In this sermon, the speaker discusses his experience in sharing the word of God with Muslims. He mentions baptizing over 700 individuals and witnessing their eyes being opened to the message. The speaker emphasizes the importance of using the Bible to engage in conversations with Muslims and suggests selecting passages such as the Psalms and excluding Paul's writings. He also highlights the difference between forgiveness in Islam, achieved through good deeds, and forgiveness in Christianity, which is a gift offered to everyone through Jesus. The sermon concludes with a prayer for understanding and guidance in sharing God's love and forgiveness with Muslims.

Okay, thank you. Well, I think I'll just go ahead and start. I know the first session it took more time. What we will be, I'll be sharing with you today, it's kind of understanding the Muslim mindset. It's a course I put together to help churches and Christians, and I teach it in some of the colleges and seminaries, how to understand the Muslim mindset and how to reach them effectively. So, I'll be touching two areas out of this. One of the first areas is where we're going with understanding their mindset. And then, if the time permits, there's five concepts will help us to engage in a practical way in conversation with Muslims. Amen? Well, let us just ask the Holy Spirit to help us here. Father God, I thank you so much that we can come together here and learn. And as we're praying for the Muslim, and as we're engaging in conversation of telling them about your love and forgiveness, Lord, I pray for the seminar, and I pray with you, Lord, that you will give us the understanding you want us to understand. In Jesus' name I pray. Amen. Okay, so the materials is kind of from the Bible and also some information and instruction, and just feel free if you didn't understand some of the point, some of your, if you have a question, just feel free to ask me, and I'll try to do my best here. How many of you will agree about this statement? I know I'm talking to pastors and church leaders, but I believe that today I'm a believer because someone took the time and made the effort to get involved in my life. Amen? And it happened to me personally, the friend that who led me to the Lord, he took the time and the effort to share Christ with me. In fact, it was over three years, I know it's more than that, but I'll try just to put it in perspective here, that he took the time, and I rejected him many times, but he took the time and the effort to share Christ with me. There are five things we need to know about the Muslims, and as we engage with them. Number one is their face is different from yours. I wrote this down because I met a number of Christians, they think that our face and the Muslim face are somewhat similar, but they're not, it's totally different. And you're going to see that the concept of God, the Bible, Jesus, the prophets, all are different. And so we're not pretending somehow they're similar. And even we came in an area that our God and their God is not the same God. It was a time when the people, their saying is the same God, it's not the same God. Even in our Arabic Bible, it's written Allah, like in the book of John in the beginning, there were the word and the word, and until you come the word God. And we have Allah, and God create heaven and earth, we have Allah create heaven and earth. But the Allah we have in the Arabic is not the same Allah that the Muslims are worshipping. And this is one of the crucial areas we were going through. In Islam they said he's the creator, but as you go in, in fact from the first man has been created, Adam. We don't count Adam as a prophet. In Islam it's counted Adam as a prophet of Allah. For them, faith and culture, you cannot separate them. If you've been in the Middle East or in an Islamic country, the way they talk, the way they dress, the way they behave, it's all coming from their religion. So you cannot really separate them. And I like to throw this question all the time, how about your faith? Is your faith separated from your culture? And then, what is your culture really? This is between you and yourself to answer this question. They're proud of the language and the culture. And this is why we have a lot of Christians are worshipping in their own language because they're really proud of their language and culture. And when I became a Christian, and here in Canada, I do a lot of dialogue, sometimes debate, but I don't like debating. But in my ministry with them, in my interaction with them, some of them, they said, you should stop speaking in Arabic because you're not anymore a Muslim. So they're really proud of the language because they believe Quran came down in a pure Arabic and is the language of Islam and also is the language of God. Faith is not a choice, but is a part of their heritage. So they are born Muslim. In fact, my family, I have a cousin here in Canada, actually she's in Calgary, and I didn't know she was there until I was in one of the Sudanese weddings. I have a group of Sudanese Muslims from the north. I meet with them every Sunday night if I am in the country or in the city. And they get to know me very well. We meet in one of the favorite Canadian places, Tim Horton. And I turned Tim Horton in downtown Calgary to a church or a Bible study. So I meet with a number of them if I am there. And we got in a lot of biblical and religious discussions. And then one of the people get married and invite me to the wedding. And in the wedding, she recognized me, my cousin there. And so one of the things she said that your children should not be with you because they're born Muslim. They still have the Muslim blood. You are the one you choose to be a Christian. So it's not a choice. Islam for the Muslim is not a choice, but it's a heritage. In fact, when we look at the growth of the Muslim population, we have to understand it from the Muslim mindset, it's not from the Christian mindset. As a Christian, when we see a growth, that's because of the outreach and the evangelism we're doing. That's why we're growing. But in Islam, it's because of the birth, out of birth rates. They're growing. And this is why there are many, because it's part of their heritage. How about the culture of the West? From the Muslim mindset, now we know a little bit their heritage, where they're coming from, what they're proud of. They looked at the culture of the West as Christianity. And that's because of the spread