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Discussion Forum : General Topics : the reality of spiritual warfare v. psych issues

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PaulWest
Member



Joined: 2006/6/28
Posts: 3405
Dallas, Texas

 Re:

Quote:
I found myself moved beyond words and realised that his disability of mind was no barrier to God. Since that first time, I have seen this same quietness and purpose of understanding come upon Daniel several times. My thought is that Daniel is able to comprehend in his heart that God is indeed God. I hear Daniel in the night laughing and expressing such happiness sometimes that I have seriously considered the possibility that he is playing with angels of God. One thing is certain Daniel belongs to God and he understands it. By it he is able to receive instruction regarding his general behaviour to such an extent that when he begins to get angry at something or other and I remind him that he must control himself, which I seal with a kiss; Daniel always settles down and actually thanks me for helping him. Your cousin cannot be beyond the unfathomable grace and mercies of the Lord.


This is a beautiful post. It warms my heart to think of how God is able to transcend physiological aberations and penetrate within the fields of innocence. And that, essentially, is what the blood of Jesus Christ affords us all, which is why it is to be inestimately praised. I sometimes think we who have our "mental faculties" steeped in normalcy are at a profound disadvantage to those who, by way of disability, have not calculatingly tasted of and been spoilt by Satan's delicacies.

Awesome post, dear brother. My warm regards go out to you and your family.


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Paul Frederick West

 2012/9/6 18:37Profile









 Re:

Quote:
It warms my heart to think of how God is able to transcend physiological aberations and penetrate within the fields of innocence. And that, essentially, is what the blood of Jesus Christ affords us all, which is why it is to be inestimately praised. Paul.



Amen brother. It is the only truth. Praise God. Thankyou for your blessing. It was warmly recieved and discerned. May the Lord bless you and your houshold also.

 2012/9/7 6:09
Myst
Member



Joined: 2012/7/22
Posts: 32


 Re: the reality of spiritual warfare v. psych issues


Hi Noah and Deadn, Just wanted to address a couple of your issues in this forum.

"I have struggled with legalism and perfectionism. so I just wanted to get that out there. So maybe I'm just not accepting God's forgiveness but still trying in some capacity to please Him with the law."

There is an inherent irony regarding the law. If our goal is to keep the law in order to please our Father, we will neither be able to keep the law, nor please Him with our feeble attempts. But Jesus said, John 14:15, 23 If you love Me, keep My commandments.... If a man loves Me, he will keep My Word. And My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our abode with him.

When our focus is keeping the law, it will never work. When we simply and truly love our heavenly Father, Jesus our brother, and our Holy Spirt, then by the unity of love, we naturally, by the power of love and that only, we are able to keep His commandments, and attain the holiness and righteousness He destined for us. Jesus actually broke the written law, as He noted David did as well, but in the breaking of it, there was love needing to be manifested, and in that way He kept the true Law of God, fulfilling, although supplanting, yet exceeding the written law.

Eze 11:19, 20 And I will give them one heart, and I will put a new spirit within you. And I will remove the stony heart out of their flesh, and will give them a heart of flesh, so that they may walk in My statutes and keep My ordinances, and do them. And they shall be My people, and I will be their God.

Scripture often says loving our God and loving others is to keep the whole law. This divine love, a gift from God, compels us to keep the law, not out of any necessity, but for the sake of Love itself. We keep the highest laws of our God, because of our love. Acts of love, righteousness, become "natural" to us.

Relating this to Deadn's cousin and many with mental or catastrophic illnesses, we must learn that we can only love through the gift of power of Christ's love. God is love. God is in us. We can bring His love, His power, keeping His commandments, or any other thing He promised into realization, but only by Christ living in us, allowing Him to manifest Himself to them through us. That love means death to sin, darkness, and hate of any kind. It means purity in all ways.

Encountering the deeply troubled, an adult with dementia or a child who has not learned to speak, we have the ability to minister His love through us to them, even without words. I have often held a screaming child for a few minutes, focusing His love on them in my arms, and within minutes have seen the calming results.

The Gospel of Christ is manifestation of His love on earth, whether needed in inner peace, healing, the calming of a troubled (yes, demonized) mind, or just to wordlessly impart the knowledge that their heavenly Father loves them. In this way, we fulfill the promise of Christ, John 14:12 Truly, truly, I say to you, He who believes on Me, the works that I do he shall do also, and greater works than these he shall do, because I go to My Father.
We must choose whether the weapons of our warfare are earthly or spiritual.

