| Poster | Thread | ccchhhrrriiisss
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Joined: 2003/11/23
Posts: 4779
| | Re: | | Very good points, sister ginnyrose.
I have read other testimonies where farmers were in severe drought and they prayed for rain. A hurricane made landfall and brought much-needed rain further inland.
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Christopher
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|  2012/8/25 21:35 | Profile |
| | Re: | | Quote:
Over 50,000 million aborted babies and we don't think judgement is coming specifically to the US? Homosexual marriage? Child milesters and abuses by the millions. Internet porn made on our shores and shipped around the globe? TBN and wolves deceiving the whole world with a false Gospel and judgement coming is speculation? It's coming dear brother. The Lord is delaying, but won't stop it. It's already been decreed. Whether we like it or not matters very little, to be honest.
No question of it. Never let any deceiver tell you otherwise. |
| | 2012/8/25 21:45 | |
| | Re: Chris | | Brother, Jeff posed an interesting question to you. Do you believe persecution is coming to America? Or do you think we are going overboard on the Sermon Index conference? Just courious, bro.
Bearmaster. |
| | 2012/8/25 22:12 | | ccchhhrrriiisss
Member
Joined: 2003/11/23
Posts: 4779
| | Re: | | Bearmaster,
I have made it exceedingly clear that I believe that persecution will come to America...and the entire world.
Moreover, I ask that you refrain from asking "leading assumptions" via insinuations from any "either/or" series of questions. I notice that you do this quite a bit.
In this case, you asked:
A. Do you believe persecution is coming to America?
---OR---
B. Do you think "we" are going overboard on the Sermon Index conference?
As believers, we should not to be double-minded with one another or assume that others fall within one of two bipolar scenarios that we have conjured in our minds.
Like I said, I have already indicated clearly within my posts -- many times -- that I believe persecution is coming to this world. In fact, Jesus told us that we would have tribulation in this world. Believers have been persecuted since the beginning of the Church.
I am excited about the SermonIndex conference on The Church and Coming Persecution. But, let me be clear: We should not fear persecution. The Church has been experiencing persecution since the beginning. I do believe that it will become more widespread. We should encourage one another in the Lord...and be prepared to endure to the end.
That said: This thread is about a question that you asked regarding an approaching (and potentially dangerous) hurricane is drawing near the Southeast and how you find it "ironic" that the Republicans will be meeting in Florida. You asked if God is "sending a prophetic message here."
According to the National Weather Service, the storm will be approaching Mississippi, Alabama and Georgia by tomorrow evening. The Republicans? They canceled most of their events from the first day of the convention. So, by Tuesday evening, the storm will likely have made landfall somewhere in Mississippi, Alabama and Georgia.
As Ginnyrose said, this could be the answer to prayers of many farmers. We should be very slow to speak when it comes to trying to "tie" a storm with spiritual "irony" or a "prophetic message." After all, we will have to give an account for every idle word we speak.
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Christopher
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| | 2012/8/25 22:42 | Profile |
| | Re: | | Chris,
We all know that persecution is coming to this world. In fact much persecution is already in most parts of the world to some degree or another. We all have read the end of the book, and know it will go worldwide and be most severe, ie, the great tribulation.
However, what we are saying is more specific than that. What I am saying is that God is going to send a judgement to America that will send shockwaves through the whole world. I don't want to cloud that or foggy that up in the weeds. Why do I believe that? Because the Lord showed it to me shortly afetr I was born again, and has made it clear by the Spirit that it is fast approaching.
I believe a great war is on the horizon and greater persecution will come either just before, during, or just after it. I don't want it to get lost in the weeds of what we all know to be specifically true by scripture quotes only. I have tried to Make it clear what I'm saying, but it keeps getting lost in the "we all believe in persecution" general theme.
Also, Bearaster didn't start out this thread saying that is is definitely judgement from God, but asked if anyone noticed and COULD there be something to it prophetically? That's not "idle words". That's likely a man with a prophetic calling, unsure if it means anything, but throwing it out there to see what others think/see/perceive. After all, the NT says in fellowship, prophets are to speak and the others are to judge the word spoken. NT prophetic callings are not exactly like OT prophets. I have tried to express this MANY times in multiple threads.
Idle words are just jibberish that shouldn't be spoken at all. Wasted words. You obviously do not have a prophetic gift, but maybe a teaching gift? Or a gift of administration? Or Pastoral gifts to shepherd the flock? I don't know, but it always seems like those who don't have prophetic gifts don't understand the gift/calling, and seek to discredit/nullify/kill any/all prophetic words spoken and put forth for consideration by the Body to judge.
In fact, this wasn't even technically a "prophetic word", but a question for consideration for evoaluation by the Body. You may not think it was a hurricane sent by God for the RNC, but that doesn't make it an idle word. I didn't think it was necessarily, but didn't know for sure, but it did catch my attention and a moment of wonder in my mind.