of Christianity. You have the spread of Islam, and this is out of the Muslim mindset, the spread of Islam because of the invasion that Muhammad did in the area, and then he started to invade after that the Caliphs, or his successors, as they were invading different parts of the world. Recently, I was in Turkey, and I talked to a number of the Turkish people there, and all of them, they admit that Turkish, it was a Christian country. And it's kind of the birth of Christianity. Paul was there in Ephesus, and I actually went and visited Ephesus, and Azmir is one of the seven churches we have in the book of Revelation. And if you've been in Turkey, in Istanbul, I went to the Hagia Sophia. It was a church, and then it became a mosque, and now it's a museum. And you can see all the influence of Christianity in Turkey. But it was the invasion. So they look to it in the same way, of the spread of Christianity. Of course, it started by the Apostle, and that's in our Bible, and then by the Europeans, as they went, the Europeans to discover the world, and watch this one about the colonies. They think the colonies are spreading Christianity. In Sudan, my own home country, in the capital, there is a big Anglican church by the President Pallas. And this is where it used to be the General Gordon, the British governor, who ruled Sudan, and he built a big church in the middle of Khartoum. It's by the River Nile. And they look at that church. It's still there. Nobody use it because it's dangerous for the president and all the things. And there is an underground that General Gordon used to go from the palace to the church. So they closed all this and it became literally a base there. But the Sudanese, they look to this kind of part of the spread of Christianity. And then you look at North Africa, the Italian and the French. And this colony, they didn't live really a good repetition to the people there. They're kind of people, they came and they took the land and they slaved some of their people. And this is Christianity. And then the Western world. All these missionaries are going all over the world, are from the Western world. And this is the spread of Christianity. So the West is Christian. How they see that? The Western world is seen as Christian and corrupt. So what they have for it? They have no respect for it. In fact, the Muslim here in Canada, they warn their kids from associated with. I am in the way here, I guess. Let me see if I can move aside. Is that good? You guys, you can see the, okay. So they warned their kids in the public school to be associated with the Western people. And what they mean is to be associated with the Christians. And they count everybody is a Christian. And if you allow me to say that, even Madonna, she's a Christian. Because she wear the cross. Okay. So in our ministry and in Middle East, we avoid using the word Christians. Instead, we're using, we're the believer or the follower of the Lord Jesus Christ. And by the way, by using just the follower of the Lord Jesus Christ, it help a lot to spread the word and to evangelize. So when they ask me, most of the Muslim, they ask me, now you're a Christian. I said, no, I am the follower of the Lord Jesus Christ. They said, oh, all of us, we believe in the prophet Isa or Christ or Jesus. And here when the conversation, do you believe the same way I believe in him? And that will open a lot of opportunity to share Christ. How about the gospel? The gospel, it's a crime for a person to change his or her religion. Why? Because of the following things. Number one is the culture. As you remember, at the beginning of the slide, they're proud of their language and culture. Their religion is a culture. So the minute you believe in Christianity, you have to change your culture. You're rejecting the culture. And this is one of the things you face as you're witnessing to the Muslim. It's not only about what you believe. Maybe they will come in an area that, yes, Jesus is the way. Yes, Jesus is the answer. Yes, Jesus is more than a prophet. But the other thing that is dangerous for them is the culture. What I'm going to do with my culture. And this is one of the areas we have. Some of the Muslims, they return back to Islam because of the culture. I remember I was preaching in a revival meeting in Vancouver in the Iranian churches. They all came together and they asked me to come to preach. And during the weekend, there were three Iranians. They were wearing ladies. They were wearing the veil. Sunday, when I did conclude all the messages together and I gave the invitation, three of them and others, they came forward. They want to receive the Lord Jesus Christ. And we did the same day in the evening, kind of a follow-up for those who came forward. And to my surprise, these three ladies, they came back. But catch this. They took out the veil. But they were wearing a very short dress and revealing in the shoulders, just like Western ladies. In fact, I had a hard time to look at them because I didn't know where to look. And I told them, why are you dressing like this? You are dressed okay in the morning. They said, now we are Christian. You see? So, the culture. The other thing is community. And you heard this morning from the EFC and community for us is very important. I planted a number of Arabic churches. I have an Arabic church in Calgary. In special occasions and sometimes in weddings and funerals, the church is packed by Arabs. Not all of them attend the church, but this is the community. If there is a crisis, you will see all the Arabs, they come together. Even if they don't agree, like the Christian, we have a number of Christians, like the Catholic and the Orthodox. And then we have our evangelical group. They will all come together as a community. Even some of our funerals, we have Muslims there coming to the church. Because they are part of the Arabic community or the Iraqi community or the Lebanese community or the Sudanese community. You see everybody there. So, the other area, when they become a Christian, is dangerous for them because they are kicked out of the community. I've been in a number of Muslim funerals because I know some of the people in the community. And the second I walk to the funeral, there is just hush. This is the convert. This is the one who denies Islam. What is he going to say? What is he going to do? And because of our culture, because I carry kind of a religious title and all these things, out of respect, sometimes