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Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : Just being forgiven was totally insufficient.

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brothagary
Member



Joined: 2011/10/23
Posts: 2104


 Re:

Just for the record,
I'm not saying a person gets born-again and then believes after that, all I'm saying is the flesh doesn't believe and the flesh doesn't get born again, the flesh is totally dead and deprived because of sin and can't produce anything good, as Paul said; in me that is in my flesh nothing good dwells.

 2021/6/16 19:18Profile
CofG
Member



Joined: 2017/2/12
Posts: 547
Cambodia

 Re:

Heh Todd,

Perhaps you could rephrase the objection. God does actually command many things all the time that we are unable to do on our own all the time. The question is whether He provides the help "all the time" for us or for unbelievers to do those commands.

Clearly, we know that He doesn't provide that help all the time. For example, if we are walking in the flesh and regard sin in our hearts, He is less inclined to help for He gives grace to the humble but resists the proud. Our sin causes God not to help us.


The question of the centuries is does God provide the help all the time every time to all people when He commands them to obey the Gospel ?

The purpose for the law and commands was to show man that he can't obey God all the time on his own.

The Pelagian heresy was that man can do what God commands on his own all the time without God's help. Unless one subscribes to that, we must all concede to the proposition that God commands man to do things all the time that he cannot do apart from God's intervention all time. The only question is does He provide that help all the time.

Augustine ( not an obtuse guy ) prayed "God, give what thou command and command what thy will".




_________________
Robert

 2021/6/17 4:05Profile









 Re:

Thats what you should be saying, because a person must be born again before they can believe or repent. If not they remain in the flesh.

 2021/6/17 9:27
JFW
Member



Joined: 2011/10/21
Posts: 1547
Dothan, Alabama

 Re: wait what???

Hear
Believe
Repent
Confess
Be baptized

So you all are submitting that a person must be born again for any of this to happen??


_________________
Fletcher

 2021/6/17 9:35Profile
TMK
Member



Joined: 2012/2/8
Posts: 5864
NC, USA

 Re:

I don’t want to get into a huge Calvinism debate **again**.

If y’all want to believe in a God that commands all men everywhere to repent but actually only helps (allows?) some (likely very few) to actually obey the command, have at it! I won’t try to stop you. The whole idea is absurd to me on its face.

It’s like a parent who commands their children to pick up sticks in the yard, but ties their hands behind their backs before they start and then punishes them for not doing the chore.


_________________
Todd

 2021/6/17 10:01Profile
brothagary
Member



Joined: 2011/10/23
Posts: 2104


 Re:

2 timothy 2 25 correcting his opponents with gentleness. God MAY PERHAPS grant them repentance leading to a knowledge of the truth......Under these circumstances, god literally grants so repentance is not coming from the natural man abilities or the sinner. we cant produce it in our selvs unless God grants us the ability , perhaps he will or perhaps he won't, there is no guaranty in these scripture, under those circumstances, Jesus also commands men to have faith and believe, yet the scriptures say .....New King James Version
For I say, through the grace given to me, to everyone who is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think but to think soberly, as God has dealt to each one a measure of faith.

No one should think that he produces faith we ought to not think pride full high minded thoughts , because God even deals out faith to each of us its a gift ,

 2021/6/17 10:37Profile
brothagary
Member



Joined: 2011/10/23
Posts: 2104


 Re:

We don't have the power in the flesh to obey Jesus it needs to be put to death and the new man who is created according to God in true righteousness and holiness by gods power fulfills the righteous requirements of the law by grace, paul said I labored more than them all yet not I , it was the grace of god ,, We must be grafted into the vine and remain, for Jesus said 5I am the vine and you are the branches. The one who remains in Me, and I in him, will bear much fruit. For apart from Me you can do nothing. But now I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me , paul said the flesh profits nothing, the flesh, and the old natural man can not please God, paul said to will or to want to do good is present but how to perform the will of God is not present in him that's why Christ died and if one died for all then all died , the body the flesh is dead because of sin Paul said

 2021/6/17 11:00Profile
brothagary
Member



Joined: 2011/10/23
Posts: 2104


 Re:

Fletcher, I'm not saying that all I was saying was the natural man and the flesh, this flesh that Jesus spoke of that lusts against the spirit and the spirit against the flesh, this flesh is what cant hear believe repent or please God. But the inerman the spirit of man is enabled by the drawing power of grace to hear and respond. Jesus said no man can come to me unless my Father draws him, Jesus through his divine spirit touches us with his love before we are born again and causes us to desire god, because of his sweetness and revelation that God gives us in our spirit. Our response is a genuine experience to an impartation of grace into our spirit a true taste of God.

 2021/6/17 11:22Profile
TrueWitness
Member



Joined: 2006/8/10
Posts: 555


 Re:

http://middletownbiblechurch.org/reformed/regenera.htm

-Daniel

 2021/6/17 12:16Profile
TMK
Member



Joined: 2012/2/8
Posts: 5864
NC, USA

 Re:

Good one Daniel.


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Todd

 2021/6/17 13:27Profile





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