| Poster | Thread |
| | Homosexuality and the kingdom of God | | Hi everyone,
I did not want to put this on the other active thread that is currently unfolding here because I wanted to bring up a point that is not pertaining to the homosexual alone.
The following scripture was posted there, and it is this scripture that I would bring before you for discussion:
Quote:
Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites, nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God. (1Cor. 6:9-10, NKJV)
Now, we see some of all of us in this scripture, so let's not go off on the homosexual alone here, if you don't mind.
What I want to key in on is the kingdom of God. It says that they shall not inherit the kingdom of God. What is the kingdom of God?
Can I say that to many, the kingdom of God and the eternal kingdom after death are one and the same? If this be so, why did Jesus tell His disciples to preach that the kingdom of God is at hand. Why did Paul write in Romans that the kingdom of God is righteousness, heart peace, and joy in the Holy Spirit?
Religion focuses on sin, guilt, and unrighteousness. Christianity admits all these things, but provides aquittal. Is aquital only for those who reach sinless perfection as most demand the homosexual to do? Or is our aquital by placing the entirity of our eternal hope in Jesus Christ and accepting His imputed righteousness, purity, holiness, and perfection?
Is this blessed hope only for the drunkard, the theif, the gossip? Or does it apply to all, even though the war continues between flesh and spirit?
It is so easy for us to stand in front of church and gloat that we are "not like that man". We also know what Jesus thought about the man who stood in self righteous deception.
Is it not for the sick that the physician came? Have not all sinned and fallen short? Is there one single person here who can step forward and cast the first stone? Then how dare we single out one particular "sin group" as "different" from us?
The kingdom of God is here and now. It is that abundant life that places us in a place of our heart above circumstances and events. It is not dependent upon the outcome of this life, but on our faith in the outcome of a life already lived and continues to live on.
When we attempt to identify, quantify, and qualify, we are headed for strong delusion and pride. It is a path of our own undoing in deception and self righteousness.
There are just so many things that are above our "understanding". But the wisdom of Proverbs tells us not to lean on understanding, but on the sure Word of God. That He can do what understanding cannot. He is full of surpirses and opportunities for salvation for all men. All men (and women too of course). We dare not seperate ourselves from the fact that we are all in this together, and it is together, bearing one another's burdens that we will sink or swim.
God's mercy is so much bigger than ours. I know this first hand, up close, and personal. Please don't limit God to not being able to do the impossible.
The Holy Spirit does in fact, and according to the Word of God work within the heart of man to change the desires of his/her heart. But there never comes a time in this life, when some one is so holy, so pure, so arrived in their own walk, that their flesh is made perfect. The good news of the Gospel is that God sees the flesh of the believer already dead, crucified with Christ. Why keep playing with dead things? Let it be. Bury it in His Grace, His unmerited favor. The homosexual does not deserve the favor of God. Neither do you or I. But bless God forever, He gives it to all who ask. And He imputes righteousness and perfection to all who believe. To God be the glory, now and forever amen.
In His mercy and grace forever,
Lahry |
|  2005/9/1 8:01 | | roadsign
Member
Joined: 2005/5/2
Posts: 3777
| | Re: Loving the homosexual | | Lahry, Your words radiate the aroma of Christ. Funny that you should post this! Just this morning I had been thinking that even in my two threads about homosexuals, we still barely reached heart of the issue learning how to apply Christs command to love. I was thinking of waiting a bit and then revisit the homosexual issue under a new heading: How to Love the Homosexual. I think your post is like a foundation for that. We seem to be on the same wave-length (or is it the Spirit?)
As you say, until we UNDERSTAND our own falleness, we will never be able to understand the fallenness of other sinners.
Consider this:
If we were asked to leave all our friends, our familiar surroundings, our earthly securities and go to a foreign land with a different culture, speak a new language, act a new way, live among strangers who have weird ideas and who have been harsh and judgmental to us in the past, how eagerly would we go?
I am trying to look through the eyes of the homosexual. Just like us, and like the Prodigal son, they too can only leave behind their familiar existence when it stops working for them, and when they know that there is something better.
Our role: demonstrate that "something better" through our lives. We can only do that if we actually HAVE IT - God's mercy and love.
Diane
_________________
Diane
|
| | 2005/9/1 9:01 | Profile |
| | Re: | | Hi Diane,
Thanks for the kind words of encouragement. Oh my. It is only because I am able to see my own wretchedness, that I am able to groan in empathy for my fellow man. It's all grace or we are all so very lost. Oh Lord help us all.
In Him,
Lahry |
| | 2005/9/1 21:31 | | baruch_48
Member
Joined: 2005/5/31
Posts: 78
| | Re: | | Quote:
It is so easy for us to stand in front of church and gloat that we are "not like that man". We also know what Jesus thought about the man who stood in self righteous deception.
Is it not for the sick that the physician came?
You're a man that understands that grace leads us to holiness, brother Lahry. There are many posters here who are putting that backwards.
