Hi Todd: There is really nothing preventing anyone from believing there were 50 kinds of dinosaurs on the ark, Noah had 7 of the clean animals of all kinds...the only thing that would create unbelief that specific kind of animal could not possibly be on the ark is the theory of evolution/carbon dating.

86 evolution and you are clear to have whatever animal God wanted on that ark.

you can put mammoths, sabre tooths or a dimetrodon on the ark and lack no confidence they were saved for propagation in the new world.

_________________
Marvin

Like I said Marvin you are certainly entitled to believe that if you wish.

But a more localized flood event where every animal and bird on the globe were not killed cannot be ruled out from the biblical texts for the reasons which I exceedingly briefly set forth below.

Why couldn’t Noah have simply walked to higher ground if the flood was local? Because God wanted indigenous animals preserved and needed a boat to do so.

ADD: plus God wanted to give Noah a chance to preach. All the folks were in Mesopotamia.

_________________
Todd

God did not want indigenous animals preserved.

Genesis 6:7 And the Lord said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them.

8 But Noah found grace in the eyes of the Lord

_________________
J Kruger

I don’t understand your point Joch. If God did not want animals preserved why did they go onto the ark?

_________________
Todd

A few points to consider if you support the theory of local flood

Okay, so,we can dismiss the word “ earth” to mean the globe and replace it with the word “ land” to mean a local plot of earth
But what about the word “ heaven” in the verse “ 17 And, behold, I, even I, do bring a flood of waters upon the earth, to destroy all flesh, wherein is the breath of life, from under heaven; and every thing that is in the earth shall die.

Destroy what? Every flesh that has breath
Where? Under heaven
What is the scope of that phrase “ under heaven” ?
Does that sound local

19 And the waters prevailed exceedingly upon the earth; and all the high mountains, that were UNDER THE WHOLE HEAVEN, were covered.

If the flood was local, why did God command Noah to take a male and a female of every unclean bird?
We know of bird migration, couldn’t the birds that were not affected by the flood migrate from one place to another? And if space was so needed on the ark, why was it necessary that they preserve the birds

19 These are the three sons of Noah: and of them was the whole earth overspread.
We see in the generations of Noah’s three sons what we now call the European, Asian, African continents

And Finally the question that has been asked a thousand times
If God gave the rainbow as a covenant to not again destroy the earth with flood water, and if what He meant by that was a local flood. Why are we still seeing local floods?

_________________
Fifi

Did you research what “under heaven” meant back then? I strongly suspect it is a figure of speech and cannot be required to mean every centimeter of the globe.

He actually said to take 7 pairs of every bird. Of course he also said to take two pairs.

Nothing you have posted 100% rules out a local flood.

You can certainly believe the globe was a ball of water if you want to. Where did all that water go?

_________________
Todd

"Under the whole heaven"? v.19. What did that mean back then?. I guess I will have to say it means the same as today.

The reason I focussed on the "unclean" birds is because these couldn't be used for a burnt offering?
So, why did they need to be preserved if they could've easily migrated back ones the locally flooded area dried up.


What is your answer to the point about the rainbow?

_________________
Fifi

God was promising not to send another flood like the one he sent, namely that destroyed every human other than Noah and his family.

All humans were in Mesopotamia. If the the flood covered Mesopotamia it killed every human.

Gods promise has held true; he has not killed every living person with a flood. Of course to do so today WOULD require a global flood.

ADD: “This day I will begin to put the dread and fear of you upon the nations under the **whole heaven**, who shall hear the report of you, and shall tremble and be in anguish because of you.’
Deuteronomy 2:25

_________________
Todd

I now believe rainbows are the shape they are because they are reflecting the shape of the firmament (dome) that God created.

Remember, he created the firmament (dome) to separate the waters below from the waters above.

Then, during the flood, the windows of Heaven were opened, and after the flood, they were closed again (note: they did not disappear).

I know this concept will be mocked nowadays, but for purposes of illustration, it’s helped me to envision we live under a massive snow globe (to even begin to grasp what the firmament might look like, because I can’t see it). As such, it’s helped me grasp how the whole earth, and all the mountains under Heaven were covered with water.

Regarding this firmament (dome) we live under....

In Job 37:18 it’s described as God spreading out the skies as a “cast metal mirror”.

King Solomon wrote in Proverbs 8:28 “when he made firm the skies above”...

Anyway, now that I’ve been introduced to Hebrew (Biblical) cosmology, the flood account makes much more sense than it ever did while I was growing up (with these same questions).

I used to think some water canopy disappeared after the flood, but now I see that was just my minds way to dismiss what the Bible teaches, because real life teachers in my classrooms, at home and in church all taught me that we live on a globe.

So to say the last few years journey I’ve been on re-learning Biblical cosmology has been a stretch, would be an understatement.

The amount of cognitive dissonance I’ve wrestled with has been immense.

Plus, the ridicule, scorn, mocking, anger, and accusations from fellow believers....ya, it’s not been fun.

Still, the pure worship of our Creator, Christ Jesus, and whole new levels of reverence and awe for God’s word, which is always faithful and true, that this journey has wrought in me, has been worth it.

I still have so many more questions than answers too....so by no means have I arrived anywhere....thankfully there are an increasing number of precious humble saints that I can have conversations with about these matters.

Anyway, I was compelled to chime in Fifi, due to how much I appreciate your candor in this thread....

Much love to all the saints!!

"Many consider the height of Mount Everest at 8,848 metres (29,029 ft—Figure 4) a fatal flaw for the Genesis Flood. How could the floodwater have topped the mountains, they ask? Even if the ocean floor was raised to sea level, the present water on the earth would be only 2,700 metres (8,800 ft) deep, one-third the depth needed to cover Mount Everest. Differential vertical tectonics as the floodwater was draining provides the answer,10 because the mountains were pushed up as a result of the Flood, by way of upward vertical tectonics."

From Answers In Genesis
Read the full article here:
https://creation.com/how-did-the-waters-of-noahs-flood-drain

_________________
Nigel Holland