they will ask me to speak. At the same time, they are really worried what he is going to say. So, community. The other thing is physical. As I shared my testimony last night, some of the dangers, they are going to go through physical persecutions. And by the way, they know about it. But when they come to terms that, yes, this is the way we want to live, they know they are going to be persecuted. But they still want to accept the Lord. This is why the gospel is dangerous. I was pastoring for two years the underground church in the Emirates. And I got very depressed actually doing that. Can you imagine half or most of your congregation, they are in prison? Or they are going to be killed. I remember one of the baptisms I had a few years back in Easter. There were two ladies, Hanadi and Fatim. We baptized them in Easter. Their uncle got to know about that. He took both of them from the hair and smashes their face in the ground, in a concrete ground. He destroyed their features totally. I got to see them just when they got beaten. I didn't recognize them. I went to the refugee camps to see them there. And I asked them, what happened to you? They told me, Fatim, she talked because she was able to talk. But she had swollen lips from the beating. And tears started to come out of my eyes. They understood exactly why I cried. I felt so guilty what happened to them. And they said, Pastor, watch this please. Don't do that. We were baptized and the same day we remembered the resurrection of Christ. And now we're just beaten like him. We want to assure you we are true Christians. So this is the dangerous they go through. Economy. My father is a camel trader. When I became a Christian, nobody wanted to deal with him. He didn't become a Christian. His son became a Christian. Our culture is based on shame and honor. So I brought shame to the whole family, in fact to the whole tribe. So nobody will deal with my father anymore. Even those who are Muslim and became Christian. Nobody wanted to do a business with them. We just have recently a convert from Jordan in Calgary. His wife, she kicked him out. She just sponsored him as a new immigrant. He has a license of flying engineering and he built a website. He's a very intelligent man. She stopped the sponsoring. She kicked him out. She went and lied about physical abuse. But we straightened all these things up. So he has nothing. And I got to meet him at the Calgary Immigration Aid Society. I'm part of that organization. To meet new immigrants and able to evangelize them. And I couldn't stand beside him for one second. Because he's been in the street for a week and he smelled so bad. At the beginning, I didn't believe his story. Just the way he looked like and smell and all these things. And he has a high degree in computer. And he's a fly engineering and all these things. I couldn't really grasp it. And then when I get to know him more. And then he showed me his computer and his degree and some of the photos he has. He lost everything. And I told him, did you regret it? He said, no. We put him in the Salvation Army shelter for three months until our church adopted him. And we rented a basement and we found him some work. So this is the dangers that they go through, even here in Canada. What are some of the costs? Different view of life. And different way of thinking. And a different standard of behavior. And this is the cost we take to disciple them for the new life and thinking and behavior they're entering to. If you get with Canadian, I get to learn. Maybe you can correct me. Hockey is your politic. Like you guys, you like to talk about hockey. But for us, Middle Eastern and also people coming from Islam, politics is the issues. In fact, Islam is not just a religion. Islam is a government. There are politics. There are special laws. In fact, the Muslim, when I used to be part of the Muslim Brotherhood, we're the one we voted that Sudan will be an Islamic state. And now Sudan is controlled totally. Everything is controlled by Islam and the law of Islam. Same as Iran and Saudi Arabia and the Gulf. And even they want to turn Egypt to an Islamic state. But the president has put most of the fundamentalists in the prison. Because he knows the danger if Egypt became an Islamic state. He's going to lose everything. So politics is part of Islam. But within one name, that Islam, there is many difference. Number one, politics. I can bring two Iraqis here. One of them will agree about the invasion of Iraq. The other one will not agree. So as we administering to them, we just avoid politics. The other thing is ethnics. Not all the Muslims are in the same ethnic background. Even within the Arabs. My wife is a Jordanian-Palestinian. And I'm an Arab-Sudanese. Both of us, we speak Arabic. But we're totally different. Like I marry totally a stranger from my culture. So you need to learn that. And I'm going to show you how to do that. Religion. Most of the Western people, they thought that Islam is all one religion. No, they're different. You can see now, again in Iraq, the Sunni are fighting with the Shia. And by the way, they're more than Sunni and Shia. You have the Ahmadiyya has been persecuted in Pakistan. And by the way, if you have an Ahmadiyya in your community, they're very open. In fact, the mosque in Calgary, I'm dreaming and I'm praying. I might change it to a church. I go there and I take a lot of tour to the mosque. One time, there we were talking about, we have a discussion. Every time I take a tour, I have to make a discussion there with the imam. I told him, we're not coming like a tourist. We need to learn from you and we need to ask you a lot of questions. And one time, all the conversation is changed to Christianity. And they brought us PowerPoint and they were ready for us to demolish Christianity. And we keep telling them, sorry, sorry, that verse doesn't mean that. This verse doesn't mean that. The original word of that verse. And one of the leaders said, can we have a Bible study inside the mosque? I get a church to adopt that mosque. I'm working with that church. And the 20th of December last year, I asked the pastor of the church, can we have a service for the Muslim? Can I bring the Ahmadiyya group there? They want to see how we celebrate Christmas. In Sudan, alcohol is forbidden. The only day alcohol is allowed and there is no chug stop, it's opposite from Canada, is the 25th of December. Because this is the day when the Christians get drunk. So this