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Discussion Forum : News and Current Events : Leonard Ravenhill's Son David Offers Prophetic Insight Into the Church Under Trump

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Joined: 2002/12/11
Posts: 37631
"Pilgrim and Sojourner." - 1 Peter 2:11

 Leonard Ravenhill's Son David Offers Prophetic Insight Into the Church Under Trump

America is at a crossroads. Never in our short history has our nation been so divided, either racially, politically, spiritually or ideologically. Jesus made it abundantly clear that a nation divided cannot stand. What that last straw is that will forever break the back of this nation nobody knows for sure. What we do know is that we are either heading for revival or revolution.

Yes, I voted for Trump for president; however, I was not caught up in the vitriol like so many of our evangelical leaders that considered Trump God's anointed.

When Israel rejected God as their King and demanded a king like the nations around them, God anointed Saul as their king. I believe, like Israel of old, the church likewise rejected God and sought out a man to be their political savior. Speaking of Saul, I see many similarities between Saul and Trump. Saul was proud and bombastic about his accomplishments. He even went as far as to build a monument to himself. Trump likewise likes to boast about his achievements. Saul was thin-skinned and lashed out at those around him. Trump likewise loves to be honored among the people. Saul was quick to turn against his own son as well as David. Trump too has turned against those who helped him win the election. Saul failed to obey God or seek after Him and thereby lost his office and anointing. Trump could easily do the same.

Prior to the presidential election, I recall writing that if Hillary became president, she might doom America but save the church. On the other hand, if Trump became president, he might save America and doom the church. In other words, my fear was, and still is, that the church will settle back to her complacent state, thinking to herself, Thank God we dodged that bullet, meaning Hillary. Hillary would have been a disastrous choice for America, but might have provoked the church to turn back to God and cry out for revival. Only time will tell if Trump is/was God's anointed or if instead God gave us the desires of our heart while sending leanness to our souls (see Ps. 73:25).

Regardless of who is in office, only God can change America. Unfortunately, the church has failed to fully comprehend its true potential. Jesus made clear that He intended to build a church that the gates of hell could not prevail against. Why then is hell prevailing at every turn?

One reason is clear, and that is that we have placed our trust in the office of a man rather than in the power of the living God. King David learned that lesson the hard way. After numbering Israel's military capabilities, he was instantly convicted and cried out "I've sinned exceedingly". Why didn't David say "I've Sinned" as he did after committing adultery with Bathsheba? The greatness of David's sin is measured by the severity of God's judgment. His sin of passion cost him one life but his sin of pride cost him seventy thousand lives. Little wonder he cried "'I have sinned greatly in doing this thing'" (1 Chron. 21:8a). David failed to acknowledge God's protective power when facing his enemies and chose rather to trust in his "chariots and horses" (see Ps. 20:7).

The church in America may well be taking a page from David's folly and placing her trust in Trump rather than God's promise to heal the land of those who humble themselves, pray and turn from their wicked ways (see 2 Chron. 7:14).

Only the other day, I was reminded again of God's promises. An old Scottish writer was quoting from Exodus 34:7a "Keeping mercy for thousands, forgiving iniquity and transgression and sin, but who will by no means clear the guilty." The writer went on to say, "He is faithful who promised." Do we bear sufficiently in mind another truth of equal fidelity: He is faithful who threatens? Ponder that solemn word, "He will by no means clear the guilty!"

With 52 million aborted lives on our record, is God going to simply turn a blind eye to America's devilish sin against the unborn just because Trump is president? I don't believe so. I know there is the belief among some in the prophetic community that God would never destroy America because of all the good she has done; I'm not of that belief.

Our choice is simple: We either repent and cry out to God for mercy or face the wrath of God as He promised so long ago. I was pleasantly surprised to hear while visiting Singapore recently that there were many churches there who prayed earnestly for our presidential election last year. The tragedy, though, was to have to tell them I knew very few congregations in America who set time aside to pray for our own election.

Prior to my father's death in '94, he would say, "If America doesn't concentrate in prayer, they will pray in concentration camps." President Trump was elected to govern in the natural arena; the church was birthed to govern in the spiritual realm. Our power and authority is far greater than any Congress, Senate, Supreme Court or president. If we fail to take our place, America will miss her day of visitation, like Jerusalem of old. It's time to rise up and take our rightful place before the throne of God and implore God for a mighty move of His Spirit.

Revival or revolution? The church will decide.