I am not minimizing the necessity of preaching the Gospel of the Kingdom, but when young or troubled souls can not comprehend that message, we are not left unable to engage in the ministry of reconciliation with them. We can spiritually impart the fundamental Gospel of Jesus Christ in a way that can not humanly be understood. Our indwelling Creator and God of Love will do that from within us. If we allow Him.

I remind you to stir up the gift of God, which is in you by the laying on of my hands. For God not has given us the spirit of fear, but of power and of love and of a sound mind. 2 Timothy1:6, 7

When you feel helpless with those you can not reach in any other way, sit with them, hold them,love them. That they will understand and receive.


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Robert Sands

 2012/9/10 17:33Profile
learn
Member



Joined: 2008/7/24
Posts: 613


 Re:

Hi Myst,
That was a nice post you wrote. I do agree that its about love. Love that you are willing to lay down your life for God and those that you love. Only then will God strengthen you and enable you to fight the good fight. Without love, we have nothing. Perfect love caseth out fear. Ok, I'm still in the process of trying to understand myself what I wrote. But I think I'm correct so far?


_________________
geraldine

 2012/9/10 23:24Profile
ginnyrose
Member



Joined: 2004/7/7
Posts: 7534
Mississippi

 Re: the reality of spiritual warfare v. psych issues

John,

You have asked some interesting questions. Have they been answered?

As old as I am I still grapple with this issue.

I know of someone who is profoundly religious. When you talk with her it becomes evident quickly she knows the Word, is very intelligent. But where the rubber meets the road it is a different story. She has a debilitating illness...I did some checking on the web and discovered it can cause mental illness. This person is a perfectionist, has an anger problem and does not look happy at all. She relies on morphine to deal with pain...and on and on.

There is one issue that troubles me. They know what James 5:13-16 teaches but there is a strong resistance to obey it. Does this tell us something? I find this resistance common to those with debilitating health issues: not sick enough to die but not well enough to live an active life, either.

Any comments?



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Sandra Miller

 2012/9/12 20:40Profile
DEADn
Member



Joined: 2011/1/12
Posts: 1395
Lakeland FL

 Religion gone wrong

http://www.theledger.com/article/20121031/NEWS/121039890/1374?Title=Nude-Woman-Who-Was-Shot-Described-as-Religious-Caring-Modest

I came across this article in a local paper and I remember seeing a glimpse of it on the local news. As I read it I couldn't help but think of this very thread that I started and it points to the reality of the psych issues vs. spiritual warfare.

In the article, the woman demonstrates what many Christians seemingly should be doing. Studying her bible intensely and having bible studies. She was very modest and to the point of being very shy at times. Just a personality trait. The rest of her life seems weird. Dare I say unbalance but it isn't unusual because there are many just as she has lived.

Somehow she was seen running around naked and even confront with cops with an unloaded gun. There is also talk in the article in which she talked about the anti christ so in essence she was a end times learner.

The worldview sees this as a typical Christian. Irrational, loony but she is the epitomy of the fringe element as far as her actions go. Yet, the only thing that seems missing in her life, from the article, is it doesn't say whether she was a witness of Jesus to people. I really think that part would be irrelevant anyway.

So, this whole thing brings me back to this point , AGAIN.
Is it psych issues v. spiritual issues? After all, she apparently spent alot of time in the Bible and that was her reputation.

If the Word of God is so powerful how can a person spend that much time studying and be overtaken by psych issues or spiritual issues such as her actions? It is too easy to give band aid statements such as she isn't a real Christian or maybe she didn't pray hard enough. That is a cop out to the whole issue. It is situations such as this which cause people see God as nonsense. Bible studies, modest seems to equal WACKO and who wants that? It is easier for people to stay in that moderate Christian stage because if you go fringe you end up similar as she. I think this is a mindset of the secular mind.

Tell me what you think? Though we don't have all the details where do you think she went wrong?


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John

 2012/10/31 9:01Profile
ginnyrose
Member



Joined: 2004/7/7
Posts: 7534
Mississippi

 Re: Religion gone wrong

John,

Oh, my! - a woman running around naked and confronting the cops with an unloaded gun - sounds loony to me...yes, I believe the devil will use religious people to discredit God's Word; make religious wackos out of them.

From what you wrote, I would guess she was focusing too much on the devil instead of Jesus. Ditto to the ones in the lead post.

I have heard of evangelists who have preached about the devil from the pulpit. The entire sermon dealt with who he is and what he does, etc.

The fallout of these kind of sermons is that people's interest in the devil is stimulated to a point that is unhealthy; people experience more satanic attacks. They say it is unhealthy to focus too much on the devil, instead one should focus on Jesus.

Years ago I read a book titled "Occult ABC" - forget the name of the author...In the forward the writer cautioned the readers to make sure they are protected spiritually...I did not take the warning seriously. Anyhow...

