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 Re:

I think 'discerning' and the 'discerning of Spirits' are two different things.We all discern to a certain degree and according to your sensitivity to the spirit some may discern more easily than others.I think the 'discerning of spirits' though is a gift or an ability that God gives you.







 2006/2/9 15:06
philologos
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Joined: 2003/7/18
Posts: 6566
Reading, UK

 Re:

Quote:
Am I making sense?

Sounds sense to me. :-D I think we do well to be cautious about 'judging' another man's spirit.


_________________
Ron Bailey

 2006/2/9 15:34Profile
Compton
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Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 2732


 Re:

Speaking of discernment…. I discern a cynical function behind what has been popularly accepted as “The Gift of Discernment.” ;-) Often I have seen this gift used as a pious pseudonym for practicing presumption rather then taking the effort to really know each other. (Personal proverb: never trust a carpetbagger who practices the gift of discernment.) The abundant but confusing (popular) material on this subject frustrates me. Much of what is accepted as authentic biblical teaching on the gift of discernment smacks of superstition.

I would like to hear more about the community or body aspect that Ron was bringing up. For instance is the case of Thyatira, which was growing in love and faith but tolerating the false teaching of Jezebel, a good example of where the gift of discernment could have helped a church? Could the gift of discernment be more concerned with the spirit behind a doctrine or teaching or even cultural practice…as opposed to ”exposing” an individual’s spirit?

MC


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Mike Compton

 2006/2/9 15:50Profile
PreachParsly
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Joined: 2005/1/14
Posts: 2164
Arkansas

 Re:

How come no one ever talks about the gift of suspicion? Oh wait... that's not a gift..

:-P


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Josh Parsley

 2006/2/9 16:01Profile









 Re:

PreachP. you said it right on the previous page.

We all [u]should[/u] have discernment, and you gave an excellent verse (in fact one I had hoped 'someone' would have finished on, on another thread ;-) ) ... and that the 1Corth 12 "gifts" are not "resident", but as God sees fit, He'll use anyone in, anyone or more of them.

As it is written in that Chpt... God could use you in all 9 today and one tomorrow and none for a year... "as He wills".

Watchman Nee was good about that other discernment though ... that we all should have .... because Jesus walked in a constant state of discernment ... if we can "walk in the Spirit" .... then we'd have that as Jesus walked in.

That's why He became dependent on the Holy Spirit as an example unto us, how we should/could walk.

I fear for folks who do not believe that we can walk as He did ... because He did it 'for' an example for us. (Emptied Himself to become 'dependent'.)

We should have all the same functionings of The Holy Spirit that Jesus operated in.

Some as God Wills, when He Wills, but as far as fruit or productivity in the ministry ... it would be nice to see less of "self" in ministers and more of just "walking in the Spirit" alone.

Bless Him.

 2006/2/9 16:26
jimbob
Member



Joined: 2005/9/25
Posts: 131


 Re:

Yeshua, sounds like a lot of discerning going on down there in Florida.

Let me say up front that I don't doubt what you say at all, but my question is have you ever ran into someone who wasn't a professing christian who had similiar abilities?

The reason I ask is because a long time ago I knew a guy who was a self described "Jewish Mormon" when I lived in Utah. This guy's abilities were simply uncanny.If you lost something in your house he could tell you where to find it, without ever having been to your house! He could read aura's and tell where your body aches were, and what your disposition that day was. He had insight and his stuff was right on.

I wonder how someone who doesn't profess Christ (at least like we do) can present the same type of gifts with roughly the same or better accuracy as a believer.

Could this be an innate gift that some people might be born with, apart from their belief system, and then used for good or ill according to their beliefs? (Like shamen/witch doctors)I suppose some might say it's a demon when an unbeliever does it, but the Holy Spirit when a believer does it, but I'm not sure it's that simple.

Did you ever have these abilities prior to your baptizism? Or did it one day just start happening?

Anyway, my "Jewish Mormon" friend still makes me scratch my head after all these years.

 2006/2/9 17:16Profile









 Re:

Pharoah's Magicians duplicated some of the miracles that God did through Moses ... so I'd have to say ... there are only two 'super'natural powers in this universe and one is Satan's.

 2006/2/9 17:25
ccchhhrrriiisss
Member



Joined: 2003/11/23
Posts: 4527


 The purpose of discernment...

Hi YeshuaIsMyGd...