is the understanding of Christianity. So I went to the mosque and I invited the leader to come to attend the Christmas service, the 20th of December, Sunday. And 21 of them came. And I asked the pastor, I said, well, I need the first two pews to be empty. I want to put them there in the front. Number one, I don't want to see what's happening around them. Because I get discouraged sometimes what happens inside the church. And then I want them to focus on the message and what's happening in the platform there. And it was a great time with the Ahmadiyya. They have a world religious conference. They invite Christians to come to speak about Christianity. They used to invite Catholics and the United Church and I attended one of them. And I told them that's wrong. If you really want to know Christianity, know it from the source, from the Bible. And I get to introduce them to some of the evangelical pastors there. So now whenever they have a world religious conference, they will ask me to come to speak. I said, no, I'm not here to be popular, just to be your speaker. I start to call some of the churches and to tell some of the pastors, will you like to go? And a number of churches now actually they have a burden for Muslims because they get to speak to them and to see them. So if you have an Ahmadiyya group in your community, oh, they're easy. You can get to their mosque. You can invite them to your church. But be careful what you're going to do because you want to present Christianity at the best. The other things, culture. As I told you, there is a different culture. And then language. Not all the Muslims, they speak Arabic. And not all the Arabs are Muslims. You have the Iranian, the Pharisee. You have the Pakistani, the Urdu. You have Indonesia. You have all kinds of languages. Yes, they all pray in Arabic. Even some of them, they don't understand, like just the old church in the Dark Ages. They're praying in Latin, but nobody understands what they're saying. Now, many of the Muslims actually, they pray in Arabic. But they don't understand what they're saying. I remember one time I was in South Africa. I went to a propaganda center. And I found the leader of the propaganda center, the Islamic propaganda center, he doesn't speak Arabic. And instead of going to preach the gospel, I started to interpret the Quran for them. Because they found an Arab man. Can you tell us what this verse means? Of course, I did it in my own way. OK. The ministry is a long-term commitment. I said this in one of the mission conferences. You can go to India for two years and come back. And you think that's over. No. The ministry is a long-time commitment. And I'm going to tell you why. To accomplish anything, you must commit time and effort in this kind of any ministry. This is one of the stages we take when we do Muslim ministry. Number one is a genuine friendship. It's not business. You have a deal, you convert them, and it's done. No. It's a genuine friendship. And we need to understand that. The other thing is visiting back and forth. I keep telling my Canadian friend, and I have an Arabic pastor here, he understands what I'm talking about. You guys have it easy in your ministry. Especially in visiting. In our culture, if you don't visit your members, the pastor not sending the elders, sometimes they will not come. They said, you don't care about us. In Easter and Christmas is one of our busiest time. I hit five homes, six homes a day for all my congregation. And I spend the whole two weeks just visiting them. If I didn't visit them, they think I'm mad at them. It's part of our culture. So visiting back and forth, not Tim Horton, not a Starbucks, in their home. That means you care about them. The other thing is caring and holiday. You know, the holidays, they will love to speak about the holiday, about the Christmas and Easter. I have a lot of Muslims, they come to my home. I have my son Joseph. When he was seven, eight, he get to know the drill. So I invite some of my Muslim friends, and after supper or dinner, or the time they will come here and we give them hospitality and all the things, I have Jesus' video. And I will stick it in, and between the meal and the dessert and the coffee, in our culture it's too much expensive to invite somebody in. Because you have to give them all kind of things, the meal, the dessert, and then tea, and then coffee, and between each one is a snack and other things. So they're there for a long time. So you stick the video. So my son, he will come to me and have the video behind him. He said, now daddy, in Arabic it's baba. Now it's baba? I said, no, no, no, just let them finish the meal. And then he will come. Now kind of, because he likes to use the machine and putting in. So this is one of the area you can explain about your belief. Bible study. And I said to get advice, because not all the Bible accepted by the Muslim. The only things in the New Testament accepted is the Psalms, the Zabur of David. And you can select some of the wonderful prayer, and they love it. And then in the New Testament, take Paul out. They think Paul is the big liar. By the way, Muslim, they hate Paul. Until they get to know the Bible, and then you can introduce them to Paul. And then in the four gospels, they don't like Luke. They think Luke is a fake gospel. And then they don't like Mark. They don't think that Mark is eligible enough to be with Jesus. They don't like John. They have bad things about John. They call him bad things, because he was the friend of Jesus. So the only things, they have Matthew. And within Matthew, there's only three chapters can work with them. Do you know what these chapters? Five, six, and seven, correct. Most of the Muslim, they come to know the Lord through the Sermon on the Mount. I came to know the Lord through the Sermon on the Mount. It's one of the effective ones. In fact, when I was in Edmonton, the mosque, they sent me one of their machineries called Dawa. He came to convert me back to Islam. They hid me down there. So I said, oh, my original name is Omar. Oh, we'll take care of Omar. And he came, and he wanted to convert me. I told him, look here. I know the Quran. I know the Bible. You only know the Quran. So our level is not really the same. You need to know the Bible. He said, I know the Bible. So I examined him in one of the, I gave him some of the funny question and hardest question. And he couldn't answer. I said, you see, you're not qualified. You're not in