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Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : Is It The Doing or the Trusting That Makes Us Believers?

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jochbaptist
Member



Joined: 2010/11/24
Posts: 307


 Re:

Approved -

You are welcome. And thanks for opening your heart to us.

Joch


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J Kruger

 2012/11/28 13:46Profile
DesertRose
Member



Joined: 2007/8/8
Posts: 123
Boston.MA

 Re:

Dear jochbaptist, Praise God for your testimony. 1John 1:9
He is not only the God who sits on the throne but the God who walks beside us.
Romans 4:8 - Blessed is the man whose sin the Lord will never count against him. Amen!
When God looks at me he sees me not only as if I have never sinned but also as if I had always obeyed."
For He has made Him who knew no sin to become sin for us, that we might be made the righteousness of God in Him." 2 Cor 5:21

 2012/11/28 14:37Profile
Croref
Member



Joined: 2008/3/18
Posts: 334


 Re:

by mguldner on 2012/11/28 7:50:03

The issue is not your doctrine but the fact that SermonIndex is not a place for many teachers but many students.




Then where are the teachers for these students to learn?? I am a teacher because I have listened and learned and God gives me things to teach. If you do the same, will you not also be a teacher? cf Heb 6:1

Quote:
It is not a place of self promotion. Looking solely at the "Scripture and Doctrine" section I counted 9 threads posted by yourself just on the first page you could see how a moderator can conclude you have come here to teach rather than learn when you do those kind of things.



And?? What should he conclude except I ask a lot of questions and make a lot of statements to be challenged__so do so. That is how we all might learn. Have there not been favorable results acknowledged by some? But self promotion??
Sorry, that is not what I am about. I thought this was a Christian forum filled with folk who were searching for answers.

I love the Lord. I pray you do as well. If there was something I thought I could apologize for, I would.

 2012/11/28 15:11Profile
mguldner
Member



Joined: 2009/12/4
Posts: 1860
Kansas

 Re:

We are all students our Teacher is the Word of God. SermonIndex is not a church that needs teachers, we have many sermons and teachers already with the data base. Its a fellowship of equals searching the word together. I find it hard to believe you have listened with the spirit behind the words you have typed, especially since the moderator clearly explained himself and his words clearly.

This will be the last I talk about this on this thread though because I don't wish to derail this threads topic. If you haven't already and you have questions ask the moderators or review the SermonIndex Community Guiding Principles for help.


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Matthew Guldner

 2012/11/28 15:53Profile
twayneb
Member



Joined: 2009/4/5
Posts: 2007
Joplin, Missouri

 Re: Is It The Doing or the Trusting That Makes Us Believers?

Quote:
When I got "saved" I had no idea that I was being recruited to save others. That was the farthest thing from my mind, I needed help and help arrived in the form of Jesus Christ.

When I look at an animal I sometimes will speak to it and say, "You have no idea how lucky you are. You live out your life and you die and that is the end for you. Nothing is expected of you but for you to naturally do what you were built to do." That certainly is not living, but when the bible demands that we be doers of that word and we have not the knowledge and withal to do it, I sometimes envy that animal.

But for us, we are born again for misery. A people of sorrow and acquainted with griefs and then forced to perform the word of God to only add failure and depression because we simply have no idea how to perform what James is telling us to do, "Be ye not hearers only but doers".

Someone told me that trusting is being a doer, but than we have another crowd that demands that we get out there and preach and believe me brethren I personally do not have the power nor the boldness to stand up and preach.

Let me be even more blunt before all of you and the Lord, I do not want to preach the gospel. I want the salvation that I had at the beginning where it was just me and Jesus and my bible. I don't care about sinners for salvation outside my immediate family, right now it's too much a stress to be bothered with that. It's so much easier to give to a ministry in support of a work than to actually participate in something that is filled with stress and anxiety.

I am serious brethren. I was not briefed before I was brought into this great salvation that I was to be recruited into a stressful work or being a doer of the word. I mean if the Children of Israel couldn't do it, how can we? Why can't I just live as a believer, trusting God for my life, trusting Him to save my family and live out this life and then die and meet Him in glory?

Saving others should be a joy. But the Christianity that is being presented in modern times is stressful. The demand from the Church says to get out there and save others and do do do do do. I want God and I want my salvation, but I have often wondered why I could not have been that thief on the cross. He got saved and then died. What a wonderful testimony.

Signed: A tired old dog.



Approved: I was also blessed by jochbaptist's testimony, and what he said it right on I think.

When you accepted the sacrifice of Jesus Christ for your sins, and when you were born again of the spirit, I am sure you remember feeling like a huge weight was lifted off your shoulders and He bore witness in your own spirit that you were now a child of God. I remember feeling as light as air knowing that all my sins were forgiven and that I was now right with God.

When we are born again we enter into relationship with God through Christ. Jochbaptist is right. That is God's focus, knowing us intimately. Our works flow from this relationship. We do not do the works to be right with God or even to be pleasing to God. We do the works because of the love that He has placed within us.

Works such as witnessing are the natural outflow of the love that God has shed abroad in our hearts. If we find that we have no desire to witness (or do other works), we can conclude that our love level is getting low. In other words, we can use our desire to witness as a barometer of where we are at in our relationship with the Lord concerning receiving and walking in His love.

My suggestion would be to simply take a little bit of a break from the "works" for a short period of time and instead focus on the Lord. Meditate continually on what His word says about what He has done for you and how much He loves you, as well as your own personal deliverance from sin.

