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 Re:

MJ writes..........

' I have come to see if we truly seek KING JESUS and desire to know HIS heart HE will lead us according to HIS will. As in all things GOD looks at the heart of the matter and as long as we remain open to HIM and HIS authority, daily submitted unto HIM then its all good"

Amen and glory unto HIM..........bro Frank

 2014/6/25 13:43
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 Re:

Quote:
As for me I will continue to follow the LORD JESUS in this matter as HE has lead me to. I pray often and want to remain open and soft before HIM to know HIS heart in all things. This is just one area that concerns sister in the LORD that I think many new christian women struggle with. There are others as well and at times with so many differing opinions it can be difficult to wade through it all. I have come to see if we truly seek KING JESUS and desire to know HIS heart HE will lead us according to HIS will. As in all things GOD looks at the heart of the matter and as long as we remain open to HIM and HIS authority, daily submitted unto HIM then its all good :)



Amen sister your attitude and walk with the Lord is an example to all of us. May we keep Him first in all things and in the forefront. Jesus Christ and Him only. All other things work out over time when we are in a deep personal abiding relationship with the Son of God.


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SI Moderator - Greg Gordon

 2014/6/25 13:48Profile









 Re:

Hi Greg,

Brother, I am glad that we are closely aligned on this as the enemy has caused much sorrow and has most definitely sown much discord with this issue. Let me clarify, I do not believe that all sisters who wear a head-covering all the time are doing this because of bondage and legalism, some undoubtedly do it out of sincerity of heart before God and I say God bless them. Yet many who do wear the head covering all the time are in bondage to legalism and or tradition, and many are simply being obedient to their husbands who are in bondage. God knows and the fruits are typically apparent. With legalism and bondage comes fear and control and a heart that judges others. With the genuine freedom that comes from walking with a pure heart before the Lord comes love and power and a sound mind...........bro Frank

 2014/6/25 13:55
ginnyrose
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 Re:

QUOTE:
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The irony I have found, and this is just my personal experience, which is not limited but quite broad, is that those who practice head coverings all the time, Mennonites or conservative families and so on, do not have women praying or prophesying publicly so the matter is not about obedience to Scripture, rather it is compliance with their own tradition and culture. It is a bondage of legalism to many and tends to be found amongst groups who have or have had problems with legalism.
______________________________________________________________

This is true. For a lot of conservative Christians this issue has been one that has evolved into legalism. However...can one say that just because this is the case that it will negate the directives of the WORD?

In our brotherhood, the sisters are encouraged to share during times of public sharing, be it testimony of what the LORD has done for you, insights into the WORD that has impacted you, or make prayer requests. We used to pray publicly until our church got quite large but in our cell groups we do pray out loud. Not praying in a large group has nothing to do with church policy - just do not feel led to if there are plenty of males in attendance or just do not feel led to, period.

Methinks one needs to quit looking around and listen to what the Spirit teaches us. The Holy Spirit does not place a burden on us that is too heavy to bear. He will be with us, enabling us and reward us with blessings not detailed in the WORD. Such are the results of walking with the LORD in all of life.

One question that is sure to come and that is, "will refusal to wear it doom a person to hell?" I do not know. Judgement belongs to God, not me. I am content to leave it there. I do know wearing it will not guarantee one entrance to heaven.

Otherwise....why not follow the Lamb wherever He goes and give Him the Honor he deserves? That is what this is all about, is it not?


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Sandra Miller

 2014/6/25 14:43Profile
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 Re:

quote:

"One question that is sure to come and that is, "will refusal to wear it doom a person to hell?" I do not know."

Thank goodness i DO know the answer to that question. The answer is: "no, it absolutely will not."

it is not a sin to refuse to do something that is not required. it is like asking whether refusal to tithe will doom a person to hell.


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Todd

 2014/6/25 17:52Profile
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 Re:

Quote:
a heart that judges others



Frank,

Yes that would be one of the fruits of legalism and bondage is judging others. I know brother Brian see's this manifest in certain mennonite churches he ministers in. May God's people be "free" in all things.

Galatians 5:1
New International Version (NIV)

5 It is for freedom that Christ has set us free. Stand firm, then, and do not let yourselves be burdened again by a yoke of slavery.


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SI Moderator - Greg Gordon

 2014/6/25 21:06Profile
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 Re:

Quote:

You have mentioned "in Church" in some of your posts? I was wondering then do you believe this is a commend to follow while women are in church and praying or all the time? I do know some sisters who cover their heads when in prayer but do not wear the cloth cover at all times. I know of some who wear the cloth cover at all times, even when the lay down to sleep at night.



Frankly I do not have light in this area of covering the head all the time. I believe women who do it do it based on the scripture that says pray without ceasing. Since we are always inwardly praying in Spirit they want to cover their head. But I believe regarding Head covering command is only in a gathering of 2 or more believers for the purpose of prayer and encouragement. There is nothing wrong in overdoing something as long as it does not become a dead work.

Regarding the length of head covering, I do not have light on that as well. As long as it is big enough to be a symbol to men and angels it is fine I guess. We cannot be legalistic about how long it should be!


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Sreeram

 2014/6/26 0:09Profile









 Re: Fear!

This subject matter has the potential to bring a lot of grief to women if we are not careful. My personal opinion is that the vast majority of women who practice covering only do so because their husbands or fathers or others in their church either asked them to cover or it was quite obvious that they might offend others around them in their fellowship. I came out of a very legalistic church background where long dresses and head coverings were mandatory and as such I base my opinion on a lifetime of observations and on speaking to MANY women who have at some point or still do cover their heads.

