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savannah
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Joined: 2008/10/30
Posts: 2071


 Re: God does not show favoritism



God is not racist...


Romans 2

There will be trouble and distress for every human being who does evil, first for the Jew, then for the Greek; but glory, honor, and peace for everyone who does good, first for the Jew, then for the Greek. For God does not show favoritism.

Now you, if you call yourself a Jew; if you rely on the Law and boast in God; if you know His will and approve of what is superior because you are instructed by the Law; if you are convinced that you are a guide for the blind, a light for those in darkness, an instructor of the foolish, a teacher of infants, because you have in the Law the embodiment of knowledge and truth— you, then, who teach others, do you do not teach yourself? You who preach against stealing, do you steal? You who forbid adultery, do you commit adultery? You who abhor idols, do you rob temples? You who boast in the Law, do you dishonor God by breaking the Law? As it is written: “God’s name is blasphemed among the Gentiles because of you.”

Circumcision has value if you observe the Law, but if you break the Law, your circumcision has become uncircumcision. If a man who is not circumcised keeps the requirements of the Law, will not his uncircumcision be regarded as circumcision? The one who is physically uncircumcised yet keeps the Law will condemn you who, even though you have the written code and circumcision, are a lawbreaker.

A man is not a Jew because he is one outwardly, nor is circumcision only outward and physical. No, a man is a Jew because he is one inwardly, and circumcision is a matter of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the written code. Such a man’s praise does not come from men, but from God.


__________________________________

You're the one who is missing it!

John 1

He came unto his own, and his own received him not. But those that received him, to them he gave authority to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his Name, Those who had not been born of blood, nor of the desire of the flesh, nor of the desire of a man, but of God.

Those and those only, are God's chosen people, who are born of God. A blood born Jew as it says here, as well as in Romans 2,has nought to do with being the sons of God. Jesus Himself stated that He was able to make children of Abraham from stones.

It's the blood of Jesus alone that makes one a son of God, not the blood of your parents. Your race before God is equal to the color of your eyes or hair.

Our inheritance of all of His promises is due to the death of His Son and our being in covenant with Him.

Nothing can be added or taken away from that.

 2017/12/7 19:42Profile
staff
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Joined: 2007/2/8
Posts: 1547


 Re:

Hi Pnutty person lol
yeah but if you look at the way the Jews look at Jubilee year it would be a full year rather than just the date,Jews on facebook are already celbrating 70 yrs as far as I can see,urs staff(called after the avatar a stick which we had at the start)not a member of staff

 2017/12/7 19:53Profile
docs
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Joined: 2006/9/16
Posts: 2200


 Re:

/"No one is suggesting Jews or Israel will be allowed into the kingdom of God because they are Jews or Israel. They will have to come the way of the cross as all believers have."

"Israel will not be able to or come into their promised inheritance until they place their faith in Christ and become part of the church. They are required to come the way of the cross as every believer has."/

What is racist or partial on God's part if He requires Jew and Gentile to come the way of the cross before they are to be counted as sons of God?


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David Winter

 2017/12/7 22:26Profile
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Joined: 2012/2/8
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 Re:

If one camp did not see some perceived advantage for being an ethnic Jew, there would not be a debate about whether the Church is the true Israel.

In other words, there is an understanding by one camp that God is going to specifically preserve a people based on their race, ie that He is going to favor one people group over another based on race.

At least that is my understanding of the issue although admittedly it may be flawed. But based on the scriptures savannah posted I don’t think so.


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Todd

 2017/12/8 7:17Profile
docs
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Joined: 2006/9/16
Posts: 2200


 Re:

Where is the phrase "new Israel" found in the Bible, especially the New Testament? If you believe in the "new Israel" and make reference to it then where can this term be found in the Bible?

Savannah' scriptures imply that one camp believes that being a ethnic Jew makes one a son of God. Nothing can be further from the truth. It's a common mischaracterization based on a I'll informed perception of what the other camp believes. It's been my experience many times that no matter how many times you explain the issue that the wrongful caricature of the other side is still clung to. If many would take time to really study the position of the other camp they may still disagree about the future role of the Jew and their nation but they would understand at least that the belief is that that people and that nation is going to have to come the way of the cross and be born again to enter the kingdom of God. No one gets in because of ethnicity minus the new birth.

If Christ returns to Jerusalem at His second advent will He be showing partiality to one city and nation? Where does it say what God may choose to do for one nation He is obligated to do for all nations? Since Paul was saved in such a dramatic way does God therefore owe everyone He saves such a experience? ?Was God showing partiality to Paul? Was God showing partiality to one man by choosing Abraham instead of someone else? Was God is no respecter of persons when it comes to salvation. Jew and Gentile must be born again by faith in the atoning blood of Christ. After that, if God chooses to use one particular nation for a specific purpose it doesn't mean He is unrighteous or racist! Scriptures are abundantly clear that the blessings to come to this nation in Christ will flow out and bless all the nations. One nation fully in Christ and set apart will bless all peoples and nations.


