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brothagary
Member



Joined: 2011/10/23
Posts: 2155


 Re:

I don't think I really understand Brother where your going with that. I was pointing out the fact that many people judge brothers in Christ who are in sin yet they have sin in their own life and this is specifically the way the apostle Paul and Jesus taught. When it comes to restoring their brothers in love through the power of the Holy spirit it never happens they just sit back like keyboard warriors and point out sins. And as tmk points out the enemies of the Cross and those mentioned by Paul in his letter to Timothy would probably not be considered Christians but had a completely different spirit and historically were probably part of the gnostic sect that deny that Jesus came in the flesh. Paul looked down on the Jews who were pushing circumcision and other mosaic laws upon converted gentiles, considered some of them imposters who come into spy out the liberty that was in Christ so these were possibly not converted either. Point was to make sure we no the difference . One group of Christians were imposters an enemies, scripture tells where Paul said to avoid them completely to not even admonished them. In the letter to the Corinthian we see immature babes in Christ he called them unspiritual who had quite a lot of sin in their life within the church but were treated like loving children Paul even said he was their father and him having an apostolic leadership position and was an elder had the authority to deal with sinning Christians but he did it in love. clearly. There are many heresy hunters today they don't treat their brother's with love at all but just wield the sword of the spirit and try to cut their heads off and clearly lack love and tears over those who they believe are in sin. The restorers, and the heart of the apostle Paul was clear he said he mourned over those in sin and we should also morn over those and sin. And as I mentioned before we have men like Derek Prince who dealt with demonic strongholds and practise deliverance ministry of Christians who still had addictions and different problems. Because of these things never been dealt with when they got converted. Brother you must have a leadership position as an elder in a church can I ask what denomination if you don't mind. I don't Hide my beliefs I'm a charismatic believer that believes in deliverance ministry power of the Holy spirit walking in holiness intire sanctification. And the laws of love. Whether we like it or not when we read Corinthians in Hebrews a person can stay immature and even be classed as a babe when they should be growing up and be teachers but if the discipleship program is not being taught properly and deliverance ministry isn't taking place in the church and true holiness isn't being preached then people are going to remain immature even after 20 years. Whether we like it or not we have a merciful loving God who still loves his children even the ones that didn't grow up the ones that weren't taught properly because the eldership wasn't in the position of teaching them properly. He still has Patience and wants them to grow up, god clearly does demonstrates that he has more Mercy and Grace and patience than what we do, and prove that many times by the way he treats his children . Confess your faults to another and pray for one another that you may be healed for the affectional fervent prayer of a righteous man availeth much said a certain apostle. One alsosaid you who are spiritual you restore the sinning brother. Words alone with rebukes and repvoves will never restore Christians this is why prayer through the laying on of hands is what brings about healing and deliverance. Us moving in and living with a powerful anointing trembling at his word and being filled with the Holy spirit which amounts to living in a personal revival, is what will cause the demons to manifest when you pray and lay hands on people and it's what brings about healing. I'll just put it out there many heresy hunters and Seasoned rebukers are not moving in a personal revival or corporate one and so lake power and presence. There is an expiration date on how much patience God has for carnal Christians, thats why We cry out for more mercy and travail in birth pains for the church and for Christians and for God to continue to have more Mercy and to pour out his spirit , until Christ is fully formed withIn us all .🙏🕎✝️🔥🍷🍞. Brother when we travail in the spirit of intercession we put ourselves through the working of the Holy spirit in the place of the sinning brother, and the weight of sin becomes our own in that moment, and conviction for their sin becomes our own we are in full identification with those whom we trevail and pray for. We fully stand in The gap between them and between God identifying with them and praying on their behalf with groanings and tears buckled over in some cases with very real discomfort and pain. The Same way we would have prayed for our own sins in repentance. This is the love of the Holy spirit praying through us with groans, we allow God to use us as a vessel of intercession Loving our sinful brothers in Christ who are caught up in a sins, really experiencing the tangible love Jesus has for that soul and allowing the Holy spirit to pray and travail through us. God wants to take his people into the deeper levels of intercession, those that are open to it the spirit of intercession is coming upon the remenant who have been seeking God with fasting and many many hours of prayer. God wants to let us experience more of his heart. And he does that through the spirit of prayer and supplication.

