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mguldner
Member



Joined: 2009/12/4
Posts: 1860
Kansas

 Re: circus

Looks like a gimmicky Christmas thing a big church does annually. Does it bring people to Christ? I have no idea. Are people entertained? Probably. Is this bad? Not necessarily.


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Matthew Guldner

 2017/12/4 10:18Profile
TMK
Member



Joined: 2012/2/8
Posts: 5638
NC, USA

 Re:

Apprarenly the Christmas story is woven into the program.

There is no doubt it is glitzy and doesn’t float my boat but I am not going to judge motives, primarily because Jesus said not to.

I read a fantastic quote by Oswald Chambers the other day: “God never gives us discernment so that we may criticize, but that we may intercede.”


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Todd

 2017/12/4 11:27Profile
JFW
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Joined: 2011/10/21
Posts: 1450
Dothan, Alabama

 Re: brother Todd

Amen to that quote!!!


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Fletcher

 2017/12/4 12:18Profile
Gloryandgrace
Member



Joined: 2017/7/14
Posts: 1162
Snoqualmie, WA

 Re:


I have difficulty personally, with this kind of event.

I realize there maybe nothing wrong with the event, or with the circus or with the Church sponsoring it or with big monies being spent to get host the event.

But then, as I just read a DL Moody article on fresh anointing I wonder?

Is this event because the preacher has no fresh anointing?
Is these event because the congregation needs a Christmas entertainment event?
Is this event symptomatic of a dead/waterless/lifeless/ group of people who have no faith for God to actually empower them to be disciples?
Is this what discipleship in practice looks like?
Is this event because the leaders have no anointing of God to minister the word whereby the unsaved are saved and the saved or discipled and the discipled are disciplers to others?

If Circuses are ok, are giving away cars on raffle to fund raise?
If Circuses are ok is sea cruises, holiday get-aways, first class accommodations for other events ok?

Are there any scriptures on how to gain converts?
Are there any scriptures on what it means to reach your neighbors?
Are there any scriptures to gauge the methods and activities that can be used for Church outreaches?

Is this an imitation of the world because there are no examples in scripture to follow?
Is this the best we can do to follow Jesus in reaching our neighbors?

Personally, I find this sort of thing as a bill-board sized statement to the community and to God "We have nothing to offer but what the world has to offer" and "Please attend here, you will never know the difference between the world you live in now and the added accoutrement of Church-going when attending here"

But alas, I am not big church pastor and I do not have a congregation what could I know?


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Marvin

 2017/12/4 13:49Profile
Gloryandgrace
Member



Joined: 2017/7/14
Posts: 1162
Snoqualmie, WA

 Re:


I love Oswald Chambers...and I say bologna to that statement.

Its not a matter of having a critical or mean spirit when I say..."its because we pretended to pray and didn't say anything to rouse the attention or angst of the ungodly that we are in the situation we are in now".

If we lived godly and spoke as godly men do speak, our needed intercessions would not be the only evidence of our care and concern for the ungodly lost.

Jesus should have just interceded instead of scolding and judging those Pharisees in Matt 23.

The devil loves silence especially when the only voice out there is his.


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Marvin

 2017/12/4 13:57Profile
MrBillPro
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Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 3317
Texas

 Re:

I think with me personally, if I'm having a hard time with some of the things the Churches do today, it's just because I'm 66 and grew up in a different era, where your never saw anything like this at Church. I could not even begin to judge something like this, because of my age my bias would probably kick in. :-)


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Bill

 2017/12/4 14:19Profile
TMK
Member



Joined: 2012/2/8
Posts: 5638
NC, USA

 Re:

“The Distraction of Contempt” by Oswald Chambers

Have mercy on us, O Lord, have mercy on us! For we are exceedingly filled with contempt. —Psalm 123:3

What we must beware of is not damage to our belief in God but damage to our Christian disposition or state of mind. “Take heed to your spirit, that you do not deal treacherously” (Malachi 2:16). Our state of mind is powerful in its effects. It can be the enemy that penetrates right into our soul and distracts our mind from God. There are certain attitudes we should never dare to indulge. If we do, we will find they have distracted us from faith in God. Until we get back into a quiet mood before Him, our faith is of no value, and our confidence in the flesh and in human ingenuity is what rules our lives.

