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Discussion Forum : General Topics : Why the Counterfeit detracts from the Real!

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Joined: 2005/1/6
Posts: 1952
Hemel Hempstead

 Why the Counterfeit detracts from the Real!

Counterfeit Revivals always detract from true revivals
So when a true revival happens people will say it is false.

Counterfeit End Time Prophecies will detract from when the true prophecies will be fulfilled

With money, the whole point of counterfeits is to lessen the value of the true money and to look so like the true.

In the book the Last battle because they had seen the Fake Aslan that when the Real Aslan showed up. They questioned him aswell.

I feel like that with the amount of bible prophecy is it is so close but yet so far. Doesnt that remind you of a counterfeit as it looks so like the real.

When we are referring to bible prophecy it is good to refer to the bible and not the news. As just because we have a world government and things that match does not make it true.

Are we berean do we check it up against scripture.

As most people check up on what they think Scripture says rather than what actual scripture says.

When I was younger I grew up in the Toronto Blessing movement I saw crazy things such as people like roaring lions and laughing and it was more like a circus than a church and this was both happening in my school and church

At the moment I feel a billion miles from God but I know it is only he that can initiate true revival.
Only god can turn my rebellious wicked heart unto him as without him I can do nothing.

John 15:5
New King James Version

5 “I am the vine, you are the branches. He who abides in Me, and I in him, bears much fruit; for without Me you can do nothing.

If revival is going to happen it has to come from the throne room.

Man made fire does not cut it they were allowed no strange fire in the temple which means no natural fire

Leviticus 10:1
The Profane Fire of Nadab and Abihu
Then Nadab and Abihu, the sons of Aaron, each took his censer and put fire in it, put incense on it, and offered profane fire before the Lord, which He had not commanded them.

I want the real and not the counterfeit and the counterfeit looks so like the read else it would not be fake.

I so want the real rather than the counterfeit

Dominic Shiells

 2021/11/13 16:56Profile

Joined: 2002/12/11
Posts: 38122
"Pilgrim and Sojourner." - 1 Peter 2:11

 Re: Why the Counterfeit detracts from the Real!


Some good thoughts here for us to think upon. The antichrist spirit is a counterfeit. And the coming Antichrist himself will operate as a counterfeit Christ giving peace, miracles and speaking great things.

SI Moderator - Greg Gordon

 2021/11/13 17:25Profile

Joined: 2005/1/6
Posts: 1952
Hemel Hempstead


Thanks 😊

Dominic Shiells

 2021/11/13 18:46Profile

Joined: 2020/2/12
Posts: 143


Counterfeit doesn't just apply to "prophets" or an anti-christ spirit.
I think it can apply to any false teacher.
Paul warned already 2000 years ago about false Gospels.
Now we find "American Gospels" and prosperity "gospels" everywhere.
Then there is the "seeker friendly " movement. To tell people what they want to hear is always a warning sign of a false teacher.

 2021/11/14 3:37Profile

Joined: 2005/1/6
Posts: 1952
Hemel Hempstead


To me it is not things like the prosperity gospel or things like that worry me as I class it as low hanging fruit
The dangerous things with counterfeits is they look so like the real note that no-one knows and the alarm bells haven't gone off

When I was referring to things prophetic I was more refering to Bible prophecy where it looks similar but is miles apart

To me I wish the lord could deliver me from self deception as none of us is beyond it

A revival starts at home with you on your knees confessing your sin and opening your eyes to the deception that you are into
I am speaking to myself here as the thing that I noticed that has been around is there are things that are very similar to the mark of the beast but without the antichrist then it is not the Mark of the beast it looks similar like counterfeit money but it is vastly off because it doesn't match up to the details of scripture

During the time before jesus so many messiahs turned up and the same will be true

It is almost being so consumed with junk food that when you get a real burger or a Michelin star restaurant you are turned off

The dwarves in the last battle were so sick of fake aslans that when the true aslan shows up they thought he was a fake

I cannot saying this but lord deliver us as without you we can do nothing

Dominic Shiells

 2021/11/14 13:57Profile

Joined: 2019/10/5
Posts: 156


"A revival starts at home with you on your knees confessing your sin and opening your eyes to the deception that you are into
I am speaking to myself here as the thing that I noticed that has been around is there are things that are very similar to the mark of the beast but without the antichrist then it is not the Mark of the beast it looks similar like counterfeit money but it is vastly off because it doesn't match up to the details of scripture"

Your correct there is no mark of the beast currently. What you have are precursors to the mark that is why they look similar but don't exactly match up (because they are precursors).

I've said it here previously that you never go from point A to point B instantly but you get there in steps. This is a natural principle that applies in pretty much every situation and the mark of the beast would be no exception.

What's the latest version of the iphone right now? I don't know so lets say its iphone 15? Before iphone 15 there were iphones 1-14. The latest iphone didn't come out of no where. Before the first iphone there were flip phones. Before the first flip phone there were beepers. There was a natural progression to the latest iphone.

How about the current marxist/communist situation in America. The recent situation in Virginia exposed what was happening in school boards all over America. How do you get marxism/communism into a non communist country? You train/indoctrinate the next generation (see the animated film "Animal Farm" on youtube and what happened to the puppies). The current communist situation in America didn't happen all at once it took planning/time. They had to infiltrate school boards (and other organizations not just schools) over time and change the curriculum.

