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TMK
Member



Joined: 2012/2/8
Posts: 5638
NC, USA

 Re:

I hear you Keith. This is a tough one. Believe me I as much as anyone am so saddened how a very small minority of individuals have taken so much of our culture hostage. There is great organization and militism in that movement.

I read recently a comment that when anorexia became a huge topic after Karen Carpenter died how there was great awareness and push for people who have this condition (which is a condition of mistaken body image) to get psychological and medical help. But with people with transgender issues (mistaken body image) it is celebrated and heralded as normal.

I am just not sure what kind if a witness it is to those folks when Christians do things like this. In other words, how must this make them feel about Christians and the God they say they represent.

Jesus told us to love people and leave the results to Him. It might be loving to boycott Target- I just don't know. Obviously we are to protect our children and not expose them to perversion. The risk of that is likely extremely low particularly if you are with your child in the restroom. But there is some risk nonetheless.

I don't have answers-- only questions. But I do know the typical Christian response to such issues in the past 20 years or so has failed miserably. After all, look where our society is. It is worse not better.

Isn't the definition of insanity doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results?


_________________
Todd

 2016/4/28 17:34Profile
TMK
Member



Joined: 2012/2/8
Posts: 5638
NC, USA

 Re:

Jasmine-

It would have to be a lot of Christians doing it- not just a couple. Like a whole church after Sunday service. Soon the owners would wonder "why are they doing this?" It would have a better effect than knowing Christians are avoiding (judging) them. "Heaping coals on their head" means it may bring their sin and shame to light. This could lead either to repentance or further hardening.

It is purely a hypothetical- I have never been in such a situation.

Let me ask this. What if Jesus was here walking with us and he said "I'd like some bread". He sees this hypothetical bakery and says "they sell bread- lets go in here." I say "Master we can't go in there because the owners are gay." What would Jesus say to me, based on what he is recorded as saying in similar situations in scripture?

EDIT: I might add that if we were with Jesus and we came across a pervert abusing a child, we would likely see a side of Jesus we may not expect. Millstones come to mind.


_________________
Todd

 2016/4/28 17:42Profile
MrBillPro
Member



Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 3317
Texas

 Re:

Maybe it’s time to stop asking what Jesus would do in every situation. Many of us think we have Jesus pegged what kind of car He’d drive, what kind of political party He’d join, and so on. But the fact is, we really don’t know what He’d do in this or many other situations. He had a habit of overturning people’s expectations and tables. I will go out on a theological limb here, and say there is ample reason to suspect that Jesus would not be nearly as compliant as maybe some suggests. Jesus was very jealous for His Father’s reputation. When the Temple departed from its original purpose of being a house of prayer for all nations and instead became a den of robbers, Jesus was outraged. It wasn’t because He had scruples against money, but because this sinful system was obscuring God’s holy character. The Father’s name, rather than being hallowed, was being profaned. Jesus didn’t meekly go along with this sacrilege. He overturned the tables.

Jesus, of course, also defined marriage as exclusively between one man and one woman, “from the beginning.” He performed his first miracle, turning water into wine at Cana in Galilee, at a wedding. There was no moral question mark attached to this event, because marriage is good in itself good for the man and woman who become “one flesh,” good for the children who are expected as a matter of course to result from this union, and good because of the picture it provides of the relationship between Christ and His church. Homosexual unions, even those called marriages, provide none of these benefits, and in fact would obscure them, keeping people from seeing God’s best. Homosexual unions certainly don’t strengthen marriage. Jesus strongly opposed anything that would undermine marriage that is, the union of one man and one woman. He disallowed divorce except for marital unfaithfulness. Though He was extremely gentle with sexual sinners such as the Samaritan woman and the woman caught in adultery, Jesus was clear that such behavior was unacceptable, telling the latter, “Go, and sin no more.”


