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Joined: 2002/12/11
Posts: 37637
"Pilgrim and Sojourner." - 1 Peter 2:11


You mentioned A. W. Tozer: he was with the Christian & Missionary Alliance, and he espoused the baptism of the Holy Spirit with the initial evidence of speaking with tongues. In contrast the Orthodox church teaches that the gifts of the Spirit ceased at the end of the first century. Tozer was correct.

Again I am pretty ignorant but on doing a web search I found this quote that clarifies their position some:

"The Greek Orthodox Church does not preclude the use of Glossolalia, but regards it as one of the minor gifts of the Holy Spirit. If Glossolalia has fallen out of use it is because it served its purpose in New Testament times and is no longer necessary. However, even when used, it is a private and personal gift, a lower form of prayer. The Orthodox Church differs with those Pentecostal and Charismatic groups which regard Glossolalia as a pre requisite to being a Christian and to having received the Holy Spirit."


SI Moderator - Greg Gordon

 2020/1/11 10:35Profile


Actually, Greg, the Pentecostal and charismatic position is the Biblical one: that everyone who is born again in Christ has received the Holy Spirit at salvation. The baptism of the Holy Spirit, however, is regarded as a subsequent empowerment for service where the spiritual gifts are evidenced. Regardless of whether a believer operates in these gifts or not, we need to be filled daily since we are like leaking vessels --- not that He departs from us, but we are the ones who drift off course.

My next door neighbor attended (until recently) an Ethiopian Orthodox church. We have had many discussions about his experiences there. Believe it or not, I mostly listened. He spoke of harsh religiosity there, and that the priests claimed the Orthodox church was the *only* church going to heaven (how many times have we heard that claim from other exclusive groups?). I encouraged him to read the Word for himself daily, and to regularly enter the secret closet of prayer.

 2020/1/11 14:23

Joined: 2005/1/9
Posts: 1124
Germany NRW


I am quite troubled with the promotion of "orthodox" churchianity here on SI. I admit that there surely must be true believers among them as there are in Catholic church, too. I also admit, many main denominations are guilty of similar things, and we witness many defections from the once delivered holy faith these days.

I am in the leadership of a church where a number of people had lived in Russia and suffered persecution both from the Communists and the Orthodox church.

* They practice many pompous and elaboroate rituals that are neither mentioned nor encouraged in the bible.
* They maintain a priesthood that has been long been abolished with Christ.
* Asceticism is widely practised, the bible only encourages fasting.
* They do not encourage bible study and exposition of the word
* They practise infant baptism, thus giving a false impression that those baptized are saved and need not to repent and confess Christ. This by default causes a chasm with those whose practice biblical baptism. Believers baptism by immersion is the only biblical practice and non-negotiable.
* The do not preach the that you must be born again, but rather join their church.
* They believe in a covert form of transubstantiation.
* They display icons of saints, maintain altars, flowing robes, bells and smells, and a priestly system of rank and hierarchy set apart from the "common layity"
* They keep an unholy alliance with earthly governments and either usurp power or exercise stately power by proxy.

Nowhere in the NT are these things encouraged. In fact, Col 2:16-23 warns against such practices.
It serves as a substitute for true worship. In Judaism, the temple worship was a shadow of things to come. When you continue in the provisionary temple sacrifices while the true has already come, you despise and reject true worship.

This is why God removed the temple soon after Christs resurrection.

True worship is in Spirit and truth. The NT church does not need any of these things mentioned above. We have everything in Christ, he is the high priest who forever lives and intercedes on our behalf, anyone assuming the role of a priest on earth antagonizes Christ - and is a type of anti-Christ. Icons and statues of saints lure into idol worship.

This system rarely produces true saints; most of them die in the illusion of having believed the truth all their life and being children of God only to find out that it whas a grand lie. Then there will be no remedy and they have to bear the eternal consequences.

This is not a small thing. We have some very good teachings available here on SI by some of the finest preachers I know. Why promoting this beggarly religious system, that leads millions into deception? Did Paul not rebuke the Galatians for returning to ordinances that were abolished in Christ?

Should we not take utmost care to preach the truth and maintain the purety and simplicity of Christ?

Forgive me, but I cannot find kinder words as I fear that the faith of dear brothers and sisters may become unsettled by these things.

 2020/1/11 16:19Profile

Joined: 2011/9/26
Posts: 904


Personal Testimony of Eusebius Stephanou 10-12-91

 2020/1/13 17:28Profile

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