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My wife goes out on Black Friday, but she is a Grade A bargain shopper. She does it because she saves a ton of money. If you just go out to the stores without a plan you dont save any money, but she knows exactly what she is looking for... and how much our budget allows for Christmas and she gets it done. Never had a problem with people in line, in fact she enjoys chatting with other people.

The media plays up the few instances of bad shoppers, and thats all you see on the news. She has NEVER seen anything like what you see on the news. Not once in 10 years of Black Friday shopping.

Now, if materialism is what drives someone to go out on that day... thats a sin. If you do it because you're frugal and you know how to be a good steward of the money God has provided for you... then it's not a sin. It's all in what you make it.

She has witnessed to a number of people in the process of Black Friday shopping. Just starting up conversations with people.

It's easy to paint everything with a broad brush, and it's popular on this forum to proclaim the judgement of God on everything and everyone... but the fact is... life is a little more complicated than that, and not everything is packaged the way the media would have us believe or highlight.


 2012/11/28 13:12

Joined: 2012/2/8
Posts: 5638


I personally avoid black friday like the plague, but for someone who does intend to buy gifts for Christmas (who doesn't??), is it not wise stewardship to be able to buy more with less money? I mean, if you want to buy your son a GI Joe with kung fu grip and you can get it on sale for $15.00 on black friday when the regular price is $30.00, it seems like it might be a smart thing to do.

How is that greedy? Sure, the stores want to make money (what store doesn't- that is why they exist) so they draw people in with big sales. There is no denying the deals that can be had on black friday if you are a brave soul.

For people who buy Christmas gifts (and that includes a whole lot of Bible- believin' spirit-filled Christians), black Friday is a good thing-- as long, of course, that people don't claw each other to death.

The Christmas shopping season in America is not going away. I personally love the season- not necessarily the shopping part-- but the whole season. I stay focused on the meaning of the season. Christmas shopping, looking at the lights, etc is just part of the American culture and has been for a very long time. Is it too commercialized? Of course it is. We live (thank the Lord) in a free market system.


 2012/11/28 15:16Profile


I am with you, TMK... the Bible is full of sound financial advise, and while there are some who God calls to live a life of poverty... that is not His calling for every person. There are many whom He has bestowed a good business mind and the ability to generate income. This is not a bad thing when done according to Biblical principles and with a right spirit and attitude.

Christians tend to be narrow minded when it comes to considering that perhaps God has a different plan for someone else's life than He does mine. "God has called ALL believers to sit in sack clothe and ashes..." and we base that on the fact that He called ME to do that, therefore He must have called ALL of us to do that... yet, in the Bible we see people of all walks of life following Him. All financial statuses, all positions in life. God is big enough to deal with each of us as individuals.

Surely there are serious problems in this country, and in the church. No one doubts that. But it is a sin to sit and pronounce blanket judgement upon everyone who is different from me... and a lot of times thats what is happening on this forum and on others.

It's very small minded... and self centered. And self righteous.


 2012/11/28 16:28

 rather i should have posted is this

a Bit of Scripture i read this morning in 2 Corithian's

"And even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing. In their case the god of this world has blinded the minds of the unbelievers, to keep them from seeing the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God." 2nd Corin 4:3-4

a bit off topic, Krispy Steve, i been cruel to you in words, and i'm VERY sorry and beg your forgiveness, there's no excuse. i "had forgiven", but NOT 'forgetton', and that isnt right minded in Christ of isnt right, and i sure am sorry, as a WAY of any explaination, why my words were so sharp and cruel, dear brother, the fault lays with me, whenever bullets, bombs and missiles start flying in the Middle East?....i get twiggy....its no excuse, there IS no excuse. i get twiggy for a whole host of reasons that have NOTHING to do with you, may God bless you and your kin is my prayer, also that you extend forgiveness to this contrite brother of yours.