Quote:
"I can tell" = by the power of the Holy Spirit

I can tell if someone is Christian.
I can tell if someone is possessed, and sometimes how many demons are in that person.
I can tell if someone is going to get angry in 10 seconds, by the way I feel their spirit stur up. And can stop it, because of that knowledge.
I can tell when someone is in the flesh. (doing things on their own will)
I can tell when someone else is getting blessed.
I can sense someone's calling. (Prophet, janitor, preacher, evangelist..etc; that relates to that person)
I can NOW, (before I couldn't) almost find the ROOT of someone's problems.
I can sense someone's feelings miles away, after thinking about them for a little bit.
I can tell the maturity of a person, in their walk, and in their life.
I can tell when someone has been turning away from God.
I can tell when their are demonic creatures in my area, or certain areas that I drive by."
I can sense angels as well.
I can tell when Jesus is about to come completly with POWER. (like, when worship turns from good...to GREAT)
I can spot false christians/prophets/etc.
I can tell when someone is offfended. (I'm trying to be more pro-active on this)

This is a wonderful gift to have -- if it used the way that the Lord intended. Unfortunately, as others have mentioned, people often confuse the gift of "discerning of spirits" with a "feeling of suspicion." In fact, some of those that claimed to have "the gift of discernment" were often some of the worst discerners in the Church! They loudly proclaimed the things that they "supernaturally discerned." But when they were proven wrong, they only admitted that they "are only human." They almost forgot that, in some cases, there was a great deal of damage done. And the person claiming such a gift often continues to proclaim their spiritual discernment.

Have you ever heard a believer state, "I know this about you..." and it was totally out in "left field?" This has happened more times than I can count! It has happened at Church, in prayer meetings, and even in these forums. Often, such "discernment" leads to confusion or hurt feelings.

Most of the time, people attempt to speak how they discern "good things" about the lives of others. But ever so often, I have heard or read the "discernment" where believers state, "I know you are thinking this...or that..." or "I know you feel this way about me, because God told me so" or "I know what you're trying to do..." This has happened to me on numerous occassions. And almost every time, those people were completely wrong.

I suppose we should try and "discern" what the [i]purpose[/i] of the "gift of discernment" is all about. Is it meant as a means for God to [i]warn[/i] the "spiritual people" in the Church? Is it meant as a way to strengthen a believer or group of believers against the deception of the Kingdom of Darkness? Why does it often seem that many people use this "gift" to "gossip" or "accuse?" And why do so many people that have the "gift of discernment" often disagree about the things that are "discerned?"

I do believe in the gift of "discerner of spirits." However, only God can know the heart of a person. We should not suppose that God is going to reveal the motives of the heart of believers with whom we are suspicious or disagree. But this is a great topic for discussion -- and I am reading everyone's comments with great interest. However, I do think that we should be careful not to mistake "discernment" with "suspicion." I am wondering if anyone else has had a bad experience with a person claiming such a gift? And what do you think this gift is truly all about?

:-(


_________________
Christopher

 2006/2/9 23:24Profile









 Re:

Let me answer some of your question Jim.

Quote:

my question is have you ever ran into someone who wasn't a professing christian who had similiar abilities?



No. Never ran into anyone. I have heard a few stories. One comes to mind. In a service someone rebukes someone (divinly led) and the 'mock' person says 'you are of satan'. And then the 'mock' person gets caught in the lie of their 'discernment' and gets kicked out or demons casted outta them. (I don't remember the exact ending cause i've heard similar stories like that, different endings)

Quote:
I wonder how someone who doesn't profess Christ (at least like we do) can present the same type of gifts with roughly the same or better accuracy as a believer.

Could this be an innate gift that some people might be born with, apart from their belief system, and then used for good or ill according to their beliefs? (Like shamen/witch doctors)I suppose some might say it's a demon when an unbeliever does it, but the Holy Spirit when a believer does it, but I'm not sure it's that simple.



The enemy has power. Just not as much as us Christians.

The enemy can heal people. Prophesy. And do many things a Christian can do. But by the power of Satan, wheither they know it or not.

True witchdoctors cause havoc. True 'spiritists' cause trouble. Because they have POWER from below. We have it from above, which is better. Does this answer your question? Or do I need to describe it more?

Oh, and by the way, some can be just doing it 'in the flesh' as well. And not a counterfit. (like what I described)

Quote:
Did you ever have these abilities prior to your baptizism? Or did it one day just start happening?



They happened after I received the Holy Spirit, NOT when I did, but AFTER.

And that was AFTER water baptism as well.

I prayed for it. And it happened, it freaked me out at first.

 2006/2/9 23:38









 Re:

I guess everyone will just have to drive down here and go to church with me!

YeshuaisMyGod,
Your right down the road from this church.How about you attend and tell them what you've found out! :-)

 2006/2/9 23:45





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