Beware of “the cares of this world…” (Mark 4:19). They are the very things that produce the wrong attitudes in our soul. It is incredible what enormous power there is in simple things to distract our attention away from God. Refuse to be swamped by “the cares of this world.”

Another thing that distracts us is our passion for vindication. St. Augustine prayed, “O Lord, deliver me from this lust of always vindicating myself.” Such a need for constant vindication destroys our soul’s faith in God. Don’t say, “I must explain myself,” or, “I must get people to understand.” Our Lord never explained anything— He left the misunderstandings or misconceptions of others to correct themselves.

When we discern that other people are not growing spiritually and allow that discernment to turn to criticism, we block our fellowship with God. God never gives us discernment so that we may criticize, but that we may intercede.


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Todd

 2017/12/4 15:05Profile
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Joined: 2011/10/21
Posts: 1450
Dothan, Alabama

 Re: brother Todd

And again....
AMEN:)


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Fletcher

 2017/12/4 16:15Profile
Gloryandgrace
Member



Joined: 2017/7/14
Posts: 1162
Snoqualmie, WA

 Re:


It is true I could be motivated to vindicate myself to you all for no other reason than to sound critical of what others do in order that I can draw away disciples unto myself. It may be since I am not known personally that Oswald is right and Marvin is dealing treacherously with his brothers.
Allow me to make matters worse.

This nation is about to exile its Christians, it will persecute them, shut them down and come to their front doors warning them of what can happen if they live their faith outside of their homes.
There is a rebellious band that hates the message of the gospel and they will not be happy until we are rendered inert by compromise or silenced by imprisonment or death.

Believe this or not, I believe this, I believe we are on the threshold of tribulations we have not seen before in this country. I consider circus and the like are nothing more than false prophets telling us all "there's nothing to fear, all will be well". We live in an era of complacency and utter ignorance of the fear of God. We will not pay the slightest heed to monster storms, raging fires, and the repudiation of our constitution by our leaders.

This to me is a sign we are ripe for judgment, it will come to the house of God first and we will loath our circus and our fancy trips on boats, resort retreats where repentance is done that lasts only as long as the emotionalism of the speaker is present. We will loath ourselves for the worldliness in our hearts and we will loath ourselves for the compromises, love of entertainments and big church parties...when in a short time we will realize there was no repentance due to the circus, or from the party atmosphere of laughing prophets. We are ripe for picking, and we will be picked...but like Jeremiah found out, figs that are over ripe are good for nothing. There is an over-ripeness among the people of God, these will be chaff and blown away, rotten figs that are thrown out, cloths that are good for nothing.

I see this as nothing more than a clear sign the people of God are seduced by the world and to use Oswald Chambers as a means to quiet the naysayers who cannot abide anymore childish game playing in the name of Jesus.

Sing your Jesus songs, play on the Ferris wheel and take long rides on the merry go round because the prophets and priests, pastors and teachers that fund these rides with the money given for the kingdom will be required of them on judgment day.

There is no urgency they say, there is no cause for alarm, why pray, why seek God unless it's convenient to our own ends.

Its not that Evangeline was wrong in what she posted, its a reality that is only touched upon in her spirit but has not the boldness to make known the calamity that awaits the people of God. We will be purged, we will be thrown up for the removal of the chaff in all our lives. We will be set on divine balances and we will be found wanting. God is even now moving to end the monstrosity we call Christianity and Evangelicalism here in America, what will be left will be pure and godly, without admixture of impure and inert human methodologies.

This circus is a picture of what is going on in Evangelicalism...party till the power goes out, the darkness falls and the taskmasters pour in to take from that circus all the slaves that bear the mark of their owners.

Understand or not, believe or not, be filled with misconceptions or not because we refused to discern and speak to one another the danger of our impending exile, for certainly it will come. May God have mercy on us for we were not filled with contempt except for those who condemned our falsehoods.


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Marvin

 2017/12/4 16:45Profile
MrBillPro
Member



Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 3317
Texas

 Re:

For me personally, living on this earth for 66 years has been a circus, if it were not for my relationship with Christ, I would have probably jumped from the tight rope long ago.


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Bill

 2017/12/4 17:38Profile





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