"Too often, and for too long, American "Christianity" has been a political agenda in search of a gospel useful enough to accommodate it. There is a liberation theology of the Left, and there is also a liberation theology of the Right, and both are at heart mammon worship." R.Moore

"The liberation theology of the Left often wants a Barabbas, to fight off the oppressors as though our ultimate problem were the reign of Rome and not the reign of death. The liberation theology of the Right wants a golden calf, to represent religion and to remind us of all the economic security we had in Egypt. Both want a Caesar or a Pharaoh, not a Messiah." R. Moore

Good thoughts Frank. I agree. We need no such liberation theology, either left or right verions. The last thing we need is another "moral majority" or "Christian coalition." What we do need is a heaven sent revival on a national scale, without which our nation will surely perish in a fiery apocalytpic style end. And anytime such a revival has happened in the past, the fabric of entire nations changes. Economically, politically, and morally.

_________________
Jimmy H

Hi Jimmy, here is the whole article from Moore..........

A Mormon television star stands in front of the Lincoln Memorial and calls American Christians to revival. He assembles some evangelical celebrities to give testimonies, and then preaches a God and country revivalism that leaves the evangelicals cheering that they’ve heard the gospel, right there in the nation’s capital.

The news media pronounces him the new leader of America’s Christian conservative movement, and a flock of America’s Christian conservatives have no problem with that.

If you’d told me that ten years ago, I would have assumed it was from the pages of an evangelical apocalyptic novel about the end-times. But it’s not. It’s from this week’s headlines. And it is a scandal.

Fox News commentator Glenn Beck, of course, is that Mormon at the center of all this. Beck isn’t the problem. He’s an entrepreneur, he’s brilliant, and, hats off to him, he knows his market. Latter-day Saints have every right to speak, with full religious liberty, in the public square. I’m quite willing to work with Mormons on various issues, as citizens working for the common good. What concerns me here is not what this says about Beck or the “Tea Party” or any other entertainment or political figure. What concerns me is about what this says about the Christian churches in the United States.

It’s taken us a long time to get here, in this plummet from Francis Schaeffer to Glenn Beck. In order to be this gullible, American Christians have had to endure years of vacuous talk about undefined “revival” and “turning America back to God” that was less about anything uniquely Christian than about, at best, a generically theistic civil religion and, at worst, some partisan political movement.

Rather than cultivating a Christian vision of justice and the common good (which would have, by necessity, been nuanced enough to put us sometimes at odds with our political allies), we’ve relied on populist God-and-country sloganeering and outrage-generating talking heads. We’ve tolerated heresy and buffoonery in our leadership as long as with it there is sufficient political “conservatism” and a sufficient commercial venue to sell our books and products.

Too often, and for too long, American “Christianity” has been a political agenda in search of a gospel useful enough to accommodate it. There is a liberation theology of the Left, and there is also a liberation theology of the Right, and both are at heart mammon worship. The liberation theology of the Left often wants a Barabbas, to fight off the oppressors as though our ultimate problem were the reign of Rome and not the reign of death. The liberation theology of the Right wants a golden calf, to represent religion and to remind us of all the economic security we had in Egypt. Both want a Caesar or a Pharaoh, not a Messiah.

Leaders will always be tempted to bypass the problem behind the problems: captivity to sin, bondage to the accusations of the demonic powers, the sentence of death. That’s why so many of our Christian superstars smile at crowds of thousands, reassuring them that they don’t like to talk about sin. That’s why other Christian celebrities are seen to be courageous for fighting their culture wars, while they carefully leave out the sins most likely to be endemic to the people paying the bills in their movements.

Where there is no gospel, something else will fill the void: therapy, consumerism, racial or class resentment, utopian politics, crazy conspiracy theories of the left, crazy conspiracy theories of the right; anything will do. The prophet Isaiah warned us of such conspiracies replacing the Word of God centuries ago (Is. 8:12–20). As long as the Serpent’s voice is heard, “You shall not surely die,” the powers are comfortable.

This is, of course, not new. Our Lord Jesus faced this test when Satan took him to a high mountain and showed him all the kingdoms of the earth, and their glory. Satan did not mind surrendering his authority to Jesus. He didn’t mind a universe without pornography or Islam or abortion or nuclear weaponry. Satan did not mind Judeo-Christian values. He wasn’t worried about “revival” or “getting back to God.” What he opposes was the gospel of Christ crucified and resurrected for the sins of the world.

We used to sing that old gospel song, “I will cling to an old rugged cross, and exchange it some day for a crown.” The scandalous scene at the Lincoln Memorial indicates that many of us want to exchange it in too soon. To Jesus, Satan offered power and glory. To us, all he needs offer is celebrity and attention.

Mormonism and Mammonism are contrary to the gospel of Jesus Christ. They offer another Lord Jesus than the One offered in the Scriptures and Christian tradition, and another way to approach him. An embrace of these tragic new vehicles for the old Gnostic heresy is unloving to our Mormon friends and secularist neighbors, and to the rest of the watching world. Any “revival” that is possible without the Lord Jesus Christ is a “revival” of a different kind of spirit than the Spirit of Christ (1 Jn. 4:1-3).