How about the great apostasy that is foretold in the bible. Do all those people fall away at once? No they were/are already in the process. Again its a natural progression from point A to point B.

So it will be the mark of the beast and the antichrist. The way is being prepared.

The bible does not warn us to watch for a counterfeit Antichrist but it does say there are many antichrists here already. Those aren't counterfeits they just aren't the final antichrist.

 2021/11/14 15:11Profile

Joined: 2005/1/6
Posts: 1952
Hemel Hempstead


The latest iPhone is 13 as with the tech industry it is something I keep a close eye on as I did a computer science degree
Flip phones are coming into play again as you have new foldable phones such as the galaxy fold 3

I used as an example because say in the early 1990-200s they thought it was microchips and then RFIDs then smaller RFIDs then quantum dot then some people suggesting neurolink which would make elon musk the antichrist

What I am trying to mean is that we are flooded by so much information regarding that do we look at the actual verses in scripture

To me is the way being prepared for a larger apostasy as

Rev 13
13 And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men,

14 And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.

15 And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed. note

16 And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads: note

17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name

So when actually analysing the passage it mentions the beast and the number so when analysing this passage the Greek word is χάραγμα charigma which means stamp , if you analyse it further in other greek sources
Perseus you can look at other greek usage of this phrase

The thing doesn't make any sense without the beast as he could go back to a simple stamp from the beast.

This is the current problem as I don't live in America communism has been plagueing this world for centuries but it is not the antichrist singular

The great apostasy is interesting as if you read the passage it is the great apostasy that reveals the antichrist.

I can have lots of signs but if there pointing in the wrong direction or red herrings

2 Thessalonians 2
1 Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him, note

2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.

3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

5 Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things?

6 And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time. note

7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.

8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming

The great apostasy or rebellion reveals the antichrist.

In a word in greek if you want to negate a word you put an a Infront of the word such as theist means God put an a it is the opposite.

The word anti is almost like the opposite like the word antibodies or antitrust Antarctic , the opposite of the artic

The word anti Messiah , opposite of the Messiah
The word Christ and Messiah are the same thing Christos in greek and hamashiah in Hebrew.
The Messiah is a weighted Jewish term , the Jewish people according to Maimonides want a third temple , world peace and other things.

It is sometimes we look at end time things but don't look at scripture say the whole recent ai craze with the image of the beast or these large giant statues

Revelation 13
15 And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed. note

and that the image of the beast should both speak.

And he the antichrist gave power to give life to the beast
Note it was not artificial intelligence , it was supernatural not artificial intelligence nor does it say it is a giant statue that is eisegesis

It is not reading the passage that is why I get so annoyed as people look at these passages and assume so much things the actual passage does not say

Counterfeits look like the real thing and just because artificial intelligence looks very like it but it is vastly different from what the actual passage says.

It would be like firing at wood pidgeons in a war and using up your ammo so when you really have an enemy you have no ammo left.

As the anti Messiah is going to look exactly like jesus he will try and set up a millennium, he will rule from Jerusalem , he will try and fufill every Talmudic prophecy

He is a counterfeit

This is where hindsight about jesus first coming comes into play as you read the dead sea Scrolls they were a million miles away from what they thought the Messiah should be

How when looking at these signs we are falliable human beings not God.

Eph 4:14 That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive

Let us not be blown around by every wind of doctrine let's analyse things and be berean

2 Peter 2:3 Adj-DMP
GRK: ἐν πλεονεξίᾳ πλαστοῖς λόγοις ὑμᾶς
NAS: they will exploit you with false words;
KJV: covetousness shall they with feigned words
INT: through covetousness with well-turned words you

The equivalent Greek word for counterfeit is used here πλαστός

Dominic Shiells

 2021/11/14 16:07Profile

Joined: 2019/10/5
Posts: 156


Yea I've seen some of the new flip phones but they are essentially smart phones in a flip phone form. I meant flip phones (non smart phones) you know those phones where the only thing you can do is make a call/text and only has a calculator/calendar function on it. Btw if you know of any non smart phones that work on 4G/5G let me know.

I only used the phone, communism, and great apostasy examples to show how things progress over time. I wasn't linking them to the antichrist.

Here is something written by a man who specializes in exegesis. This one was recently updated on 08/16/21.

 2021/11/14 17:52Profile

Joined: 2005/1/6
Posts: 1952
Hemel Hempstead


It wouldn't make any difference with smartphones or dumbphones as most of there software the whole aspect of phone privacy is a completely different subject

What I was trying to get at is that we need to read the text and exegesis for ourselves

I gave the example of the image of the beast as an example to show that most people assume what the text says rather than actually reading it.
There is no testing of what there Bible prophecy teacher says against scripture.

It is ok to link to John MacArthur but what if you lived in a world that was not connected to the internet what would you do

Dominic Shiells

 2021/11/15 1:35Profile

Joined: 2019/10/5
Posts: 156


Yes your correct we need to read the text for ourselves.

 2021/11/15 4:44Profile

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