I am reminded of a minister who received a letter from a female inmate that was spending her sentence in solitary confinement. She had been born again as a result of his ministry, but wrote him to say that she was depressed and was praying that God would simply let her die. She said that she had NO ministry opportunities and could do nothing for the Lord. She could not witness, could not share her faith, nothing. He wrote her back and explained that God loved her and desired, above all, relationship with her. She could spend time simply praising God and ministering to Him. The minister shared that this woman's life was transformed and she now walks in total joy and peace, ministers to the Lord, and is still in solitary confinement.

If you are totally in love with Jesus, you will begin to desire to share Him with others. Simply follow that desire and let God flow through you to others. It is a much better way to work for the Lord than to be stressed and under condemnation because you are trying to live up to an expectation that man puts on you.

Hope that helps.
Blessings.


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Travis

 2012/11/28 15:56Profile
Croref
Member



Joined: 2008/3/18
Posts: 334


 Re:

by mguldner on 2012/11/28 12:53:14

We are all students our Teacher is the Word of God. SermonIndex is not a church that needs teachers, we have many sermons and teachers already with the data base. Its a fellowship of equals searching the word together. I find it hard to believe you have listened with the spirit behind the words you have typed, especially since the moderator clearly explained himself and his words clearly.

This will be the last I talk about this on this thread though because I don't wish to derail this threads topic. If you haven't already and you have questions ask the moderators or review the SermonIndex Community Guiding Principles for help.



Ah, I see. The Word of God. I know Him__He knows me.

You wrote:

Quote:
I find it hard to believe you have listened with the spirit behind the words you have typed, especially since the moderator clearly explained himself and his words clearly.



I am puzzled as to what words that I have "typed" you believe should be taken offensively as being untruthful/ you simply disagree with?

I have my knowledge about the "Word of God" I believe is accurate. If you see things differently that is OK and I would like to read your commentary but not someone else's from you.
I have learned much by listening and reading others to have my faith and knowledge confirmed to know why Jesus, in addition to being called the Son of man and the Son of God, is also called the "second Adam" and why this is significant in His lived out life while upon earth.

For instance: if I was to ask you what you know about that name given Jesus, could you reply you do? Could you speak to this as being something beyond the issue of our salvation __and very importantly so, could you do it? However, it may not interest you and that is OK as well but, where is my error in making the attempt at introducing the subject? If you are but don't understand, is that a problem for which I should have accusations leveled against me? Aren't we to ask questions of one another?

 2012/11/28 16:31Profile
jimp
Member



Joined: 2005/6/18
Posts: 1481


 Re:

hi, i am again amazed at the lack of tact and wisdom in christians.(me too) years ago i was tossed out of a sunday school class because the teacher was misquoting the bible so that it alligned with his doctrine."and the devil sought to kill moses...) i continued to minister with that teacher and started a church with him. i was correct in what i was saying in the class but i disrupted the class with an attitude and i would not let it drop.i had no idea of submission and could have been much more tactful. let us learn to be more tolerant of each other .jimp

 2012/11/28 17:12Profile
sermonindex
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Joined: 2002/12/11
Posts: 37521
"Pilgrim and Sojourner." - 1 Peter 2:11

Online!
 Re:

Quote:
I have my knowledge about the "Word of God" I believe is accurate. If you see things differently that is OK and I would like to read your commentary but not someone else's from you.
I have learned much by listening and reading others to have my faith and knowledge confirmed to know why Jesus, in addition to being called the Son of man and the Son of God, is also called the "second Adam" and why this is significant in His lived out life while upon earth.



Again to re-iterate the fact that SermonIndex is not a place to have convictions and then abrasively compete them with others, rather it is a place to meekly learn, trying to learn from others. It is not place for a personal pulpit of one's ideas to just try and preach them but rather it is a place to learn yourself and grow from many others in the body of Christ, namely the classical speakers on this website that are listed.

It is also encouraged for all members to read the community rules and recommended book. What is more important about being right even doctrinally in these forums is to be able to be civil, Christian and loving in our posts to each other. This is a tremendous burden I have that these forums would be a place of godliness, and all the fruits of the Spirit: Love, Joy, Peace, Gentleness, Meekness, Goodness, Self-Control.

Each and every thread on this site people are reading from all over the world from hundreds of different denominations and groups and will be read by many over the coming years. How important it is for us to really hear of the Lord and write things that are of value and showing love to each other in our discussions in meekness and humility. I know there is something very value and great that I can learn from every since member on this forum. I pray I can continue to have that spirit and heart in my interactions with everyone.

Please do prayerfully consider reading these:

SermonIndex Community Guiding Principles
https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=44556&forum=13

A recommend book resource: Touching Godliness Through Submission by K.P. Yohannan
https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/mydownloads/visit.php?lid=22831




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SI Moderator - Greg Gordon

 2012/11/28 18:37Profile
Christinyou
Member



Joined: 2005/11/2
Posts: 3707
Ca.

 Re:

1 Corinthians 15:45-47 And so it is written: The first man Adam was made a liuing soule, the last Adam was made a quickening spirit. Howbeit that was not first which is spirituall: but that which is naturall, and afterward that which is spirituall. The first man is of the earth, earthy: The second man is the Lord from heauen.

Jesus Christ is the last Adam, He was made a quickening spirit, "Christ in you the hope of glory".

Jesus Christ was also the second man, the Lord from heaven.

Jesus is second only that being He was from heaven and Adam was from earth.

In Christ we are brought into heavenly things by His workmanship. In Adam we stay in earthly things by self.

Colossians 1:27-29 To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory: Whom we preach, warning every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus: Whereunto I also labour, striving according to his working, which worketh in me mightily.

In Christ: Phillip


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Phillip

 2012/11/29 5:38Profile





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