But good luck finding a woman brave enough to admit this or agree with me publicly...on a forum lol.

Also I want to address the issue of fear. To be absolutely clear, I am not speaking about respect for a husband or respect for the "culture" of a church group, but I am speaking specifically about the issue of FEAR and using fear to get people to obey us. I look at some women and I cannot help but feel that they are no better off than women in Muslim cultures...living in fear of their husbands and/or autocratic religious church leaders. In these cases these Muslim women comply because they are forced to. They live in a culture of fear.

And when we create a culture of fear in our homes or fellowships, we grieve our Lord Jesus FAR more than a precious sister who does not have a piece of cloth on her head! Shame on us men who don't even care to know if our wives or daughters or others we Lord over...are afraid of us!

I know I am slightly off topic but I feel the issue of fear is a valid concern in relation to this subject matter because no woman should have to live in fear of a man...ever...in any culture, yet that unfortunately is the reality of our world...and in many church circles.

 2014/6/26 11:01
Oracio
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 Re: "Should Christian women wear head coverings?"

I came across this article from the Gotquestions.org site and thought it was worthy of sharing here:

"Should Christian women wear head coverings?

Answer: 1 Corinthians 11:3-16 addresses the issue of women and head coverings. The context of the entire passage of 1 Corinthians 11:3-16 is submission to the God-given order and "chain of command." A "covering" on a woman's head is used as an illustration of the order, headship, and the authority of God. The key verse of this passage is 1 Corinthians 11:3 "But I want you to know that the head of every man is Christ, the head of woman is man, and the head of Christ is God." The implications of this verse are found in the rest of the passage. The order is: God the Father, God the Son, the man or husband, and the woman or wife. The veil or covering on the head of a believing Corinthian wife showed that she was under the authority of her husband, and therefore under submission to God.

Within this passage is also verse 10: "For this reason the woman ought to have a symbol of authority on her head, because of the angels." Why is that important to angels? The relationship of God with men is something that angels watch and learn from (1 Peter 1:12). Therefore, a woman's submission to God's delegated authority over her is an example to angels. The holy angels, who are in perfect and total submission to God, expect that we, as followers of Christ, be the same.

This covering not only means a cloth but also can refer to a woman's hair length. How can we say that? We must take this verse in the context or the setting in which it is presented. "Does not even nature itself teach you that if a man has long hair, it is a dishonor to him? But if a woman has long hair, it is a glory to her; for her hair is given to her for a covering" (1 Corinthians 11:14-15). Therefore, in the context of this passage, a woman who is wearing her hair longer marks herself out distinctively as a woman and not a man. The Apostle Paul is saying here that in the Corinthian culture, when a wife's hair was longer than her husband's, it showed her submission to his headship. The roles of the male and female are designed by God to portray a profound spiritual lesson, that is of submission to the will and the order of God.

But why is hair an issue in this passage? The apostle Paul is addressing an issue related to the Corinthian culture that was being allowed to disrupt the church. For a woman to have a shaved head was a disgrace (and, in Jewish thinking, a sign of mourning, Deuteronomy 21:12). Her hair was her “glory” (1 Corinthians 11:15). In the Corinthian culture, women normally wore a head covering as a symbol of their submission to their husbands. Paul affirms the rightness of following that cultural mandate—to dispense with the head coverings on women would send the entirely wrong signal to the culture at large. In fact, Paul says that, if a Christian woman refuses her head covering, she might as well shave her hair off, too (verse 6). A woman who refused to wear a covering in that culture was basically saying, “I refuse to submit to God’s order.” Therefore, the apostle Paul is teaching the Corinthians that hair length or the wearing of a “covering” by the woman was an outward indication of a heart attitude of submission to God and to His established authority.

God's order is that the husband is the head of the wife as God is the head of Christ, but there is no inequality or inferiority implied. God and Christ are equal and united, just as the husband and the wife are one. This is not a passage that teaches the woman is inferior to man or that she should be submissive to every man. It is teaching God's order and spiritual headship in the marriage relationship. In the Corinthian culture, a woman who covered her head during worship or when she was in public displayed her submission to authority.

In today's culture, we no longer view a woman's wearing of a head covering as a sign of submission. In most modern societies, scarves and hats are fashion accessories. A woman has the choice to wear a head covering if she views it as a sign of her submission to the authority of her husband. However, it is a personal choice and not something that should be used to judge spirituality. The real issue here is the heart attitude of obedience to God's authority and submission to His established order “as to the LORD” (Ephesians 5:22). God is far more concerned with an attitude of submission than an outward display of submission via a head covering. First Timothy 2:9-10, "I also want women to dress modestly, with decency and propriety, not with braided hair or gold or pearls or expensive clothes, but with good deeds, appropriate for women who profess to worship God."

Source: http://www.gotquestions.org/head-coverings.html#ixzz35l3Arzqt


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Oracio

 2014/6/26 11:05Profile
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 Re:

awakened writes:

Quote:
I know I am slightly off topic but I feel the issue of fear is a valid concern in relation to this subject matter because no woman should have to live in fear of a man...ever...in any culture, yet that unfortunately is the reality of our world...and in many church circles.


Just want to encourage you brother that I don't believe you were off topic with your good post on how unhealthy fear can come into play when it comes to this issue.


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Oracio

 2014/6/26 11:09Profile





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