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bigdaveusa
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Joined: 2003/6/13
Posts: 49


 The Wheat among the Tares

What a person believes makes all the difference. Am I making any sense?


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Dave

 2004/4/8 4:08Profile
rookie
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Joined: 2003/6/3
Posts: 4792


 Re: The Wheat among the Tares

You wrote:
"There is a whole lot of emphasis on getting folks into the water of baptism, and counting that new convert. I just hope that we are concerned, really and truly, with the persons spiritual condition, not on how we've filled the pews. My suspiscion is that people many times don't believe. That's right, I said they just do not believe. Maybe we need to back off on closing the deal, and counting them as converted, and asking God to tarry, and help their unbelief. I believe that the Gospel message is not so convoluted as the invitation is, today. "

The great commission is this, "Go therefore and [b]make disciples[/b] of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, [b]teaching them to observe all the things that I have commanded you[/b], and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age." Matthew 28:19-20

You are correct. The church fails to make disciples of Jesus. They fail because they themselves have not heard, "teaching them to observe all the things that I have commanded you." The sinners prayer and a dunk in the water means absolutely nothing to a person who has not been made to understand the righteous requirements of the God's law. The sinners prayer and a dunk in the water means absolutely nothing to a person who is not discipled by Jesus. The weeds are choking out the wheat.

In Christ
Jeff


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Jeff Marshalek

 2004/4/8 11:14Profile
rocklife
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Joined: 2004/4/1
Posts: 323
usa

 Re: The Wheat among the Tares

When you say "what a person believes makes the difference." What defintion of belief are you going by?

An intellectual belief, head knowledge, is pretty shallow. But if a person acts on that belief, it shows they really have that belief. My summary of James is faith without works shows you have no faith.

If you are going to jump out of a plane, believing a parachute will save you from the hard landing, without putting it on, will not help you. We must believe on Jesus, and put on the Lord Jesus Christ. Jesus says, "Why do you call me Lord and do NOT the things that I say?" (Luke 6:46), and James 2:19 says the demons believe in God, it's love and obedience to Jesus that makes you His, not just believing intellectually (even the demons believe).

Jesus says let the wheat and tares grow together, because good ones may be uprooted also. This will all be sorted out at the end of the age. When we can, let's pull from the fire, and correct, and rebuke, but wisdom must be exercised. Again, Jesus says let them grow together, the blind will lead the blind. Do your best to sow seed, and speak the truth in love, but we must exercise wisdom and patience with that, too. When I meet Christians who seem to be tares, I just encourage obedience to Jesus' commands, by reading the Bible every day (especially New Testament). Even false converts will benefit from that advice (like me when I was a false convert). God saves us, it's by grace we are saved, not our obedience, but we love and obey God because we are saved!! I do believe the Bible has the power to truly convert, though, so encourage everyone, wheat and tares, to continue meditating on God's word day and night, like Psalm 1:1 says (you'll be like a well-watered tree).

I also agree with rookie's comments, those are very insightful.


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Jina

 2004/4/15 16:41Profile
prayer1warrior
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Joined: 2004/4/8
Posts: 27


 Re: The Wheat among the Tares

Jesus said,"repent and believe the gospel."

 2004/4/16 1:12Profile
rocklife
Member



Joined: 2004/4/1
Posts: 323
usa

 Re:

Rookie, that's a great reminder!

The Great Commission includes teaching obedience!!!

1 and 2 John and the book of John also teaches loving Jesus (God) includes obedience to His commands. It's all together.

"If you say "No, Lord, no." Then He is not your Lord." Charles Spurgeon.


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Jina

 2004/4/16 22:56Profile
sermonindex
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Joined: 2002/12/11
Posts: 37080
"Pilgrim and Sojourner." - 1 Peter 2:11

Online!
 Re:

Quote:
You are correct. The church fails to make disciples of Jesus. They fail because they themselves have not heard, "teaching them to observe all the things that I have commanded you." The sinners prayer and a dunk in the water means absolutely nothing to a person who has not been made to understand the righteous requirements of the God's law. The sinners prayer and a dunk in the water means absolutely nothing to a person who is not discipled by Jesus. The weeds are choking out the wheat.


Brother Jeff thats a very powerful statment. WOW praise God.. AMEN! The Lord showed me that verse awhile back that its not just enough to tell people about Jesus, and its not just enought to teach them about the ways of God, we need to teach them obedience to the Life of Christ. It really matter nothing as you said to say a prayer, get a baptism, come to church, unless the person had an regeneration of their spirit being born anew in Christ. I'm tired of seeing Christians who are wearied to pray and read the bible, but would rather spend '2 stinken hours in a movie house' surely if we are born again and sit in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus we have a fleeting interest in the things of this world.


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SI Moderator - Greg Gordon

 2004/4/17 2:32Profile
bigdaveusa
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Joined: 2003/6/13
Posts: 49


 Re: The Wheat among the Tares

To answer your question oilpainter, the manner of believing that I speak of is that of which the bible speaks: "

Acts 8:37 And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.
c.f.
Romans 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
That's not mental ascent. That is believing with all of your heart. You inquired on another thread about the difficulty you were having reconciling the fact that not a few individuals were posting comments about unbelievers in our churches. My point is this: they have not fulfilled the requirements of belief. They have trusted a ritual. The sinner's prayer never saved anyone. Repentance and belief in the gospel does that. Those are the requirements set forth by our Lord, THE SAVIOR. HE said to repent and believe the gospel. That's about as straightforward as I can make it.









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Dave

 2004/4/17 13:30Profile
rocklife
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Joined: 2004/4/1
Posts: 323
usa

 Re:

Thanks for clarifying. I agree with that definition of belief, it's the superficial belief that some defend, so sometimes I'm not sure what people mean.


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Jina

 2004/4/17 21:05Profile





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