Greg, if you read this, i'm going to post up an 11 minute video i saw the other day, that dovetails with what you posted. some of the commentators are secular, some follow Jesus, a brother that i know. If you dont think it appropo, please take it down, but my spirit, told me it would be alright to post it, its some discernment on the coming days, in the vein of "shrewd as snakes, innocent as doves" heart and mind stance any follower of Jesus would do well to consider.....not in fear, but in sober minded wisdom.

its entitled "The Madness of a Lost Society 3"...of course, i previewed it, and there was nothing coarse or vulgar, its 12 minutes long. in this video, there's a very interesting statement one obviously secular commentator makes, "You have to depend of yourself", which veers from where WE are IN Christ, we recognize we are TOTALLY dependent of God....these is where the saints of God come in, God willing, we will be here, the Holy Spirit will be here, to tell folks such as these that Truth, Dependency on God and God alone.

in Jesus love, neil

 2012/11/29 7:35

 Re: rather i should have posted is this

Neil... I forgive you. There is a lot I could say, but at this point lets just wipe the slate clean and move forward. Pleeeeze... :-)


 2012/11/29 8:09

Joined: 2006/7/31
Posts: 3057

 Re: rather i should have posted is this

Greetings Neil

Thank you for sharing the video. I watched it and another very much like it that aired on the History channel a while back. Both spoke of the coming economic crisis because our system of monies is no longer backed by gold. Both painted a very bleak picture for people and I do think that what was said has a lot of truth and merit.

I also watched a documentary on historical men of wealth and power, men like J.P. Morgan, Carnegie and Rockefeller. These men were very influential in seeing that things happened their way in the political area by means of their wealth. This kind of manipulation goes a long way back. It is interesting history to read.

As for is my question? How does one prepare for this kind of storm that is about to strike? Buy food, buy medicines, buy __________??? Stock up? For how long? Watching these things happen, this storm will be long in duration with no easy fix so how does one prepare and for how long? This has been on my heart and mind. I do not mean to suggest we bury our heads in the sand and pretend it is not about to happen but I just don't know where I would really begin to prepare in a physical sense and how I would store all the preparation...for a week, a month or more then likely years to come! What are your thoughts on that part of this story?

I think being a good and wise steward will cause us to think of these things in light of HIM and to consider what HE would have us do. I think the best possible way to prepare is to pray, seek GOD, and trust in HIM. There will be many who are shaken, the idea of what "we need" in America vs "what we want" has become redefined by the tech age and the currant way of life. Many in Sandy who were effected said that the single worst thing for them was the inability to keep up with the world via twitter, Facebook, email, and internet...interesting thing when being able "to post or connect" becomes a need in life? I truly believe that the way of life we know now will look nothing like the way things will be after this storm rages through...there will be no getting back to "normal" there will be a "new normal" Thoughts?

Thanks for sharing this with us. And thank you for sharing your heart with Steve in such a way as to express the love and forgiveness FATHER leads us to. Humbling ourselves and seeking to reconcile with a brother in HIM is truly fruit of HIS work in both your lives :)

God bless

 2012/11/29 8:41Profile

 Krispy -n- MJ

Stevie, God bless you, love you, and keep you, for showing Grace to me, i will endeavour double never to ley an imtemperate word come from this keyboard, and give praise and thanks to a God that puts such love in your heart for such a flawed specimen as myself, thank you brother.

MJ,...where do i begin? i'm SURE Greg doesnt want a "prepper" tutorial on here, and i dont blame him at all. i dont think he'll mind if i paint a few brushstrokes.

i believe the storm Sandy MIGHT have woke some people up, to the fragility of "wired world". The main point as i see it, and ask some people is, "why do you prep?....are you afraid of death?"

i never have gotten an answer yet from another human being on that question. Why i might "prep" is in the way of Joseph in the Old Testament, i been led that way, i tell you in a bit how, but the Beauty of following Jesus, One of His Many Gifts to us, is that He frees us from not only the bondage of sin,thru the Blood, but He also frees us from the bondage of the FEAR of death...thats so crucial to living a full life while in this mortal jar of clay.

thats my conviction, because i came to that door, and Bless God, Jesus filled me with His Love, i understood in the twinkling of an eye, what Paul meant in Phillipians, with his "what is better" exhortation...the fear of death was gone...."do i stay here, or go be with You?....Your Will Father, not mine".

the "prepper community" is SO full of fear...and venom. Terrible venom, but when you live in fear, venom and ill will is right behind. many of the maintain in addition to their primary dwelling in a city, or suburb, what they call a "BOL", a "bug out location" (thats another thing about prepper world, so many anocronyms) they believe that they will get advance warning and be able to flee to this rural BOL, stocked with supplies and weapons, etc. May God protect them is my prayer.

