SermonIndex Audio Sermons
SermonIndex - Promoting Revival to this Generation
Give To SermonIndex
Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : Did Jesus and the Apostles have ulterior motives...?

Print Thread (PDF)

Goto page ( 1 | 2 | 3 Next Page )
PosterThread
TMK
Member



Joined: 2012/2/8
Posts: 6650
NC, USA

 Did Jesus and the Apostles have ulterior motives...?

Reading another post brought this question to mind that I guess I haven't considered before:

Did Jesus or the apostles have "ulterior motives" when they performed a miracle?


_________________
Todd

 2015/1/21 15:50Profile
Lysa
Member



Joined: 2008/10/25
Posts: 3699
East TN for now!

 Re: Did Jesus and the Apostles have ulterior motives...?


I was reading the different threads and came across this title and said to myself, "That is a TMK question." Click on it and BOOM, there you were!!! :)

Back to your question... I thought of Simon the Sorcerer...

Quote:
in Acts 8:17-24, Then they began laying their hands on them, and they were receiving the Holy Spirit. Now when Simon saw that the Spirit was bestowed through the laying on of the apostles' hands, he offered them money, saying, "Give this authority to me as well, so that everyone on whom I lay my hands may receive the Holy Spirit."

But Peter said to him, "May your silver perish with you, because you thought you could obtain the gift of God with money! You have no part or portion in this matter, for your heart is not right before God. You have no part or portion in this matter, for your heart is not right before God. Therefore repent of this wickedness of yours, and pray the Lord that, if possible, the intention of your heart may be forgiven you. For I see that you are in the gall of bitterness and in the bondage of iniquity."


He and Judas are the only ones who came to mind, but I'm quite sure that there is more. Until we allow more and more of the Holy Spirit to move into our lives and allow Him to move out the wicked humanness (pride, jealousy, envy, etc), in us, we will probably all have an ulterior motive with the things of God.

I enjoy your questions, do not stop asking them!!!

God bless,
Lisa


_________________
Lisa

 2015/1/21 16:46Profile
Heydave
Member



Joined: 2008/4/12
Posts: 1306
Hampshire, UK

 Re: Did Jesus and the Apostles have ulterior motives...?

"When Jesus heard that, He said, “This sickness is not unto death, but for the glory of God, that the Son of God may be glorified through it.”

Everything Jesus did had the ulterior motive of glorifying His Father.
Everything the apostles did and we do should be to bring glory to God. If you want to call this an ulterior motive, then yes it is.

Jesus said in the above that his friend Lazarus' death and being raised from the dead was to bring glory to God and the Son of God.

Ultimately its not about us, but it is all about Him. Even us being saved is for God's glory and not centered on us. Yes we are beneficiaries of God's mercy and grace, but blessed beyond measure, but it is still God who is the focus and gets all the glory.


_________________
Dave

 2015/1/21 16:58Profile
yuehan
Member



Joined: 2011/6/15
Posts: 562


 Re:

Quote:
"When Jesus heard that, He said, “This sickness is not unto death, but for the glory of God, that the Son of God may be glorified through it.”

Everything Jesus did had the ulterior motive of glorifying His Father.
Everything the apostles did and we do should be to bring glory to God. If you want to call this an ulterior motive, then yes it is.


If Jesus declared His intentions so openly, they certainly couldn't be labelled as "ulterior"!


 2015/1/21 17:06Profile
Heydave
Member



Joined: 2008/4/12
Posts: 1306
Hampshire, UK

 Re:

Depends how you define ulterior motive. In my understanding it is not necessarily a negative thing. It just means a motive that is beyond or different to that which it seems on the surface.

I am taking it that TMK is not suggeating Jesus had any wrong motives (Otherwise he is posing a stupid question). But in the sense that I take it, then yes Jesus always had an ultimate motive beyond the temporal, which was to glorify God.


_________________
Dave

 2015/1/21 17:11Profile
dolfan
Member



Joined: 2011/8/23
Posts: 1727
Tennessee, but my home's in Alabama

 Re:

Ulterior or alterior? :)
Ulterior is underlying motive or you could say ultimate motive. It might or might not not be readily apparent.

Alterior is motive that belies the stated motive.

Jesus allowing Lazarus to die was ulterior. He said why He waited to go to Bethany.

If Jesus had said "I have to go to Jerusalem first to feed some hungry kids," and really went only to go and afterward to go to Bethany and raise Lazarus for the glory of God, his statement about going to Jerusalem would have an alterior motive: to let Lazarus die and lie for 4 days before raising Him to God's glory.