the same level as I am. So you need to know your Bible, and then we can enter to a discussion. He said, how I can do that? I said, well, I can tell you about the Bible. So I started with the Sermon on the Mount. And guess what? The third time, he said, oh, you're coming to convert me, aren't you? I said, no, you're going to be at the same level as I am. And then he quit. He said, no, this guy is too dangerous for us. He's going to convert us. But I'm not really. But when you give a Bible study to the Muslim, they need to know what to do and not to do. This is what Islam is. Islam is kind of a set of rules. And the Sermon on the Mount will help you. I was talking to one of the Shiites, Lebanese. Whoever looks to a woman and desires her, he sins in his heart. And he said, how we can do that? That's too hard. Because in Islam, you're allowed to look. I said, in Christianity, we're not allowed to look. He said, oh, your religion is harder than ours. I thought ours is hard. So the Sermon on the Mount will speak, in fact, to Islam itself. Because some of the things happening in Islam is totally opposite from the Sermon on the Mount. And they will get to know Christianity. Adopt a new believer. As I told you, we adopted Abdullah, the Jordanian guy, now our church. I am adopted by the Iskander family. As you're ministering to them and welcome them, you're going to come to a place you have to adopt them. Are you willing to do that? Are you willing to take them in to find a place for them as they've been kicked out? We have two converts now who take care of my Arabic church in Calgary. We just have Abdullah. And before that, we have a young Palestinian lady. Her name is Sarah. We put her with one of the widowers, a lady. We tell her, can you take care of her? And she treats her just like her daughter. It's more than just sharing the gospel. It's to accept them. There are five things to do. I'm going to go through this very quickly. All of you are theological here and maybe expert in the Bible. But this is the things is to love and pray for them. As I said last night, pray for them. By praying for them, you will start to love them. And I pick Isaiah 11 too. There's seven things you need to pray about for yourself and also for them. I'm going to go quickly in this because it's biblical. You guys, you know your Bible. Communicate Christ. You want to help them to discover the truth. Most of the Muslims, their question is, I want to know the truth. What is the truth? I'm involved in TV program. I'm involved in radio. I'm involved in other things. And most of the call comes, we need to know the truth. I don't want you to become like me. I want you to use the Lord Jesus to you and you to him. This is exactly what we're doing. And of course, it's the work of the Holy Spirit. Without the Holy Spirit, we can do nothing. Talk about the Lord Jesus as a natural part of your life. Use Christmas, as I said, and Easter to your full advantage. They would like to know. Open your church to them. Tell them about it. And of course, in the Western world, Christmas and Easter is being changed. One of them to Santa and the other one to the bunny and the egg. But you need to explain it to them. Do not compromise and do not criticize. I am not ashamed. Separate biblical truth and personal choices. Believe in the Lord Jesus is a biblical truth. Attending, they have nothing there. You just put your church is a personal choice. Sometimes in our approach, we bring the church before Jesus. But we need to bring Jesus and then the church. Be firm, but not fanatic. And I'll explain this. Handle criticism. How to handle criticism? In Islam, they criticize Christianity very much. In fact, they're quick to criticize your belief. And sometimes we're shy to criticize theirs because it's not part of our nature. It's not part of our belief. How are you going to handle this criticism about Christ? For instance, they rejected Jesus not because we make him God only or the son of God. We can explain this. But there's more than that. For instance, the Muslim, they... Okay, this is a very little example here, but it's big. The Muslim, they believe God everywhere except one place he cannot be. The washroom. God has not existed in the washroom, by the way. I am serious. So, when you look to Jesus and we say Jesus is God and became human. He ate and drank. Does he need to go to the washroom? How come God can go inside there if he's God? And they will criticize you for that. I was in Durban in South Africa. Again, I was faced with a group of Muslims. They're all African converted to Islam. And the leader, the sheikh actually, he met me there and he came... No, he didn't came. Actually, he sent people to one of the churches. I was sharing my testimony and doing the same things I'm doing here. And they said, so-and-so, he would like to meet with you. So, I got some people to go with me because I was afraid to get kidnapped because I experienced this before. So, I went there and he brought a lot of Africans being converted to Christianity, to Islam. And he said, look at this. He wants to challenge me. I told him, can I talk to them? He said, sure. So, the first one in front of me, I said, why you became a Muslim? He said, my God doesn't go to the toilet, to the washroom. And a number of them, they became Muslim because God doesn't go to the washroom. So, I didn't know what to do. I just asked God quick text messaging, if you allow. He was talking about the text messaging there. Can you help me? So, I asked him, where is in the Bible that says Jesus went to the toilet? They told us everything about Jesus. He slept, he drank, he ate, he did this, he did that. Where is in the Bible? If you found it in the Bible, I will turn to Islam right away. And guess what? They were looking. Try to find a verse that says Jesus went to the toilet. That is a big issue for them. Be understandable. At the same time, be humble. You need to listen and to listen and to listen. I thank God for my friend who listened to me. And he get to know what I was looking for. I was looking for forgiveness. In the Emirate, I was talking to one of the people there. And somehow our conversation turned about Jesus being the light of the world. And I was sitting with him and I was sharing about Jesus being the light of the world. I don't know what really I said. I said a lot of things. I was talking for hours with him. If you ask me to recap, I don't remember. And that was at night. And then I went