I started in on this thread because people attack even the possibility that God could/would do that? God is sending judgement much greater than that. Don't be surprised by it. It's aimed at America, and will affect the whole world. That's not an idle word brother, but a word from the Lord He has made crystal clear to many within the Body in this hour. |
| | 2012/8/26 0:56 | | ccchhhrrriiisss
Member
Joined: 2003/11/23
Posts: 4779
| | Re: | | Hi Jeffmar...
Quote:
However, what we are saying is more specific than that. What I am saying is that God is going to send a judgement to America that will send shockwaves through the whole world. I don't want to cloud that or foggy that up in the weeds. Why do I believe that? Because the Lord showed it to me shortly afetr I was born again, and has made it clear by the Spirit that it is fast approaching.
I understand what you are saying. Persecution is certainly at the door...and believers around the world have suffered severe persecution and tribulation for nearly two thousand years. We know that believers will face some difficult times in the last days.
Yet, even in this, we are encouraged by the Lord to not fret or fear such things. The worst thing that can happen to us is that we are killed; yet, this is a victory in itself.
However, it is almost as if you (and others) are saying that "special judgment" is coming to America. Now, I am not saying that God hasn't reserved "special" judgment. However, it is certainly something that is extra-biblical. Why? We don't find any specific, undeniable references to America in the Word of God unless we interpret it that way.
Still, it may happen. Judgment could be poured out on this young nation (after all, 236 years is relatively "new" in the scope of the last two thousand years since Christ was born) out of a specific purpose. However, if we are going to justify that "judgment" or "wrath" because of sin, there are many more sinful nations out there.
In this instance, the question was raised about an impending hurricane that will likely hit the Gulf Coast. The question was raised about it being a prophetic judgment because of the Republican National Convention in Tampa, FL.
Now, there are cities that are probably "more sinful" than Tampa, Florida or the Mississippi/Alabama/Florida Gulf Coast. Have you ever been to New York, San Francisco, Amsterdam, Beijing, Dubai, London, Paris, or many other cities around the world? Why would we suppose that God is sending such special judgment upon the Gulf Coast when He doesn't do the same to cities and areas that are steeped in Islam?
And, of course, hurricanes have hit the Gulf Coast for centuries BEFORE they were heavily populated...long before Europeans or even Native American tribes heavily populated the area. Is it possible that this latest hurricane may simply be just another hurricane? Why is it that we have people publicly suggest that it is special "judgment" (or wrath) with every act of nature?
Still, you say that God showed it to you. However, I can't go by what you say that God showed you...no matter how much I respect you. In fact, I don't believe that we should be so swayed by such things anyway. Our primary goal remains the same -- to know and serve the Lord and introduce this Good News to others. We are not to be in fear or distracted by the world around us...even if it is falling apart.
Quote:
Also, Bearaster didn't start out this thread saying that is is definitely judgement from God, but asked if anyone noticed and COULD there be something to it prophetically? That's not "idle words". That's likely a man with a prophetic calling, unsure if it means anything, but throwing it out there to see what others think/see/perceive. After all, the NT says in fellowship, prophets are to speak and the others are to judge the word spoken. NT prophetic callings are not exactly like OT prophets. I have tried to express this MANY times in multiple threads.
I understand that it was a question...but this sort of question is what they call "leading." In the secular world, such questions wouldn't be admissible in a court because they lead the respondents toward a "direction." Consider what he "asked:"
Quote:
Is it ironic that the Rebublicans are meeting in Tampa this coming week to nominate a man out of a Satanic cult to be tbeir presidential candidate. And a hurricane is coming toward Tampa?
Is God sending a prophetic message here?
Do you notice that he tied the "irony" of Republicans meeting in Tampa to nominate Mitt Romney (that he repeatedly stresses is part of a Satanic cult...and further elucidates upon this later with questionable accusations) and the ninth named tropical storm/hurricane of the 2012 Atlantic hurricane season? Moreover, they are devoid of the godly compassion and intercession on behalf of those individuals -- including many believers -- who will potentially be affected by this storm.
Earlier, I wrote a response to one of Bearmaster's more recent posts in this thread. I went through it statement by statement...in the hope of highlighting how such statements and questionable in regard to truth and how allegations might come across via such "questions." In some cases, they not only "lead" the reader, but they include statements of insinuation that don't pass the muster of purity of speech that believers should be uphold.
I decided to sit upon that response. Not only do I want to approach such things prayerfully and with a heart of grace, but I also don't know that such a post would accomplish anything other than misunderstood feelings, a sense of rejection or even the pride of words being "rejected" for seemingly prophetic reasons.