SI Moderator - Greg Gordon

 2017/8/25 7:05Profile

Joined: 2016/11/15
Posts: 263

 Re: Leonard Ravenhill's Son David Offers Prophetic Insight Into the Church Under

A powerful level headed voice in this age of mixed messages to the church.

What will it take for us to listen, let alone obey?

Thanks for posting, Greg.

L Young

 2017/8/25 8:10Profile

 Re: Leonard Ravenhill's Son David Offers Prophetic Insight Into the Church Under

••• Prior to the presidential election, I recall writing that if Hillary became president, she might doom America but save the church. On the other hand, if Trump became president, he might save America and doom the church. •••

I remember sharing this observation om a thread prior to the elections. That if Hillary Clinton were elected and persecution started in the church then surely the Ametican church would repent and seek Christ. But if Donald Trump were elected then the church would relax and not repent and see Christ. Our brother confirms this observation above and this is what we see today.

Even though many evangelicals are relaxing under the presidency of Donald Trump because he has promised to make America great. There are evangelicals who are hailing him as the next annointed Cyrus where Donald Trump will preserve the status quo. And because of his presidency the American evangelical Cmchurch is sleeping.

For indeed Donald Trump has saved America. If you can say such in the first hundred days of his presidency. But for sure he has doomed the church. But then is this not the Judgment of God that comes up on the church as the Apostle Peter wrote about.

Bro Blaine

 2017/8/25 11:46


••• Revival or revolution? The church will decide.•••

I would go with the third option of our brother Steve Brogden. It should be "repudiation". That is that the remnant should come out of the Babylonian church system and "repudiate" the structure. That the remnant should cleave as unto Christ and be separate from Babylon. That the remnant should become followers of the Lamb. And not followers of Donald Trump.

Bro Blaine

 2017/8/25 11:51


Our sister asks below,

••• What will it take for us to listen, let alone obey? •••

I believe it will only take a crisis from the hand of God that should bring us to our face and cry out to God for mercy and repentance. But even in the midst of such a crisis I imagine there will be those who will reject the notion. If not outright curse God. I certainly would expect this from the non-believers. But even believers reject the notion of the Judgment of God.

I am probably one of the few who saw the upcoming solar eclipse as a side of judgment upon America. Many in the forum rejected this notion. Indeed many in the Forum reject the notion that God will judge America. Yet right now there is a category 3 hurricane that is spinning off the coast of Texas. Interesting since this comes the same week of the solar eclipse. But I can hear those pn Sermonindexnex saying this is only a random occurrence. We have always had hurricanes.

At least those in Nineveh did repent after a series of plagues, civil Wars, and a solar eclipse. This will be the generation that will stand up and condemn Sermonindexnex. For the generation from Nineveh will say we repented at the preaching of Jonah. You had the greater revelation of the gospel and the Holy Spirit. And you did not repent.

But then Sermonindexnex is only s small microcosm of the American Church. The generation from Nenaveh will condemn the American church because they did not repent for the greater light that they had.

Bro Blaine

 2017/8/25 12:01


Jehovah rides upon a swift cloud. There is no revival that will save this nation. The fate of this nation is something quite separate from the fate of Christendom. When it comes to judgment, one is judged by whom that one associates himself with. Those who find themselves in the presence of Almighty God will very naturally be separate from those who associate themselves with the world and all of its ways. We see this playing out before our very eyes as denomination after denomination bow down before the gods of this secular world. And so, in the end, it will all come down to who you bow down to. A genuine saint will never bow down to the gods of this world and by refusing to do so, will incur the wrath of those who do, especially the wrath of those who are part of Christendom. They will hate them with a perfect hatred because they expose their truly secular hearts and desire to please this world and their gods............bro Frank

 2017/8/25 15:25

Joined: 2006/9/16
Posts: 2219

 Re: Questions

1) How is the Evangelical Church supposedly sleeping? What does that mean? In what ways and area is it sleeping?

2) Is judgment on an increasingly apostate secular America to be equated with and connected to "judgment" on the church? In the midst of His judgments, why would God single out the church in particular to judge?

3) Is there a difference between the church being chastened, disciplined and stripped of remaining self reliance and carnality and the church being "judged?"

4) Because certain parts of the church have embraced apostasy can the entire church be legitimately be said to be in need of judgment? Why would God judge into oblivion His true church which may be only a remnant but nonetheless still exists?

5) Can voices proclaiming God is about to judge the American church in particular really be ministering a form of unhealthy church bashing that sows guilt and condemnation rather than the true conviction of the Holy Spirit?

David Winter

 2017/8/25 18:02Profile

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