The answer to this scandal isn’t a retreat, as some would have it, to an allegedly apolitical isolation. Such attempts lead us right back here, in spades, to a hyper-political wasteland. If the churches are not forming consciences, consciences will be formed by the status quo, including whatever demagogues can yell the loudest or cry the hardest. The answer isn’t a narrowing sectarianism, retreating further and further into our enclaves. The answer includes local churches that preach the gospel of Jesus Christ, and disciple their congregations to know the difference between the kingdom of God and the latest political whim.

It’s sad to see so many Christians confusing Mormon politics or American nationalism with the gospel of Jesus Christ. But, don’t get me wrong, I’m not pessimistic. Jesus will build his church, and he will build it on the gospel. He doesn’t need American Christianity to do it. Vibrant, loving, orthodox Christianity will flourish, perhaps among the poor of Haiti or the persecuted of Sudan or the outlawed of China, but it will flourish.

And there will be a new generation, in America and elsewhere, who will be ready for a gospel that is more than just Fox News at prayer.

http://www.russellmoore.com/2010/08/29/god-the-gospel-and-glenn-beck/

Interesting piece. But in all this Frank, you've still yet to address the fact that God used a man by the name of Cyrus to address the Jews concerning the rebuilding of their temple. This man named Cyrus definitely had perverted political motives in his action. The man was also the follower and propigator of a false and counterfeit religion. We can demonize the motives of Beck all we want. We can even demonize the motives of those who have assembled to hear what Beck has been saying. But, the reality and Scriptural truth of the matter is, historically God has used such situations to ultimately accomplish His will.

Please deal with the Cyrus issue. Such is something that has been tap danced around thus far. And appeals such as "wee little brother, I'm older than you" while I know said in love, don't undo the validity of the Biblical argument I've asserted. And in love brother Frank, as I know you and are of the same Spirit in the Lord and cherish your feedback greatly, to challenge you, please stick to the Scriptures. Unless you can show me how contextually from the Scriptures how Beck doesn't fit a type of Cyrus, then I cannot accept your counter arguments.

Cyrus was a pagan.
Beck is a pagan.
God used Cyrus to give a word.
Thus, I believe God can use Beck in the same manner.
Cyrus' word was: rebuild the temple.
Beck's word is: rebuild the temple (you and me).


That is the logic of my argument. Please show me where I'm wrong.

*edited for clarification*

_________________
Jimmy H

HI Jimmy, my theory is that you have constructed, on the flimsiest(its actually an embarrasment to the word flimsy) of construct, a theory that allows and justifies your admitted countless hours of watching and listening to this man for years. You yourself were asked for New Testement examples and the results were, to say the least, sad. You have put forward a thesis that cannot stand and you ask others to flesh it out, quite bold my young friend. Here is a Bible quiz for you.

"These men are servants of the Most High God, who are telling you the way to be saved."

Do you agree with this statement that was shouted loudly in the public square? Who could disagree? Given your theory, God could and would use this person to further His work, despite their employment and the spiritual status because it is the words that count, not the man or woman who proclaim them. You get 10 points for identifying the author, and an additional 10 bonus points for telling us what Gods reaction was. No help from the rest of the forum please :) .........brother Frank

_________________
Jimmy H

Jimmy,

I applaud you for thinking critically about this matter. I'm not sure I agree with your thesis, but at least you are using your "bean".

To me, here is ironic thing about this conversation. I thought Theology and Doctrine didn't matter all that much.... I thought it was all about the "life" and our experience. If one has ever listened to Beck, one would know that he has had some amazing experiences that he would attribute to his faith in God, more specifically, Jesus Christ, i.e. miracles, answers to prayer.... real experiences, in which he gives God all the Glory and Praise.

He has a testimony.

Why, when we are talking about his Mormon faith, is Theology and doctrine so important? I thought "what we believe" is secondary, but what we do and experience is primary.

Glenn Beck bodly talks about God, and Jesus Christ, in the public square, more than most evangelical Christians. He warns about coming judgment upon this nation, he calls for repentance and obedience, he exposes evil, he quotes from the bible, and he calls for and prays for revival...I thought that is what this whole web site was about!

Well brother Jimmy, since I cannot prove to you that there are things that God cannot do, I will leave you with your thesis. Let me know if you hear of any upcoming "Donkey" rallies and I may go with you :)

A final question, when a cultist stands up and tells the world that Jesus is not God, what spirit is he speaking with, a spirit of ignorance or a spirit of anti-chirst? ...............brother Frank

_________________
Jimmy H

Brother Frank, the next time I go to such a rally, I will probably go in order to preach. :-) I'll be sure to invite you though. I had thought about preaching at this rally, but, I went mostly just to observe and listen more than anything, and attempt to get a feel for what was happening. And I felt like I had nothing in and of itself to preach, so, I stayed silent.

_________________
Jimmy H