I appreciate your heart and your thoughts
baruch |
| | 2005/9/7 11:54 | Profile | roadsign
Member
Joined: 2005/5/2
Posts: 3777
| | When Homosexuality hits home | |
Here is a stiring true story in Christianity Today
[url=http://www.christianitytoday.com/tcw/7w6/7w6046.html]When Homosexuality hits home[/url]
Diane
_________________
Diane
|
| | 2005/9/7 12:31 | Profile | rookie
Member
Joined: 2003/6/3
Posts: 4821
Savannah TN
| | Re: Homosexuality and the kingdom of God | | Brother Lawry wrote:
Quote:
Now, we see some of all of us in this scripture, so let's not go off on the homosexual alone here, if you don't mind.
I see Paul warning the congregation that those who practice lawlessness will not inherit the kingdom of God. Listen to the words of Jesus.
Matt. 7:21 Not everyone who says to Me, Lord, Lord, shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. 22 Many will say to Me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name? 23 And then I will declare to them, I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!
And again,
John 8:34 Jesus answered them, Most assuredly, I say to you, whoever commits sin is a slave of sin. 35 And a slave does not abide in the house forever, but a son abides forever. 36 Therefore if the Son makes you free, you shall be free indeed.
Do you hear that in verse 35 that a slave does not abide in the house forever?
Rom. 8:12 Therefore, brethren, we are debtorsnot to the flesh, to live according to the flesh. 13 For if you live according to the flesh you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the deeds of the body, you will live. 14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God.
Only those who submit to the leading of the Holy Spirit can put to death the deeds of the body. It is only through the increase that comes from God that one is enabled to overcome the flesh and death.
The warning of lawlessness must be preached because it is the Life of Christ that saves those who live by faith. The Life is that abundance that overcomes Satan and this world.
The OT examples are given so that we might not stumble as many of them did. Sodom and Gamorrah represents man without grace. The evidence of God giving them over to vile passion because they rejected Him is given to us as an example. Christ also judges.
Psa. 1:1 Blessed is the man
Who walks not in the counsel of the ungodly,
Nor stands in the path of sinners,
Nor sits in the seat of the scornful;
2 But his delight is in the law of the LORD,
And in His law he meditates day and night.
3 He shall be like a tree
Planted by the rivers of water,
That brings forth its fruit in its season,
Whose leaf also shall not wither;
And whatever he does shall prosper.
4 The ungodly are not so,
But are like the chaff which the wind drives away.
5 Therefore the ungodly shall not stand in the judgment,
Nor sinners in the congregation of the righteous.
6 For the LORD knows the way of the righteous,
But the way of the ungodly shall perish.
Christ is the Life for those who obey the Spirit and Christ is the judge for those who do not put to death the deeds of the body.
In Christ
Jeff
_________________
Jeff Marshalek
|
| | 2005/9/7 12:41 | Profile | rookie
Member
Joined: 2003/6/3
Posts: 4821
Savannah TN
| | Re: | | The California Legislature on Tuesday became the first legislative body in the country to approve same-sex marriages, as gay-rights advocates overcame two earlier defeats in the Assembly.
The 41-35 vote sends the bill to Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger.
This is a sign of the times in which we live. This is reality. How then must we live?
2Th. 2:13 But we are bound to give thanks to God always for you, brethren beloved by the Lord, because God from the beginning chose you for salvation through sanctification by the Spirit and belief in the truth,
Salvation comes through sanctification by the Spirit and belief in the truth.
In Christ
Jeff
_________________
Jeff Marshalek
|
| | 2005/9/7 13:14 | Profile | rookie
Member
Joined: 2003/6/3
Posts: 4821
Savannah TN
| | Re: | | Upon reflecting on this issue I would like to be more precise on my comments.
First, can God save someone who is homosexual? Yes!
Secondly, is God's grace sufficient to heal such a man or woman from being a slave to this sin? Yes!
Thirdly, can one who continues to practice homosexual behavior enter the kingdom of God? No
Fourthly, can one who practices homosexual acts remain in fellowship with the believers? No.
What is Paul's teaching on removing the leaven from the body of Christ?
1Cor. 5:1 It is actually reported that there is sexual immorality among you, and such sexual immorality as is not even named among the Gentilesthat a man has his fathers wife! 2 And you are puffed up, and have not rather mourned, that he who has done this deed might be taken away from among you. 3 For I indeed, as absent in body but present in spirit, have already judged (as though I were present) him who has so done this deed. 4 In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when you are gathered together, along with my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ, 5 deliver such a one to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.
1Cor. 5:6 Your glorying is not good. Do you not know that a little leaven leavens the whole lump? 7 Therefore purge out the old leaven, that you may be a new lump, since you truly are unleavened. For indeed Christ, our Passover, was sacrificed for us. 8 Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, nor with the leaven of malice and wickedness, but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.
1Cor. 5:9 I wrote to you in my epistle not to keep company with sexually immoral people. 10 Yet I certainly did not mean with the sexually immoral people of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or idolaters, since then you would need to go out of the world. 11 But now I have written to you not to keep company with anyone named a brother, who is sexually immoral, or covetous, or an idolater, or a reviler, or a drunkard, or an extortionernot even to eat with such a person.