the second day to see him. And he said, guess what? I said, what? He said, you were talking about the light last night. I dreamt about that light. It was a pleasant light. Do you think that was Jesus? I told him, maybe it's the light of the Quran. He said, no, no, no, no, no. Don't tell me this. I said, oh, this is the light of Muhammad. He said, no, no. This is a different light. And I started to listen to him. And then I told him, are you willing to accept that light? He said, yes. I took him to one of the corners and he received Christ there. Do not criticize Christians. At the same time, don't defend them. One time I was recording my radio program. It was the ASNIC Radio 101.9 FM in Edmonton. And I recorded Wednesday night and then it's broadcast on Sunday. The same day, the Muslim, they will come and record. I record from 6 to 8. They will come and record from 8 to 10. And one time as I was sitting and recording, I see from the production room, there's a big glass window. I can see the people outside. And from the tip of my eyes, I can see somebody coming back and forth. I look at the time. I still have time. What's going on? So after I finished my sentence, I got really disturbed. I can't think anymore. I stopped recording. And then I shut the microphone off so the red light outside went off. That will tell that there is no recording. And it was the imam. He rushed inside the production room. And he has a newspaper in his hand. And he said, is that Christianity? He is so angry at me because he knows I am a convert. I am not only a convert. I am a pastor and I preach Christianity. And he wants to see any way to broach him. It was in the newspaper at that time when the Anglican Church approved homosexuality. Again, I sent a quick text to him. I opened the Bible, the letter to Roman, Chapter 1. And I told him, can you read it? I blocked Paul in the top there so he doesn't. And I let him read it. So they said, oh, there again is the book. I told him, I'm not here to tell you there again is or with. This is our belief. I'm not here to criticize them. At the same time, I'm not going to defend them. But you have to point just to your Bible. In the past, before the Iraqi war and the Afghani, the Muslim, they were accusing us we're divided as Christians. And now we can see them from the news. They're divided. In fact, they kill each other. So we just need to show them the love of Christ. Avoid debating. I'm an apologetic. I do some debating, but now I stopped doing debating. In fact, now I'm taking across Canada, especially in the university, I'm doing dialogues. We just finished a dialogue in Calgary. And in October, I'm going to do two, another one in Calgary and in Edmonton. And then I will be going at the end of the month to Montreal to do another dialogue at Maygall University. And my visit tomorrow to Vancouver, I'm going to meet with some of the university chaplains to see if I can do some dialogue at some of the university in Vancouver. This is one of the areas, actually, it's kind of massive evangelism. You bring a dialogue and the Muslim, they will love that. Hundreds and sometimes thousands of them. They fill the whole auditorium. And this is the opportunity to share. Last dialogue, what about social injustice? The coming dialogue about Jesus in the Quran and in the Bible. Each speaker will speak only to his. And then we give the materials. Some of the things I give to the brother here is very important. In fact, when I was in Turkey, I couldn't speak to the Turkish because they don't speak very good English. And at the same time, they hate Arabs, so I couldn't speak Arabic with them. And I have these materials, actually, in the hotel where I am. I stayed there for five days. I said I'm going to do my hit at the last day. But I friended all the waitresses, all the workers, or the one who will come and clean the room. I give them high five in my way. They think that I'm an American, black American. Some of them, they said, oh, do you know Michael Jordan? Do you know some of Michael Jackson's moves? So they thought that I'm a black American. And at the last day in Turkey, I have a whole bunch of road to Damascus. And I start to give it to them. No one rejected because I friended with them. And I have the opportunity to share Christ. So avoid debating. Alternative, listen and share. Debate, of course, where you listen to yourself. And because of the debate I used to do in Edmonton, I just closed the door totally. The whole Muslim community, they just hated me when I was doing debate. In fact, I have in Edmonton a nickname. They call me Iskander the Devil. Because of what I do, like try to destroy Islam and the characters of Muhammad, their prophet. And one day I went to the Arabic shop to buy some of the things. And it's one of the newest one. I went there. And he said, I never saw you here. Are you from the Arabic community? I said, yeah. He said, what's your name? I said, I'm Wajdi. He said, I never heard about you. I said, I'm Iskander the Devil. Oh, hi. How are you doing? You are Iskander the Devil? I said, yeah, I'm Iskander the Devil. And that's because of the debate. You generate conflict or create conflict, generate pride, and also never promote friendship. So just if you want to make a big event, just a dialogue, a friendly dialogue, and use some of the materials to help with that. Respect their culture, tradition, and belief. Ask and learn about their history and culture. They know I am from a Muslim background. They know I know the Koran and all the things. But they're still interesting. Like one of the things, if you come to my office in Calgary, I have a pile. Actually, it's become too much. I want to get rid of them. All about Jesus in the Koran. As I meet the Muslim, I said, well, what does the Koran say about Jesus or Islam? Even though they know I know it, they know that I came from that background, they still have hope. So the next day, they will come and a whole printed verses from the Koran about Jesus. And by the way, Jesus has been mentioned in the Koran 93 times. All nice things about him. And that will be kind of a gate for you to enter into a conversation. Why say this about Jesus? Why say this about Jesus? And the Muslim cannot say any bad things about Jesus. Only that Jesus has been mentioned in the Bible. Being the son of God and being God and crucified and all these things. Avoid these things. You have other things you can enter into a conversation with