Quote:
You obviously do not have a prophetic gift, but maybe a teaching gift? Or a gift of administration? Or Pastoral gifts to shepherd the flock? I don't know, but it always seems like those who don't have prophetic gifts don't understand the gift/calling, and seek to discredit/nullify/kill any/all prophetic words spoken and put forth for consideration by the Body to judge.
For one, I don't know if it is wise to affirm or renounce any gift that a member of an online community apparently operates under.
To be very clear: I do NOT seek to discredit/nullify/kill any/all prophet words spoken and put forth for consideration.
If you knew me better...or could see/know/experience the things that I have in my life, you would know this to not be true. I have both heard and spoken words that exposed the secrets of the heart. God has "shown" me things -- supernaturally -- that were exceedingly and specifically clear as a warning, as encouragement and as a way to present the Gospel to someone else. I could go into details where I was ministering the Gospel and I suddenly became "aware" of specific names or previous instances and anecdotes within the hearers life...or the knowledge of what would happen thereafter. In many cases, I feel the Lord "reveal" something to me; yet, I keep it to myself in prayer (or how I approach others) unless I feel that I cannot.
These things make me tremble before I share them. Yes, I understand that these things do not make me a "prophet." I don't know what they make me. These things are not from me or awarded to me. I rejoice (in tears) when the Lord uses such instances. I desperately desire to never rob the Lord of His glory or distract others from Him on account of this broken and flawed vessel in which the Lord might use to share such things.
However, I would never feel offended if someone were to question those things that I share. I wouldn't be offended if someone scrutinized and tested the things that I say. If those things are from the Lord (as I feel they are), then they will not fall to the ground and would pass such a test.
Unfortunately, there are many people who seek, desire or feel themselves to be "prophets" who utter public words. When tested or scrutinized, many of those individuals feel slighted. Some will even reject (even publicly) those who reject their words as being from God. I have known prophets and I have known false prophets. One of the biggest differences that I have seen between the two lay in the egos. Some blame their abrasive nature, audacity and even "alpha" attitude on a "gift." Yet, I believe that a true prophet will remain humble before the Lord. He will not feel slighted...and will never care to be recognized for being used via a gift that he could never earn.
Throughout the years on SermonIndex and in life, I have known prophets who pronounced specific dates within their "prophetic words." An economic disaster by such-and-such date. An earthquake during such-and-such month. The beginning of the Tribulation by a specific day. I would hear those words, let them know if I didn't "accept" them as truth...yet commit myself to prayer for the speaker, the hearers and the targets of those words. When those prophesied specific dates came and went, many "prophets" who were daring enough to proclaim such specific judgments by specific dates weren't quite as bold when it came to repenting (or, at least, explaining) in regard to what they said.
I have noticed that there is a trend for ambiguity among many "prophets" in the Body of Christ. Instead of secrets of the heart, we are given interpretive words that hold verifiable and undeniable truths. Yet, in some cases, they also contain things that can't be measured, verified or scrutinized. In the case of the TBN type of "Christianity," there are "preacher personalities" (like Benny Hinn or Kim Clement) who -- after countless false prophecies -- eventually realized that they should not include dates or specifics within their words lest they be scrutinized when such things do not come to pass. So, they utter ambiguous words that contain Scriptural truths, a current "pressing" view of passionate issues facing the Church and a few statements that cannot be validated or invalidated.
In this case, I wouldn't call this question about the possible irony of a hurricane hitting the Gulf Coast something "prophetic" because the Republicans will be meeting in Tampa. After all, the Republicans decided today to be safe and put off the convention until Tuesday. Yet, I would also caution individuals to not confuse strong opinions about a matter with a prophetic word or unction.
Quote:
I started in on this thread because people attack even the possibility that God could/would do that? God is sending judgement much greater than that. Don't be surprised by it. It's aimed at America, and will affect the whole world. That's not an idle word brother, but a word from the Lord He has made crystal clear to many within the Body in this hour.
I don't think that anyone here is questioning the possibility that God can or would send judgment to America. I mentioned that I believe judgment is coming earlier in one of my posts. However, I can't go by the words of a man if those words aren't confirmed by the Word of God and by prayer. I also cannot scrutinize words that are strong in content but ambiguous in measurement.
For instance, I could say that "a major hurricane is coming to America" because of states that embrace homosexual marriage. Well, there might be a few more states that legalize homosexual marriage soon. But, what about a hurricane? If it doesn't happen this year...or next year...but the following year...is this "prophetic" or just statistically "likely?" After all, a major hurricane hits the United States once every few years. If I say that there would be an assassination attempt on a major political figure, it could simply be a very real "possibility" that is voiced given the extreme political divisive of the day.