1Cor. 5:12 For what have I to do with judging those also who are outside? Do you not judge those who are inside? 13 But those who are outside God judges. Therefore put away from yourselves the evil person.
Paul not only talks of sexual immorality but also those who are covetous, idolaters, reviler, drunkards, and extortioners.
You see if we say we are of Christ and yet the evidence of our faith reflects otherwise, we blaspheme the Holy Spirit. We say to the world that there is no hope in the transforming power of our God who sent His Son to the cross in that He might heal those that are His. We make His promise a lie for the world to witness.
17 Therefore
Come out from among them
And be separate, says the Lord.
Do not touch what is unclean,
And I will receive you.
18 I will be a Father to you,
And you shall be My sons and daughters,
Says the LORD Almighty.
This is His promise, the question is do we mix faith with what we hear?
In Christ
Jeff
_________________
Jeff Marshalek
|
| | 2005/9/7 14:28 | Profile | ellie
Member
Joined: 2005/5/25
Posts: 189
UK
| | Re: Quotes: by Lahry and roadsign. | |
Quote by Lahry:
Now, we see some of all of us in this scripture, so let's not go off on the homosexual alone here, if you don't mind.
Quote by Lahry:
Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived. Neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor sodomites, nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners will inherit the kingdom of God. (1Cor. 6:9-10, NKJV)
My Response: for the two quotes:
As you very well know, the certain sin such as Homosexuality is in need of deliverance. Without going into detail, of this particular deliverance. As has been said is for those who want to turn from this activity in their life and receive freedom through Jesus who we all know died for all.
Quote by Lahry:
Then how dare we single out one particular "sin group" as "different" from us?
My Response: for one quote:
Lahry and roadsign, You! have Singled out Homosexuals as a subject to talk about, in your postings in the Lounge. Members have simply responded.
Quote by Lahry:
And gloat that we are "not like that man".
My Response to the quote:
In our Threads we do not, gloat that we are "not like that man".
Quote by Lahry:
and cast the first stone?
My Response to the Quote:
Here, I have added further Scripture to your quote.
After her accusers left, after saying to Jesus, this woman was taken in adultery
Jesus said to woman accused.
Woman, where are those thine accusers? hath no man condemned thee?
11. She said, No man, Lord.
And Jesus said unto her, Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more.
Quote by roadsign:
As you say, until we UNDERSTAND our own falleness, we will never be able to understand the fallenness of other sinners.
My Response to the Quote:
This! (our own falleness) I believe, we do UNDERSTAND!
Quote by roadsign:
Our role: demonstrate that "something better" through our lives. We can only do that if we actually HAVE IT - God's mercy and love.
My Response to the Quote:
Only God can fill his people with Mercy and Love in his people.
He does that very thing, to me for other people. Over and over. As I am sure he does in many people, who are His.
He fills me with His compassion, His Mercy and His Love.
I dont pity, I dont have sentiment.
The following is to try to make you understand, that the intimate act between man and women is normal, in and under the correct circumstances.
It is not meant, for misuse.
So, what should we do with the people, who steal children, for perverted sex, drugging them, torturing them, and killing them for videos? For the pleasure of sick minded, people who want to see this, for their own sick desire. And all manner, of other activities of
.
We need to wake up, to what is taking place in this WORLD!
Of all manner of suffering.
PRAY.
Go into our closets, so to speak.
Being led by the Holy Spirit in Earnest PRAYER, Intercession, on Behalf of, standing in the Gap for, not seen to be doing this, but doing it in private with God.
We can be seen to praying at times, as sometimes we are in prayer groups. Or praying for people, who are present in person.
God is the I AM.
ellie
|
| | 2005/9/9 18:26 | Profile | rookie
Member
Joined: 2003/6/3
Posts: 4821
Savannah TN
| | Re: | | Sister ellie wrote:
Quote:
Quote by Lahry:
and cast the first stone?
My Response to the Quote:
Here, I have added further Scripture to your quote.
After her accusers left, after saying to Jesus, this woman was taken in adultery
Jesus said to woman accused.
Woman, where are those thine accusers? hath no man condemned thee?
11. She said, No man, Lord.
And Jesus said unto her, Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more.
Many Christians hear the first part of Jesus' teaching. Yet few hear what Jesus truly is teaching here about sin. Yes Jesus does not condemn this worman, but look to His command,
"sin no more."
There is forgiveness but there is also something much greater in this story and most do not understand it. Jesus says to the woman, "[b]sin no more."[/b]
Now listen to what Jesus does next,
John 8:12 Then Jesus spoke to them again, saying, I am the light of the world. He who follows Me shall not walk in darkness, but have the light of life.
This is the only way given that would enable this woman to obey Jesus' command. Jesus promised her and everyone around them that, He who follows Me shall not walk in darkness, but have the light of life.
Paul teaches in Romans 5 that we are reconciled to God even when we were still enemies of the kingdom by the blood of Jesus. But [b]much more we are saved by His life.[/b]
This is the good news, not only the blood but the Life is given to those who follow through faith.
In Christ
Jeff
_________________
Jeff Marshalek
|
| | 2005/9/12 12:41 | Profile |
|