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Bill

 2016/4/28 18:16Profile
Jasmine
Member



Joined: 2005/11/19
Posts: 96


 Re:

@TMK

I think you have a false dichotomy because I walked with a gay person for a number of years. The issue was never the fact that he was gay. The issue was he needed to be Born Again. He shared a lot of things with me but I never felt led to focus on his homosexuality. If you get stuck on homosexuality it's like going down the rabbit hole because people can change a behavior even a lifestyle and still go to hell. So you don't focus on that. While I understand what you're trying to say, what you're describing would only encourage them in their homosexual lifestyle IMO. At least the ones I know would have taken it that way. So it's not a good way to witness Christ. Instead the Lord told me to open up my life to this person and welcome him in. It was amazing. God was steadily blowing that man's mind. After six years he got Saved. It really showed me the power of everyday life in Christ. God looks very attractive to others when we just do us in Him!

So I think you have to be careful that your actions don't have an unintended outcome based on faulty perception. People need to know whose you are and what stand for. It's up to us to tell them and then invite them into our lives. So this is not about gays or trangenders. This doesn't just involve Christians even though Christians were the ones to sound this particular alarm.. Sure I think the spiritual component is always there but this is primarily about practical SAFETY, and I don't know why that is so hard for some of you to grasp. Should I as a woman/mother just sit back and say nothing because I'm a Christians?

 2016/4/28 18:31Profile









 Re:

Jasmine writes.........

"Sure I think the spiritual component is always there but this is primarily about practical SAFETY, and I don't know why that is so hard for some of you to grasp. Should I as a woman/mother just sit back and say nothing because I'm a Christians?"

Spot on sister, its not that complicated. Great post, sound and balanced.............bro Frank

 2016/4/28 18:35
MrBillPro
Member



Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 3317
Texas

 Re:

Jasmine, I totally believe that God has placed some folks in lives of others to witness to them about Jesus Christ. Please remember, we all are not called to do this, this is why God chooses certain folks for certain things in life. I personally know I would not be able to be around a gay person very long, why? because I feel it might compromise my relationship with the Lord, and of course God already knows this, and that's why it's not my calling.


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Bill

 2016/4/28 18:40Profile
Jasmine
Member



Joined: 2005/11/19
Posts: 96


 Re:

@MrBillPro

That's okay brother. No blame No shame. Do YOU in God. I think that's all He really wants us to do anyways :)

 2016/4/28 18:52Profile









 Re: Jasmine

"...this is primarily about practical SAFETY, and I don't know why that is so hard for some of you to grasp."

Exactly...this is the proper basis for a boycott. As I said before, the scripture that Todd quoted is not relevant to the situation at all. And neither is that scripture relevant to many other things, such as the posting of sexual predators on internet databases. Many things must be done for common sense and safety reasons and if corporations do not want to put their customers first then shop elsewhere...or send them a message by signing up for the online boycott petition or whatever it is. Its simply an attempt to send a message to Target.

 2016/4/28 18:57
MrBillPro
Member



Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 3317
Texas

 Re:

It's ok to love folks, it's ok to witness to everyone if you feel the calling. One thing we all need to be aware of, old sluefoot, is a very crafty character, don't allow him to get you to feeling sorry for folks, thinking they are caught up in a lifestyle they don't want to be in. I will say this, it would absolutely take a special calling, and a heap of spiritual discernment, prayer and fasting, to be able to be around a man that is having sex with another man. I would say a person needs to stay in solid prayer and fasting for a while before taking on such a challenge. I'm as far as the east from the west, to be able to even entertain the thought of witnessing to a man sleeping with another man, and again, I know God knows this.


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Bill

 2016/4/28 19:16Profile
JHerndon
Member



Joined: 2010/8/1
Posts: 92
Bonifay,Fl

 Re:

I am not big on boycotts. I had never really given much thought about it until the whole chick fil a thing a while back. I think they put off a snobby jerk vibe. Kinda like Pharisees who didn't want to do certain things because it would make them unclean and unable to eat the Passover. Imagine if Jesus was a boycotter. Most of the stories in the gospels wouldn't exist. I believe that there are times where we as followers of Christ are called out of our morale position to meet the need and minister to someone who is broken and hurting. For example i do not believe in abortion. However, if a woman in my community had an abortion should we not minister to her because we are against abortion? For every abortion there is the murder of an unborn child yes but there is also a woman who is lost, broken, and very likely hurting from this experience. We as followers of Christ must step out of our morale position and act in the love of Christ!


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Joshua Herndon

 2016/4/29 8:36Profile





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