them. So ask them about their culture, where it's coming from. But you be ready to answer their question because they're going to ask you a lot of questions. Go overboard in respecting their culture and behavior. Never contradict what is said. They're going to say a lot of things you're not going to like it. Never contradict it. Just say, that's interesting. Even if he said that, I beat up my wife and said, oh, that's interesting. So just... Okay. You need to respect yourself. Be honest and polite. And this is why, actually, I brought the Muslim leader and put them in the front. Because sometimes in our churches, we don't respect ourselves in worship. I remember this from the first mistake. This is why I put it in this course. The first mistake I did, I brought a couple, a Muslim couple with me to the church. I was afraid they would not feel comfortable. So I put them in the back of the church. And they know me. And they were singing, and their husband and wife were there. And the husband started to wrap his wife's back, you know, like any other Western guy is being a good husband. The pastor would love him for that. But they were angry. And they left the worship. The next day, when I went, there's a community. There was a big rumor. Watch the church. They practice sex in the church. I said, no, don't do that. He said, they saw it. There was sex while you guys are praying. And he was just wrapping her shoulder. So this is why, when I brought them to the church, I put them way, way. So I don't want them to see anything. So guys, we need to respect ourselves. At the same time, we need to be honest and polite for what we are doing. Any meaningful dialogue with your cousin needed to start by walking with them, listening to them, and asking them questions. I give this course sometimes in perspective course and in some of the colleges. And now let us see the pastors. What is this quotation coming from? Or what is where you see it in your Bible? The New Testament. After the Redirection. Yeah, Luke 24. The road to Emmaus. This is exactly what Jesus did. Any meaningful dialogue with your cousin, start by walking with them, listening to them, and asking them questions. The best way to minister to Muslims is not to give them a statement or preach at them. Just ask questions. And I like in verse 31 in Luke 24. After that, I like that their eyes were opened. As I mentioned yesterday, all over the world, God has helped me up to 2004 to baptize over 700. And I see most of them, their eyes were opened. Because I just used that message. Amen? How much time do I have? Because I was planning to go for a concert, but I don't know. 10-12 minutes. Okay, I don't think I can go for the concert. The second workshop is a repeat, yeah? It's a repeat, okay. So, maybe I'll try to send you the second part. It's very important. I'll go, okay, quickly. This is kind of the theological icebreak for Islam. It's about 90% belief and practice. Islam is all on belief and practice. Only 10% a theory, and that's coming from the Hadith. The Muslims, they have two books. The Quran is coming from God. And the Hadith is a saying of Muhammad, of some of the issues that they have in the community. So they will come, oh, prophet of God, what do you think about that? And then he kind of gives them some saying, and that's what we call the Hadith. And within the Hadith, there are only 10% theories. But all the theological break of Islam is kind of popular belief and practice. I'm going to jump quickly, if you allow me. There is five concepts. Actually, these five concepts will help you to enter into a conversation with a Muslim. But you need to know how they think. This is why I call this the Muslim mindset. Sorry, I'm going to jump through this quickly. This concept is kind of three areas. One area for information. So this is how the Muslim, they think. Only for information. You don't tell them, you think like that. They're going to tell you, no, no, no. Just like what you heard this morning about playing chess. When you play chess, you don't tell your component that this is the move I'm going to do. But you study their move so you can do your move. Are you with me, guys? OK. And then the theme, which you're going to repeat, and how you're going to do that. So I'm going to go through this very quickly because I want to respect the time here. Number five here, please don't play games or pretending somehow they're similar. Never talk about the differences. Immediately when you start to talk about the differences, you're going to lose track. But at the same time, don't play games. This is similar. OK. Especially with these five concepts. And this is a very important five concepts. I'm going to go quickly to them. Number one, their concept of God. As you look here, this is how they see God. And how the Muslim, they believe in God. He cannot understand the crisis. He's unpredictable, unknowable. Everything the Muslim about God, they know nothing. Even God, they don't know what he's going to do next. This is why they're scared of God. OK. So if you get to understand this about the Muslim, this is what we believe in. This is the theme. We know that God is a loving, seeker, deliverer, healer, savior, faithful, forgiving. Right? Amen, guys? I'll call your superintendents now. OK. You believe in this, yeah? So now you have to bring this story. The Muslim, most of the way you share with them is through stories or questions. So this is the things you need to bring it to them. So you know now what they know about God. This is your belief in God. And this is some of the way you use it. The slide I skipped is to use the Bible all the time. When the Muslim, they talk to you, they use the Quran and they use the Hadith. And sometimes we bring an illustration that does not even belong to the Bible. As if like our Bible is not enough to explain things. So they need to know what your Bible is saying about this. OK. The second concept is the concept of sin. Sin is a mistaken choice of a slip of memory. It's God's fault. If I am hungry today, I don't have any money, and somebody, one of you left your wallet here, I have the right to steal. It's God's fault. Because you know I am hungry, I don't have money, and somebody left his wallet, I have the right to steal. This is God's fault. It's not my fault. This is what they think is God's, it's justifiable. You know the most people, we think it's the Western world. The most people practice adultery in the world are the