 2022/9/9 18:48Profile
yulboum
Member



Joined: 2021/11/14
Posts: 25


 Re:

Hello,

I want to encourage everyone to build each other up in the faith. When you believe in the Name of Jesus Christ you are saved and became born again. We became children of God because of His grace through Jesus Christ.
Judging is a sin if intended to harm to the person and to destroy their faith. But when you discern the errors of your brethren, we must help the person up with gentleness and kindness. Pray on behalf of the brother or sister who is struggling with sin. And, we must be on guard against false teachers and prophets who divide the community of believers. So if you encounter them, we must stop them from harming the church. Finally, we must follow Jesus Christ whom loved us so much that He laid down His life for us. This means we too must lay down our lives for others. Do all things in love.

Shalom,
Robert

 2022/9/10 8:51Profile
TrueWitness
Member



Joined: 2006/8/10
Posts: 587


 Re:

I also have wrestled with this problem of looking at fruit to determine whether someone is saved or not. A lot of this was exhaustively discussed during the "Lordship Salvation" debates that happened after John MacArthur wrote his "Gospel According to Jesus" book. I understand his concerns and yet his solution was to dictate a list of conditions the sinner had to meet in order to be saved. It was very much a salvation by sanctification approach that many applauded.

While I do believe in grace very strongly, I also know that cheap grace is a disgrace whereby grace is used to excuse sin and make peace with it. And so I wrestled with where exactly to draw the line in order to know if I had crossed the line and fell from grace. Well, to cut to the chase: If someone is hyper-focused on exactly what they have to do or not do in order to be saved, go to heaven and not go to hell, they are just looking to save their own skin and really just want to "use" Jesus for their own sake. They profess Christ and think they are saved and yet Jesus tells us that many folks when they see Him face to face will say "Lord, Lord" and He will tell them, "I never knew you". So I think it is extremely critical to see that the important thing is RELATIONSHIP! Let us fall deeply in love with this wonderful Savior who loved us and was so patient and forbearing with us while we were slaves of sin. Who looked beyond our faults and saw our need and constantly sought us out that we might have intimate fellowship with Him. Jesus says, "Whoever tries to save his life will lose it, but whoever loses his life will preserve it". Lk. 17:33 And while we should love ourself in a balanced and healthy way, if we take it too far and fail to love God or others and give them proper consideration (loving them because it is the nature of our transformed heart that Jesus gave us and not because of obligation or duty), we will one day recognize we missed what life was all about.

 2022/9/10 10:49Profile
narrowpath
Member



Joined: 2005/1/9
Posts: 1346
Germany NRW

 Re:

This is what Charles Finney said about "practical atheism"

Religion does not consist in desires to do good actions. Desires that do not result in choice and action are not virtuous. Nor are such desires necessarily vicious. They may arise involuntarily in the mind, in view of certain objects, but while they produce no voluntary act, they are no more virtuous or vicious than the beating of the pulse, except in cases where we have indirectly willed them into existence, by voluntarily putting ourselves under circumstances to excite them. The wickedest man on earth may have strong desires after holiness. Did you ever think of that? He may see clearly that holiness is the only and indispensable means of happiness, he naturally desires it. It is to be feared, that multitudes are deceiving themselves with the supposition, that a desire for holiness, as a means of happiness, is religion. Many, doubtless, give themselves great credit for desires that never result in choosing right. They feel desires to do their duty, but do not choose to do it, because upon the whole they have still stronger desires not to do it. In such desires, there is no virtue. An action or desire to be virtuous in the sight of God, must be an act of the will. People often talk most absurdly on this subject, as though their desires had anything good, while they remain mere desires. “I think I desire to do so and so.” But do you do it? “Oh, no, but I often feel a desire to do it.” This is practical Atheism.

 2022/9/10 17:35Profile





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