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Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : End time teaching of Elijah in the last days

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 Re: A church of power in the wilderness and dividing the spiritual sons of Abraham

Jacob Prasch seems to teach against the pre-trib view.

Meanwhile, if a church of power leaves its comfortable churches and comfort zone and goes to the wilderness full of power what will be the purpose or use for it all? If this church full of power in the wilderness is going to be snatched away before its power can be used during bad times then a move to the wilderness outside of their comfortable churches basically is non relevant. What type of end time role is that for the church? Would not a separated church full of power be called to display this power of Christ or will its role be to separate and become full of power just to be caught away and not display any of its power? The two witnesses appear in the time of trouble but if the church is gone it wont have a whit of meaning for a church that was bursting at the seams with the power of Christ before it was taken away.

The middle wall of partition divided Jews and Gentiles but the pre-trib teaching that tribulation believers will not be part of the of the church erects a middle wall of partition between the spiritual sons of Abraham. If membership in the church supposedly ends at a pre-trib rapture and tribulation believers who put their faith in Christ will never be part of the church then this view calls into question the very nature of the church. John Darby was the first ever to propose this. If a latter day Elijah is sent to Israel (the church now gone) and many in Israel turn to the Lord in faith and are washed in the blood of Christ how can it be advocated they will never be part of the Church? When the pre-trib view is presented why are these views that accompany it seldom mentioned?





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David Winter

 2017/6/19 12:42Profile
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 Re:

Hi Docs
I think that Jacob Prasch teaches against Once saved always saved and I think he is either Pre trib or Mid Trib but he definitely thinks Elijah comes again before Christ comes...

I think Elijah is sent to Israel and the Church at the same time and not in the second half of the Tribulatin but in the first half ..just a thought maybe thats why their are Two Witnesses..but the testimony of the witnesses is in the first half not the second,
urs staff

 2017/6/19 15:35Profile
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 Re:

Hi Blaine,
Definitely John fullfilled the role of Elijah and was the Elijah that was to come .It doesnt mean that he isnt coming again though!Also I noticed that Elijah as in John wasnt recognised and thats still happening today in my opinion in large we arent reconising that he is coming again.
One other point if the people of the day had trouble recognising him and trouble understanding the simple how could Jesus explain that he would come again and why would he ?

•••And His disciples asked Him, “Why then do the scribes say that "Elijah must come first?” And He answered and said, “Elijah is coming and will restore all things; but I say to you that Elijah already came, and they did not recognize him, but did to him whatever they wished. So also "the Son of Man is going to suffer at their hands.” [[[Then the disciples understood that He had spoken to them about John the Baptist.]]]•

urs staff

 2017/6/19 15:42Profile
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 Re:

Hi Docs
I think u are missing my point regarding the Church in the wilderness.
Their is an amazing paralel between both Elijah and John that cant be ignored
All Israel went out to see Elijah
All Judea and the surrounds went out to see John

Their will be a going out is what I mean and it will bring an end to denominational Churches.
The false leaders and even some good ones will be trying to keep control by going out with them but Elijah will say ye brood of vipers as was said before.
The Church will be in a position to preach one last time to all the corners of the Earth .
What will Elijah preach?What will the Church Preach?
Simple really they will preach the same message as the first time Christ came,Repent Christ is coming and he is coming soon...
urs staff

 2017/6/19 15:50Profile









 Re: Staff

•••One other point if the people of the day had trouble recognising him and trouble understanding the simple how could Jesus explain that he would come again and why would he ?

And His disciples asked Him, “Why then do the scribes say that "Elijah must come first?” And He answered and said, “Elijah is coming and will restore all things; but I say to you that Elijah already came, and they did not recognize him, but did to him whatever they wished. So also "the Son of Man is going to suffer at their hands.” [[[Then the disciples understood that He had spoken to them about John the Baptist.]]]•••

Fair question. And one I'm still pondering. But it seems that the testimony of Jesus is that the Elijah did come in the person of John the Baptist. I can't find the witness of scripture that say he's coming again unless he is one of the two prophets mentioned in Revelation.

The referring to Elijah must come again could be referring to Jesus Himself. Just a speculative guess on my part. I do remember a verse out of Acts that say he must remain in Heaven until the restoration of all things. I cannot recall where it's at. But will certainly ponder the question.

Bro Blaine

 2017/6/19 16:05
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 Re:

I see what you mean by going out. But when did Elijah and John the Baptist just suddenly vanish when people went out to hear them? If this Church in the wilderness preaches repentance and the soon coming of Christ then suddenly disappears what will be the explanation? Will those asking what happened be told yes this disappeared church preached the soon coming of Christ but what has just happened at this rapture was indeed Christ coming for His Church but don't mistake it for the second coming this Church preached about. This was just a coming before the second coming. Think it through staff good bro. What a mismash of confusion. Then we are to believe those washed in the blood of Christ during the tribulation (Rev 7:14) will not be part of the body of Christ. And they will be saved while not having the Spirit dwell within them! How more absurd can the pre-trib view become? It's a ruse from start to finish.

The timing of the Day of the Lord (which the pre-trib view was forced to change to stay credible) and the timing of the last trumpet signalling the resurrection of the dead has your view snookered behind the eight ball with no way out. You said you don't know much about the trumpets. Well, that's okay. I'm not trying to be condescending but if you want to look at them together I would be glad to do so.

Thank you for your witness and strong commitment to Christ.


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 2017/6/19 16:26Profile
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 Re:

Quote:
Their will be a going out is what I mean and it will bring an end to denominational Churches.
The false leaders and even some good ones will be trying to keep control by going out with them but Elijah will say ye brood of vipers as was said before.
The Church will be in a position to preach one last time to all the corners of the Earth .




So you are stating that the after the death of the apostles at some point the entire church apostized and denominations began? And now finally after 2000 years there will be another "john the baptist" ie Elijah who will restore the true church in unity and condemn all denominations?


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 2017/6/19 16:37Profile
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 Re:

The two witnesses appear in the interlude between the sounding of the sixth and seventh trumpets. How is that the first half of the tribulation?


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 2017/6/19 17:14Profile
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 Re:

Hi Greg
I am not saying that at all,
I was stating that the Church (true Church) will come back under Apostolic Doctrine similar to the early church.Denominations will by in large cease due to Apostolic Doctrine.Remember Greg all things although impossible to you are possible to God,even Church unity.
You have to remember that in the Jewish Wedding about which much is always said what is role of the "friend of the bridegroom" and what are the roles in the Jewish wedding of the "Two Witnesses"???
urs staff

 2017/6/19 17:39Profile
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 Re:

Hi Docs,
The Two witnesses prophecy for 1260 days which is 3 1/2 years.
The time they prophesy the Anti Christ is not in full control and its in peace time .Their are only two 3 1/2 year periods the first and the second and its not the second.
If the witness isnt Elijah then who is he?Why would God send a Herald? and what would he be heralding?
What about my Earlier posts regarding the similarites between John and Elijah are they just coincidence Docs and Greg?
Isnt it a good idea at least if you want to find out what a future Elijah does that we should look at what he did in the past?I think it is.
Isnt it strange that their are 12 stones put in the middle of the Jordon?and John Baptises in the Jordon and Elijah Crosses the Jordon.Is it at all possible that God is saying I put something there study and find out why I did these odd things,
By in large denominational Churches means division and for a short sharp period the names may remain but the division will disappear is what I think will happen,Isnt it possble that God can bring about unity ,I think it is,
urs staff

 2017/6/19 17:54Profile





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