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Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : Why would anybody still use the KJV?

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philologos
Member



Joined: 2003/7/18
Posts: 6566
Reading, UK

 for further reading

In trying to be simple I think I have erred on the side of the simplistic in the last main post. For quick explanations of the different manuscript families, wikipedia is not a bad place to start. Just click for more accurate information.

1. [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Byzantine_text-type]Byzantine textform.[/url]
2. [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexandrian_text-type]Alexandrian textform[/url]
3. [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_text-type]Western textform[/url]
4. [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caesarean_text-type]Caesarian textform[/url]
5. [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Textus_Receptus]Textus Receptus (the Received Text)[/url]


_________________
Ron Bailey

 2006/1/28 10:19Profile









 Re: Bibles anyone?

Don't mean to get off topic, But I have small pocket size bibles, a couple of medium size bibles that I have literally laying around. If anyone would like me to send them to you for your outreach purposes, I would be happy to free of charge shipping to North Americans, overseas I can only send one. If your a KJV only person, I don't want to send them to you, only to have them for a burning session. Some are KJV, Gideon, Living, etc.. PM me. Thanks.

MOD: if this is soliciting please let me know, I will edit and replace with whats on topic. Thanks

 2006/1/28 12:16
Christinyou
Member



Joined: 2005/11/2
Posts: 3710
Ca.

 Re:

Hi Ron,

I don't believe that a conspiracy is what is going on with the Word. Conspiracy takes a hidden agenda and someone behind the scenes accomplishing a take over, or at least propaganda to change a situation or plan to fit the conspirator's will.

I think God allows this just like He allows evil and put it in the works when His plan was designed that we might see the truth of what the difference is when it comes to Good and evil and what the cost is if we choose evil over good, that is Satan over God.

I believe the Word of God is completely under His control and protection, and only He allows the counterfeit that the real thing is what we study and use as the truth. How do you detect a counterfeit, simply by knowing the real thing and the counterfeit won't stand up to the real thing.

We know Satan's deception and lies and counterfeit is flooding the world and still there are true conversions and turning to the truth and Christ and The Father. Satan's alternate plan from the Plan of God has always been Satan's agenda from the beginning, I guess you could call it a conspiracy, but it will only work if God allows it to show the truth of God's plan in Christ Jesus which was before the foundation of the world and before man was ever put into the equation Christ in you the Hope of Glory.

Ephesians 2:7-8 That in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Christ Jesus. For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

Ephesians 1:3-5 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ: According as he hath chosen us in Him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before Him in love: Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of His will,

IN Christ: Phillip


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Phillip

 2006/1/28 13:37Profile
BeYeDoers
Member



Joined: 2005/11/17
Posts: 370
Bloomington, IN

 Re: for philologos

Ron, do you prefer the KJV because you feel the Byzantine texts are more reliable, or is it just a matter of tradition and the simple fact that you enjoy it more due to the beauty of Elizabethan English? Also, have you written anything in defense of the KJV that you could disclose?


_________________
Denver McDaniel

 2006/2/4 17:02Profile
markm
Member



Joined: 2004/11/4
Posts: 46


 Re:

Quote:
Let a man study prayerfully any of the generally recognized versions, done by proficient and responsible scholars, and the Spirit will quicken the truth to his heart and lead him toward the ends God has in view for him. Almost everything depends upon his response to the Spirit's workings. While it is important that the translations be accurate and faithful, yet better versions do not make better men.



What makes the word of God living and active? The translators? The manuscripts?

 2006/2/4 22:28Profile









 Re: Why would anyone still use the KJV?

Quote:
What makes the word of God living and active?

Hi markm,

There are answers to this question in abundance, in the thread 'Born Again By What Means', (still active in this forum). Best for you to start at the beginning of it, as it's well-focused there.

As to the other two questions about translators and manuscripts, that thread doesn't touch on them; but, my own comment, (not having done the [i]study[/i] many others have), is that once one is born again, one can tell whether the translators knew the Lord, or were working without insight from Him. This is abundantly clear, when comparing simple Tyndale - a man who translated scripture knowing he would probably die for doing so (That's passion!) - with what has come after. (OK, I know that's a sweeping generalisation...... Young also captures [i]God's heart[/i], despite the bumpiness of the English prose.)

 2006/2/5 10:14
Clutch
Member



Joined: 2003/11/10
Posts: 202
Oak Ridge, Tennessee

 Re:

Hi Ya'll,
In 1978 when I was newly born again, I asked my pastor (Steve Byrd, Berean Baptist Church, Fayetteville, NC) which translation of the Bible I should use?

He gave me this sage advice, which I have passed on to others throughout the years.

He said: "Howard, There's enough salvation in John 3:16 for the whole world. I personally prefer and use the King James version, but the best translation of the Bible, is the one that you'll read."

I (Clutch)read the AV the most, but use other modern translations, and paraphrases for emphasis.After all, I am a simple man, and when you find something that works for you.....stay with it. 8-)

Blessings,
Clutch


_________________
Howard McNeill

 2006/2/5 18:29Profile
grod95
Member



Joined: 2005/9/1
Posts: 16


 Re: Why would anybody still use the KJV?

...for good reason, it is a reliable translation. The whole translation debate is quite wearisome. I am certainly not of the kjv-only camp. The information emerging from this camp is unedifying and misinformative. The NIV is good if you want a good thought-for-thought translation. The KJV and particularly the NASB Update are good word-for-word or literal translations of scripture. For the most part, none of us are Hebrew, Greek, and Aramaic scholars. Threre is no need to split hairs over such matters. Christ is coming brothers and sisters. We ought to prepare ourselves for His second Advent. :-)

 2006/2/5 19:57Profile
TaKa
Member



Joined: 2003/4/17
Posts: 124
Louisiana

 Re: Why would anybody still use the KJV?

There is a verse in the King James Version that troubles me:

Rom 8:16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God.

When I read this, I think to myself: Why would I want to read a Bible that calls God an "it".

Our great creeds say that the Holy Spirit is God.


_________________
Troy

 2006/2/5 20:49Profile
philologos
Member



Joined: 2003/7/18
Posts: 6566
Reading, UK

 Re:

BeYeDoers

Quote:
Ron, do you prefer the KJV because you feel the Byzantine texts are more reliable, or is it just a matter of tradition and the simple fact that you enjoy it more due to the beauty of Elizabethan English? Also, have you written anything in defense of the KJV that you could disclose?

My apologies for taking so long to get back to this. To answer the last question first... yes, and I will get to them soon... I promise.

As to the first question... I do have more confidence in the Byzantine Textform and am particularly 'annoyed' about the illogic of Westcott and Hort's theories of textual transmission. I think if I had been in their lectures I might have found myself on my feet crying 'look at the king... he's not wearing any clothes'. ;-)

As to the second part of the first question ;-) The KJV is actually formal Jacobean rather than Elizabethan. The language was a little archaic even in 1611. 'Thee' and 'thou' was already passed from ordinary speech so the KJV was always a bit formal and 'grand'. Part of its specification was to produce a thing of beauty; this is not always helpful although it may sound pleasant. The Greek of the NT was not 'beautiful classical Greek' but was Koine (common - market place) Greek. It is the truth which is beautiful and powerful rather than the linguistic style. The Message bible is hammered by most people but it has a point when it says that Koine Greek was 'the word on the street' rather than the flowing oratory of the academics.

The KJV is more 'beautiful' than Tyndale which can be a bit rugged, but they did sharpen some of Tyndale's language a little in the KJV. The KJV translators were slightly more 'literal equivalence' than Tyndale.

more soon...


_________________
Ron Bailey

 2006/2/9 15:49Profile





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