When it comes to the specific topic of voting, I often regret involving myself in the discussion. I often feel bombarded by individuals who feel strongly about the topic. Ironically, I am not nearly as politically motivated as some might suppose (or have previously suggested). Yet, I do not appreciate it when some make broad stereotypes of believers or reject extending the grace that comes from not standing in the way of the Holy Spirit's leading into all truth.
I don't mean to digress, but it seems that many such topics like this have a tendency to do so. It is late and my thoughts grow weary. I do hope that you know that I appreciate you and any believer who loves the Lord. We may often differ on issues, topics or even the estimation about words that we speak. However, I praise God for the passion and sincerity of heart and motive of believers even if we disagree.
The Lord bless you, brother!
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Christopher
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| | 2012/8/26 2:30 | Profile | jstrang
Member
Joined: 2011/10/21
Posts: 154
Owasso, OK
| | Re: Has anyone noticed???? | | We will know if it the Lord, especially if it strikes the mark for which it was sent. The Lord always strikes with accuracy and never misses. Bigger question is, if this is the Lord's hand, why has he not struck all of the pagan presidents and pagan governments?
You do pose an interesting thought though.
Blessings,
Jeremy
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Jeremy B Strang
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| | 2012/8/26 5:29 | Profile |
| | Re: Chris | | Brother I am not a prophet nor make any claim to such. But as a believer in Jesus Christ I am exhorted, even commanded to watch and discern the times. So when I see the Republicans meeting in Tampa in the path of a hurricane I am compelled to ask is God saying something? Particularly when a Satanic cultist is about to be nominated as the next President of the United States. One who conceivably is an antichrist. If not emerging as the Antichrist.
I have noticed that you and a few others will not address the evils of Mormonism. I have posted repeatedly that Romney is dangerous and more so than the current President because Romney is coming out of a Satanic cult.
Chris, do you know what Mormonism is? Are you aware of its history? Do you not see the demonic origins of Mormonism? Do you think Mormonism is some little weird cult with no serious agenda? Do you not see the designs of the enemy here? Do you think somebody like Romney who has grown up and been inducted into this evil system is not going to bring it's influence into the White House? Yet, you and others ignore these questions. Ok, so be it.
Snitching gears. No America is not mentioned specifically in the Bible for special judgement. But Jesus taught that judgement would be more severe for those who know the truth. You and others have reminded us that's this nation was built on Judaic Christian truth. On that I agree. No other nation in the world has been blessed with gospel truth as America has. And that may be our downfall as we have become gospel hardened.
My point is America has no excuse. The truth of Jesus Christ has been preached to America. America has rejected the truth of Christ and turned away from God. Even choosing a cultist to lead them. Thus America will be judged more severely. I dare say that the evil nations of Eritrea and N. Korea will not be judged as severely as America. These nation's do not have the gospel truth as America has.
Actually in the Romans 1 sense America has already been judged by God. Because this nation has turned away from God as we see the rise of homosexuality.
Bro I love you and respect you. But we may have to agree to disagree. I do believe though we both have a heart for the gospel and to see
people come to Christ. In the end that Is what we pray for.
Bearmaster standing down.
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| | 2012/8/26 7:02 | | MaryJane
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Joined: 2006/7/31
Posts: 3057
| | Re: | | Chris wrote: And, of course, hurricanes have hit the Gulf Coast for centuries BEFORE they were heavily populated...long before Europeans or even Native American tribes heavily populated the area. Is it possible that this latest hurricane may simply be just another hurricane? Why is it that we have people publicly suggest that it is special "judgment" (or wrath) with every act of nature?
___________________________________
This is a very interesting point. I had not thought about that.
Thanks for sharing these things here with us. I will be honest you have given me much to think about. Like you I don't feel I have all the answers but I do think the best response we can have is to seek GOD and pray. I pray for President Obama(who is a lost sinner) just as I pray for Romney ( who is a lost sinner) Both of these men have an agenda they want to push through, neither one of them is CHRISTIAN so both need prayer and to be born again.
For me I think that you are right, there is no need to wring our hands in fear over possible coming persecution but there is opportunity to pray, to repent of personal sins, and to share with all the good news of JESUS CHRIST.
Chris I just wanted you to know I may not always agree with you on everything but I do appreciate your heart in what you share :)
God Bless
maryjane |
| | 2012/8/26 8:29 | Profile | ginnyrose
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Joined: 2004/7/7
Posts: 7534
Mississippi
| | Re: Has anyone noticed???? | | Just checked the weather forecast for Isaac...
Looks like it it will pass right over us and miss Tampa with a direct hit. Mississippi is smack dab in the middle of its projected path. Looks as though it would be headed for Arkansas and Missouri. Yes!
If it comes our way, we will move things inside that could go a-flying - especially if you 50+MPH winds. And we will stay inside and watch it rain. Might be a good time to take a nap! :-)
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Sandra Miller
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| | 2012/8/26 8:58 | Profile |
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