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David Winter

 2017/12/8 9:27Profile
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Joined: 2007/2/8
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 Re:

Hi Docs and Others,
I think these points you are making are very important
Everybody has to be born again no exceptions
This has nothing to do with race it has to do with purpose
Is Jesus showing rascism if he returns to Jerusalem rather than London(paraphrase) Answer No.

May I add that the very fact that Israel has come back into existance again in 1948 blows all arguements out of the water that God does not have a reason for Israel to exist.
Either that or its just coincidence and I dont think even the most ardent opposition believe that.
urs staff

 2017/12/8 9:40Profile
proudpapa
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Joined: 2012/5/13
Posts: 2936


 Re:

We find very little record of anyone holding to a Judaic centric eschatology for almost the first 1500 years of Church History.

RE : /// Where is the phrase "new Israel" found in the Bible, especially the New Testament?///

Gal 6:16

Jamieson-Fausset-Brown Bible Commentary:

"Israel of God—not the Israel after the flesh, among whom those teachers wish to enrol you; but the spiritual seed of Abraham by faith (Ga 3:9, 29; Ro 2:28, 29; Php 3:3).

Ellicott's Commentary for English Readers

And upon the Israel of God.—The benediction is addressed, not to two distinct sets of persons (“those who walk by this rule” and “the Israel of God”), but to the same set of persons described in different ways. “And” is therefore equivalent to “namely:” Yea, upon the Israel of God. By the “Israel of God” is here meant the “spiritual Israel;” not converts from Judaism alone, but all who prove their real affinity to Abraham by a faith like Abraham’s. (Comp. Galatians 3:7-9; Galatians 3:14; Galatians 3:29; Romans 4:11-12; Romans 9:6-8.)

Matthew Poole's Commentary

Upon the Israel of God; upon the true Israelites, whom he calleth the Israel of God; hereby intimating and confirming the truth of what he had said, Romans 2:28,29, and what our Saviour had said of Nathanael, John 1:47, calling him an Israelite indeed, because in him was no guile; and establishing a distinction between such as were so really, and those who were only Israelites in name, because descended from Jacob, to whom God gave the name of Israel. Hereby also checking the vanity of the Jews, who gloried in the name of Israelites, and thought there could no water come out of the fountains of Israel which God would cast away. The apostle doth not promise, or prophesy, mercy and peace to all Israelites, but only to the Israel of God; that is, to believers, that received and embraced Jesus Christ offered in the gospel.

Tim Conway : https://illbehonest.com/who-is-true-israel-part-3-tim-conway

 2017/12/8 10:06Profile
docs
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Joined: 2006/9/16
Posts: 2200


 Re:

"for ALMOST the first 1500 years of church history."

I assume that leaves out Jesus and the early church. The events of 70 AD were rubbed in the face of the Jews as a sure sign that God was through with them and their status had become null and void. There is no scripture to support this. The long exile was a discipline and chastisement and not an irrevocable casting off.

I don't see the phrase "new Israel" in Galatians 6:16. There is Israel as a whole comprised of non believers and believers. Believers, the true sons of Abraham circumcised in heart by the Spirit, are the true Israel within Israel. It nowhere speaks of a new Israel. It speaks of a Israel after the Spirit which was God's intention all along. Again, what is "new" about that? Preachers and teachers who use the phrase "new Israel" it seems should be under some obligation to inform their listeners they are using a term not found anywhere in the Bible.

In Christ the Gentiles become fellowheirs, and of the same body (Ephe 3:6). Gentiles in Christ are brought into and become part of true Israel. What's "new" about that. It was God's intention and part of His eternal purpose all along (Ephe 3:11). As commonly taught, the "new Israel" teaching is largely founded on the premise that God irrevocably divorced if you will the Jews and turned to another people thus cancelling any outstanding promises to Israel that have not been fulfilled.

Yet the issue I am speaking of is if one camp teaches that ethnic Jews will one day be brought in just because they are Jews without being born again. Even if you disagree with the future role of Jews and Israel etc. at least understand that no one is teaching that unsaved Jews will one day be part of the kingdom of God solely on the basis of their ethnicity. It's plain and simply NOT TRUE.



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David Winter

 2017/12/8 11:10Profile
proudpapa
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Joined: 2012/5/13
Posts: 2936


 Re:

RE : /// I assume that leaves out Jesus and the early church.///

You know what I was implying.

RE : /// I don't see the phrase "new Israel"..///

I did not see anyone in this discussion using the phrase "new Israel" except for you.

If you agree that the "Israel of God" in Galatians 6:16 is speaking of "the spiritual seed of Abraham" Than we are in agreement about there being two Israel's

edit : clarity



 2017/12/8 12:47Profile
TMK
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Joined: 2012/2/8
Posts: 5615
NC, USA

 Re:

David- I did not mean to imply or suggest that a Jewish person can be saved apart from surrendering to Christ. And of course God is not racist.

But I think there some who believe that “all Israel will be saved” because of their ethnicity. In other words God will see to it they are saved. I think this may be where the difficulty lies.

I certainly agree that God can do what He wants.


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Todd

 2017/12/8 13:06Profile





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