Muslims. And all of it is justifiable. Why? Because it can be composed by good deeds. Today the Muslim can go and steal $100, $10 can give it to a poor man, and he's OK. You see? He can go commit adultery, and go and have an extra bowing in the mosque. And that will give him good deeds. OK? And everything is over about sin. OK? This is why some of the areas I enter in dialogue with Muslims is the concept of God, the concept of sin, and the other concept I'm going to show you. And most of the conferences I spoke at the Muslims, like with Ahmadiyya and the dialogue and all these things, I touch this issue because I know that they don't have any answer. And we have the answer. OK? So this is our number 10. This is how we look at sin. So how are we going to bridge that? By the stories in the Bibles. Are you with me? Sorry, I'm going fast just to respect the time here. OK, about faith. We know that accepting and acting upon what God says, this is faith to us. For them, faith is trying to keep the rules. Trying to do the ritual. OK? Knowing the fact and defending. What that means, my wife, she led a Turkish lady in Edmonton to the Lord. Her husband, he breaks every single rule in Islam. He's an alcoholic, he's a womanizer, he steals, he does a lot of things, he cheats in his taxes, he's just unbelievable. And we get to know the family very well. And my wife friended his wife, and they spent a lot of time, and in fact, actually, the reason she became to Christianity, because she asked my wife if I beat her, and my wife, she said no, and he said, that means he doesn't love you. And then she showed her how, what's woman in the Bible, and she liked it. And then they entered to more biblical discussions. When she accepted the Lord, and she was about to be baptized, Omid came and he was angry at us. In fact, he wanted to fight with me, because of what my wife did to his wife. I told him, Omid, look here, you're not really a Muslim, in my country you'll be stoned to death because you're an alcoholic. You do this, you do this, you do this. But you know, he has the right to defend it, as a Muslim. And by doing that, he's going to get to doing as much good as possible. In the mind of Omid, defending his wife, and defending the right, he gets ten good deeds in heaven. So he's kind of, there is hope for him. So this is faith to them. In Christianity, it's to respond to God, and personal relationship with God, life transforming, and enlightened heart and mind. All of you know this kind of thing. This is what faith is for us. So how are you going to gap that one with this one? By using this. The concept of forgiveness. I remember in Medicine Hat, I was doing a Muslim-Christian dialogue. And at the end, the Muslim speaker didn't know what to say about forgiveness. Because it did not exist there. So, for them, God's forgiveness has no objective base. Nobody knows if he's going to be forgiven or not. Impossible to know. A certain amount of forgiveness will be achieved by good deeds again. No one, God or human, grantees forgiveness in Islam. No one. And when I talked about forgiveness, he couldn't answer. In fact, both of us will be given 20 minutes. I talked for 25 minutes, and he talked for 15 minutes. And most of the 15 minutes, he was repeating himself, good deeds, good deeds, good deeds. He couldn't answer. He couldn't give a presentation about forgiveness in Islam. So, in Christianity, it's a gift and has an objective base offered to everyone. This is what forgiveness is in Christianity. How are you going to do it? Use a story from the Bible. And by using a story from the Bible, by using your Bible, will give them an anger. They want to know more what is written in your book. The last one, the concept of eternal life. In Islam, unknowable, uncertain. Is it physical and sensual? Sometimes in my seminar or my talk, I said, Las Vegas is the holiest heaven in Islam. Because all the things are going to be in heaven. Sometimes when the Muslims come around me, they say, why did you become a Christian? I'm not going to destroy Islam for them because they're going to hate me. I'm not going to generate any good thing. I said, well, I became Christian because of heaven. They said, what do you mean? I said, well, heaven in Christianity is like this. I go to the book of Revelation and how it's been painted by John, the new Jerusalem. And I told them, oh, there is no marriage, there is no sexual, I'm talking about my heaven, but at the same time I'm talking about their heaven. And their heaven, whatever is forbidden here, whatever is forbidden, whatever will come to your mind, even homosexuality, is going to be in the Islamic heaven. Anything you're thinking about is going to be there, and only for men. So this is one of the areas I use a lot when they ask me the question, why you became a Christian. So projected into the future, even Muhammad himself, he doesn't know if it's going to happen or not. There is a clear verse, I'm not even going to enter it. And what Muhammad said to his people, I'm going to ask God to let me in. And if he let me in, I'm going to ask for my people. What happens if God says no to Muhammad? Of course they're going to say, oh, no, he cannot say to Muhammad. He's the favorite prophet in the eyes of Allah. He's not going to forbid him. So they have that hope. But there is not any hope for their eternal life. In Christianity, I know you can bring more points than I have for you here. And then some of the stories you can illustrate. In conclusion, as I said last night, pray and pray and pray. Use the Bible, ask them to read the passages, like what I did with the imam when he came to the production room. Do not use pressure, tactic, or threat, or manipulation. It can work with a Western mind, but it doesn't work with Muslims. They're willing to bomb themselves, so this kind of pressure doesn't work with them. Move at their speed. How you can do that? Measuring process of their readiness to verbalize biblical concept. Just like the one I talked to him about the light. If they start to kind of verbalize the concept that you use, some of the things you use, that means they're thinking about it. So you can move to the next point. You don't need to do it like the way I did it, but as the Lord will lead you, the Spirit will lead you inside your heart. Some of the area, as you're listening to them to see what their need is, where they're struggling spiritually. So you can start to work with them in that area. Amen?