_________________
Tim

 2015/1/21 17:30Profile
TMK
Member



Joined: 2012/2/8
Posts: 6650
NC, USA

 Re:

Heydave-

I agree with you but about the "ulterior motive" being always to bring glory to God. But I wasn't thinking along those lines.

For example, in Lysa's example re Simon the Sorcerer he did have an ulterior motive- namely he wanted the power to work miracles.

But I am trying to think of a time when Jesus or the apostles had other ulterior motives, even GOOD ulterior motives.

It seems that a plain reading of the accounts would indicate that Jesus healed people because they needed to be healed. It wasn't to grow his ministry (although that was a result). When he calmed the storm it was because there was a storm that needed calmed (and because the disciples were freaking out). Peter and John healed the lame man because he was lame, and Jesus multiplied food because people were hungry and had no food to eat.

The only miracle I am not exactly sure about the motivation is Jesus walking on water.

I guess maybe the "ulterior motive" behind my question is that I am wondering if we do not see more **legitimate** miraculous type things is because Christians have ulterior motives. In other words, would we ever lay hands on someone and pray for healing just because we have compassion and they are sick- or are we thinking about something else, like "I wonder if this will work" or "if this works I will post in on Facebook" or "if this works I can then share the gospel." I am not saying this last thing is a bad ulterior motive but it may be an ulterior motive that may (or may not) have an effect on how effective our attempt may be.

Just musings!


_________________
Todd

 2015/1/21 17:36Profile
Oracio
Member



Joined: 2007/6/26
Posts: 2094
Whittier CA USA

 Re:

I agree with Heydave on the ultimate motive for Jesus' and the Apostles' miracles. Another motive or reason from God's standpoint is the fulfillment of OT prophecies which proved Jesus to be the Messiah and the Apostles and disciples to be sent from God. A few scriptures that teach that are:

Matt.8:16-17
"When evening had come, they brought to Him many who were demon-possessed. And He cast out the spirits with a word, and healed all who were sick, 17 that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by Isaiah the prophet, saying: "He Himself took our infirmities And bore our sicknesses."

Isa. 35:5-6
"Then the eyes of the blind shall be opened, And the ears of the deaf shall be unstopped. 6 Then the lame shall leap like a deer, And the tongue of the dumb sing. For waters shall burst forth in the wilderness, And streams in the desert."

Matt.11:4-5
"Jesus answered and said to them, "Go and tell John the things which you hear and see: 5 The blind see and the lame walk; the lepers are cleansed and the deaf hear; the dead are raised up and the poor have the gospel preached to them."

Joel 2:28-29
"And it shall come to pass afterward That I will pour out My Spirit on all flesh; Your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, Your old men shall dream dreams, Your young men shall see visions. 29 And also on My menservants and on My maidservants I will pour out My Spirit in those days."

2 Cor. 12:12
"Truly the signs of an apostle were accomplished among you with all perseverance, in signs and wonders and mighty deeds."


_________________
Oracio

 2015/1/21 18:05Profile
Jeremy221
Member



Joined: 2009/11/7
Posts: 1532


 Re: Did Jesus and the Apostles have ulterior motives...?

TMK,

You seem to miss the source of the miracles. Are familiar with what Christ stated about where every speaking and act came from?

Jesus was given the Spirit without measure because He loved righteousness and hated iniquity more than His brethren. You are asking a Simon the Sorcerer question as though there was deception in Jesus Christ. The means and motive were not "in" either group, it was "of" the Father. The Gospels even state that though Christ had the Spirit without measure that there were times when the Spirit was not upon Him to heal.

 2015/1/21 20:05Profile
TMK
Member



Joined: 2012/2/8
Posts: 6650
NC, USA

 Re:

Quote:

"The Gospels even state that though Christ had the Spirit without measure that there were times when the Spirit was not upon Him to heal."

Can you show in the scripture where it says the Spirit was not upon him to heal? It might be there just not sure where. I know he did not do many works in Nazareth because of their lack of faith.

I am not arguing that the miracles etc were not wrought by the power of the HS nor am I suggesting that Jesus did anything not directed by the Father.

But Hebrews says that Jesus was the exact representation of the Father and the Church is supposed to be the representation of Christ on the earth but something has been lost in the translation.


_________________
Todd

 2015/1/21 20:17Profile





All sermons are offered freely and all contents of the site
where applicable is committed to the public domain for the
free spread of the gospel.