My counsel would be, leave the cities, and suburbs, live rural. But i understand a lot of folks cant do that. or might not be called to do that. But everyone i love, thats my counsel, get out. period. i believe my family thinks i;ve gone "bonkers"...."oh neil lives in the middle of nowhere now like some crazy hermit 'survivialist'!"

but thats not who i am, or even why i moved way rural...i've been wanting to live rural since i was a wee lad...i LIKE the desolate places, so did Jesus! my 3 AM wake up and alone times with God have been such JOY, i cant even put it into human words.

who has become the main figure for 'prepping' is a man named James Wesley Rawles, who has a blog called 'survivalblog', its the largest. Jim has written books, mostly fiction, based on scenarios. He confesses Jesus as Lord. i dont go to his blog much anymore....nothing against it, or him...its just that it seems to me, that 'prepping' turns into yet another idol.

people go on and on, about getting this or stockpiling that, but nobody says stockpile Bibles...God told me to do that and i did. "Prepping" becomes their WORLD...not Jesus, and what is not done IN Faith is sin.

You'll notice i'm skipping specifics. ie what to get, or stockpile. i dont think Greg would want that, and its SEEMS unseemly, but i want to testify for a second or two.

i love, adore the ministry of Duncan Campbell, and how God used him in the Hebrides, and this land up here in the upper Midwest, Wisconsin, is a LOT like the Hebrides...more trees though, thats how we heat...they use peat...anyway, there are SO SO many churches around here, 97% of them once vibrant mainline Protestant denominations, i wont name names, just suffice to say, the ones that are now cold, and have begun the practice of ordaining homosexual pastors....thats the church landscape, and i went to a few of them......these are dear people....and i've made a lot of good friends up here, and one day, God put in me, a vision to just build a 16 by 16 foot one room building on my front pasture, a house of prayer.....a very simple lil one room building, no electricity, in the spring of 13..."why then?"...well. winters about to hit, and i have limited resources, a lot of the wood to build i have to salvage, but God willing, spring of 2013......and then i want to go around, and just ask pastors, if they want to come up on a Tuesday night,. or Thursday night and just get on our knees, or faces and beg God to pour out His Spirit in revival, in our district.......

and He's a Covenant Keeping God, and He did say,"ask seek knock"....right?......He's the Same, yesterday today and forever, so what happened in the Hebrides, Praise God, can happen up here! I NEED REVIVAL!!!....and its my firm conviction, if saints get on their faces in prayer, soul travailing, tear soaked Holy Ghost prayer, God will honor that, and come down in Power!....and save the most notorious sinners in a district, and set saints ablaze with the Glorious Love of Jesus.

thats why i came up here...not to hide in fear, but to used as a servant in humility to the Lamb of God, Jesus.

here's Duncan's testimony what happened:

(MJ, before i post this, i was searching for what Duncan Campbell testimony i want to post up...i found it, and started to listen, and the brother who opened the file, said "This is Duncan Campbell speaking in 1968 in Viroqua Wisconsin" mouth fell open, Viroqua is my county seat, population 4300, our whole county has 28,000 souls, Viroqua is 10 miles down the road from me!!!, its where i do my shopping, everything and Duncan preached here 44 years ago......i'm speechless.)

in Jesus' love, neil

 2012/11/29 18:34

Joined: 2006/7/31
Posts: 3057

 Re: Krispy -n- MJ

Greetings Neil

I guess in my heart I am at a place to lay it all at the feet of my JESUS and trust HIM. I am not one who believes in being a "prepper" usually when you store up those kinds of treasures you have to have a some means of protecting/defending those things and I just don't see JESUS having me buy a gun.(not saying owning a gun is bad) You mentioned moving out of the cities and into a rural area...for thirty plus years I lived in a semi rural area, surrounded by mountains and high desert, then the LORD moved my family 3000 miles to the east coast right into the middle of some of the biggest cities in the country. I now live sandwiched in between NYC and Boston. I miss where I use to live but I am here now and I trust GOD has a plan for me being here. Although being near such large populated cities does in fact scare me at times I have grown to depend on the LORD so much. I pray often and I trust that HE is with me.

Thanks for the response and sharing your thoughts. I am encouraged that the best plan or way to "prep" is by being in my WORD and seeking HIM daily...each moment living in HIM!!

God bless

 2012/11/29 20:07Profile

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