For the next two nights I was awakened with a bad tummy ache, so bad I had to spend time in the bath room. Then I began to wonder at this absurdity: I was healthy, not ill at all, why this change in natural functions? Then I recalled what I read and disregarded as serious. So I prayed - and that was the end of that.

This is my take on this issue. However, having said that, I do enjoy Frank Peretti's books but do not regard them as a text book for information about the workings in the spirit realm.

I still do not know the difference between mental illness and those caused by spiritual problems. My husband worked in a mental institution in lieu of military service during the 1960s and he is certain that a fair number of patients were there because of spiritual issues that were not dealt with earlier.

Maybe one needs to ask for the gift of discernment to discern which is which?

My understanding...


_________________
Sandra Miller

 2012/10/31 11:29Profile
DEADn
Member



Joined: 2011/1/12
Posts: 1395
Lakeland FL

 Re:

Quote:

From what you wrote, I would guess she was focusing too much on the devil instead of Jesus. Ditto to the ones in the lead post.

I have heard of evangelists who have preached about the devil from the pulpit. The entire sermon dealt with who he is and what he does, etc.

The fallout of these kind of sermons is that people's interest in the devil is stimulated to a point that is unhealthy; people experience more satanic attacks. They say it is unhealthy to focus too much on the devil, instead one should focus on Jesus.




Seems that what you are saying is when we focus too much on the devil then issues begin to arise as a result. Do you think that extends to when people want to say they fight the devil all the time v. the flesh?

I also wonder, what about those who spend so much time on end times stuff - do you think reality becomes a blur and anyone who comes forward with attributes of an antiChrist is labeled and then some go crazy as a result such as what seemed to happen with this woman?

Where is the guard on situations such as this? Christians should be the leaders of society but instead Christians are the joke of society and instead secularism and science have taken over as a result.


_________________
John

 2012/10/31 11:58Profile
Sree
Member



Joined: 2011/8/20
Posts: 1953


 Re:

This is a good discussion. But I believe not everyone will agree with my post. Not everyone here takes God's word as it is. Psychology is science and just like we do not agree on everything that Science throws at us, we cannot agree on all the things that Psychology throws as well. Science says we evolved from monkeys and I believe there is no one here who believe in this (I trust so!). At the same time we cannot say entire Science is lie, the whole internet forum came because of scientific development.

Now back to Psychology, I believe that there are people who have poor mental development. It is not demon possession, it is a disability like any other disability. At the same I do not believe in things like depression and anger syndrome of people who are mentally healthy. Because depression is a sin, Bible says clearly that we need to rejoice all the time . Bible does not tell us that rejoice all the time except if you are depressed. There is no exception here. Same thing for Anger, it is a sin. I believe we are getting fooled by these psychological terms, that make us believe that it is fine to lose our Joy in lord and it is fine to get angry. These are sins.

My post is not to hurt those who are subjected to so called Depression or anger illness in past or present. I just believe they are deceived by Psychology. I may not have answers for all the things that they have gone through in their life, but all I have is, 'let God alone be true and every man a liar'. Also I know a man who was rejected and crucified by those whom he came to save, yet in his final prayer he prayed that his believers may have the joy in him. Also another man who had thorn in his flesh and he still preached and practiced rejoicing in Lord all the time. These 2 men had all rights to get into depression or anger syndrome but they did not.


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Sreeram

 2012/10/31 12:05Profile
DEADn
Member



Joined: 2011/1/12
Posts: 1395
Lakeland FL

 Re:

Sree

I agree that there are issues in psychology that I don't agree with but in psychological they use case studies to cite whether something is true or not and this is where they base their knowledge from.

Often I have taken what I know from psychology and put it against what I understand of the Bible and asked why does psychology push this and the Bible pushes this? Corporal punishment is one such issue.

I have often asked myself how much do I trust God's Word as we say it is God's Word. There are times I question certain principles and that is usually because I don't see the truth in it or have never seen it demonstrated in me or around me to know it is true or not. Does that make sense? It is similar to what psychology does when it does its examinations through case studies to see if something is true or not.

This is another reason why I bring up spiritual v. psyche.

Depression, I think is a symptom of sin but I don't know that I could call depression itself sin. Does that make sense?

It is my opinion that topics such as this should be discussed so we can be better balance in our spiritual lives knowing what is spiritual v. psyche so that we don't damage someone who is having issues. Many leave the Church and becomes atheists as a result of this unbalanced thinking which can end up in abuse or just mere disillusionment. I am a shallow example of such a thing.

John


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John

 2012/10/31 12:28Profile





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