you should be wise in your own opinion, that blindness in part has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in.'
I also suggest that it is incorrect that Jewish people as a whole, are now, in the Church era, the olive tree.
11:15 For if [u]their being [b]cast away[/b][/u] [is] the reconciling of the world, what [will] their acceptance [be] but life from the dead?
16 For if the firstfruit [is] holy, the lump [is] also [holy;]
Christ is the firstfruit from the dead.
I have other verses to share from 2 Corinthians 5, but they read more clearly in Tyndale, whom I will quote in my next session online.
Please be gentle with me in response to these comments. Really I'm just trying to share with you what my gentile ears hear. I may not be missing something in the airspace, but so, what is missing from what Jews are saying, for this misunderstanding (I may have) to be corrected? |
| | 2007/3/9 11:11 | |
| | Re: Linn | | there are several things you wrote that I don't understand:
Quote:
but it is around the matter of Jews having a role in the end times
Quote:
My query is this: in referring to 'the Jews', are you, (possibly because - possibly only because - of the way Dr Brown interprets scripture) referring to regenerate Jews, or unregenerate Jews?
are you refering to secular or observant Jews?
Quote:
I ask, because it causes me consternation to 'hear' what it sounds like.... that Jews who have not received Jesus Christ as Saviour and Lord, are somehow going to climb up into the sheepfold some other way. This is what it sounds like
Sister, I cant hear thru your ears, so...?
Quote:
This is where the genuine suspicion that there are some Jews, like Dr Brown, who think 'Jews', because of their ethnicity or religion, are indispensible to God, and somehow will be saved supernaturally, not having had to apprehend the cross like the rest of us.
two things, if you want to speak of "genuine suspicion". let me tell you that Jews, observant Jews and even secular, have intense suspicion of the lower c church, and its sordid history over 1600 plus years towards the Jewish people, and secondly, how is anyone saved but SUPERNATURALLY?
Is it that when a pastor makes an impassioned altar call and one gives their intellectual nod and says, "yeh, I think following Jesus might be a good idea"......???
now here's where you lose me, and I have no idea what you are referencing:Quote:
It sounds just like he is saying Jews are exempt from acknowledging the historical mess for which they were responsible, partly because they were God's chosen people through whom He planned to bring salvation to the world.
what "historical mess" are you talking about?
Im trying to very gentle about the words I use, you're asking me to explain the words and ministry of a man who holds a PhD, ask him. I don't mean that churlishly, ask Dr. Brown.
and I have to be very frank and clear, I find replacement theology in error, and I am getting so weary of having to debate other saints on this forum about it, I'm not as theologically smart as all of you, nor do I care to be, nor do I care to rehash and argue and to defend the place of the Jewish people in God's Economy. My theology is very simple. I believe God. I believe the Bible is the inerrant infallible Word of God, and that Jesus is Messiah, and that prayer works.
Thats it.
as far as any "correction" is concerned, thats between you and the LORD., not me.
My experience of late, re: the proponents of "replacement theology" has been a REAL eye opener, and thats ALL I'm say about that.
and I close with : May God bless you today, neil |
| | 2007/3/9 15:06 | |
| | Re: JEW ERROR AND REPLACEMENT ERROR | | Re: Linn
bartle said
Quote:
Im trying to very gentle about the words I use, you're asking me to explain the words and ministry of a man who holds a PhD, ask him. I don't mean that churlishly, ask Dr. Brown.
I very much appreciated your gentleness. Thank you.
The bad news is that it will be nearly 24 hours before I can respond properly. I want to listen to Dr Brown first. I think I should.
If I were you, I wouldn't be overfaced by his academic qualifications. The whole point of Tyndale's work, was to put the word of God into the hands of simple ploughmen... so convinced he was they would understand it. This means you don't have an excuse to take Dr Brown's word for anything, especially if his thesis doesn't make sense to your spiritually enlightened understanding.
Here is Tyndale's 2 Corinthians 5, last paragraph.
'Wherefore henceforth know we no man after theflesh. Insomuch though we have known Christ after the flesh, now henceforth know we him so no more. Therefore, if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature. Old things are passed away; behold all things are become new. Nevertheless all things are of God, which hath reconciled us unto hmself by Jesus Christ, and hath given unto us the office to preach the atonement. For God was in Christ, and made agreement between the world and himself, and imputed not their sins unto them: and hath committed to us the preaching of the atonement. Now then are we messengers in the room of Christ: even as though God did beseech you through us: So pray we you in Christ's stead, that ye be at one with God; for he hath made him to be sin for us, which knew no sin, that we by his means should be that righteousness which before God is a-loved.' |
| | 2007/3/9 16:28 | |
| | Re: Linn | | Quote:
If I were you, I wouldn't be overfaced by his academic qualifications.
Hardly, the Holy Spirit testifies with my spirit that what he says is true, I am not one to be overly impressed by a man's adademic credentials, just his word and his testimony as led by the Holy spirit
Quote:
This means you don't have an excuse to take Dr Brown's word for anything, especially if his thesis doesn't make sense to your spiritually enlightened understanding.
His thesis does make sense, perfect sense, in his refutation of "replacement theology", which to me is a new rub on the old british-Israelism, and any one proponent of "replacement theology", their witness, their word their heartspace, and their twisted "theology" lend me to the fact that I bear nothing in common with them in Jesus, in fact i regard them as hostile to Gospel, hostile to the Economy of God and ultimately hostile to the Jewish people and their place in the end time prophecies, and wish no fellowship with them at all.
It is a dark theology, its bears no resemblance to ministry of reconciliation that God and His son Jesus suffered so much for, it is a theology of superiority before God, and my eyes and my ears have been opened to the true heartspace of those who propose and expound on such error, selectifly flinging Scripture around like stones.
These people who forward this foul theo-brew should repent for they have misaapropriated the Word of God and His work with the Jewish people, now and in the future.
neil
later edit- and you never answered what "historical mess" the jewish people are responsible for? |
| | 2007/3/10 4:57 | |
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