I do not join forums as a rule, due to the fact that the enemy is out there doing all that he can do to discourage us. Some of the "Christian" sites that I have visited are awfull, they are not encouraging and uplifting, but full of angry people taking pot shots at each other over mostly non vital issues. It is imparative that this site be covered by prayer, and monitered by Godly moderators to ensure that does not happen to this wonderfull site. Thank you all for the uplifting messages, they are a real blessing
In Christ Greg :-)

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Greg

Hi Stephen,

Thank you brother.
Someone finally gets it and I am sorry to have to even put it that way. Strange thing is, you, like so many I have heard from I can't even recall anything devisive about and yet you are of the few who have come out here to openly to say so anyway.

What a strange paradigm this all is. There is members apologizing to [i]me[/i] and I don't quite get it. This isn't about me, my being offended, this is about everyone here and all the eyes of the watching world. Above all that, it is unto the Lord. Confession and forgiveness ought to be a ready spring from our hearts and lips first to the Lord and to the ones that are in need of asking for forgiveness and to the body as a whole. There is a whole lot am just trying to sort through here...

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Mike Balog

Hi Greg (Smokey)

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Mike Balog

I have been so blessed by this wonderful ministry and Greg's words have spoken to my heart. It's time for me to start to pray for this ministry - there is no question that God is using this site to revive many lives. Naturally the enemy will do all he can to stop it. I will pray.

Your brother in Christ,

Stephen

With the sense of thought in mind of:

I say again, Let no man think me a fool; if otherwise, yet as a fool receive me, that I may boast myself a little. That which I speak, I speak it not after the Lord, but as it were foolishly, in this confidence of boasting. Seeing that many glory after the flesh, I will glory also. For ye suffer fools gladly, seeing ye yourselves are wise. For ye suffer, if a man bring you into bondage, if a man devour you, if a man take of you, if a man exalt himself, if a man smite you on the face. I speak as concerning reproach, as though we had been weak. Howbeit whereinsoever any is bold, (I speak foolishly,) I am bold also. 2Co 11:16-21

A bit of commentary and in just a general manner:

[b]2Co 11:19 [/b]-
For ye suffer fools gladly - You tolerate or endure those who are really fools. This is perhaps, says Dr. Bloomfield, the most sarcastic sentence ever penned by the apostle Paul. Its sense is, “You profess to be wondrous wise. And yet you who are so wise a people, freely tolerate those who are foolish in their boasting; who proclaim their own merits and attainments. You may allow me, therefore, to come in for my share, and boast also, and thus obtain your favor.” Or it may mean, “You are so profoundly wise as easily to see who are fools. You have great power of discernment in this, and have found out that I am a fool, and also that other boasters are fools. Yet knowing this, you bear patiently with such fools; have admitted them to your favor and friendship, and I may come in among the rest of the fools, and partake also of your favors.” They had borne with the false apostles who had boasted of their endowments, and yet they claimed to be eminent for wisdom and discernment.

Barnes Notes

And forever failing to give a proper expression... fortunately not without help...

"I wonder how many of us are living on the virtues of our grandparents! The natural virtues are remnants of what the original creation of man once was, they are not promises of what man is going to be; what man is going to be is seen in the life of Jesus Christ. The workable medium is man. God takes as the medium of working the stuff we are made of, and all He requires is for us to be inactive and let Him work. When once we are rightly related to God through the Atonement we will be inactive and not in the way of His working in us as He worked in Jesus; consequently we shall be able to work out in our natural life all that God wills. It is the old twist, we will try to do what God alone can do, and then we mourn before God because He won’t do what we alone can do. We put up sighing petitions—“I have tried to be good”; “I have tried to sanctify myself.” All that is the work of God, and the best thing to do is to stop trying and let God do it. What we have to do, and what God cannot do, is to work out what He has worked in. We try to do God’s work for Him, and God has to wait until we are passive enough to let Him work in us. To believe in Jesus means retiring and letting God take the mastership inside. That is all God asks of us.[b] Have we ever got into the way of letting God work, or are we so amazingly important that we really wonder in our nerves and ways what the Almighty does before we are up in the morning! We are so certain we know what is right, and if we don’t always keep at it God cannot get on[/b]. Compare that view with the grand, marvellous working of God in the life of the Lord Jesus. Our Lord did not work for God; He said, “The Father that dwelleth in Me, He doeth the works.” Have we any faith in God at all? Do we really expect God to work in us the good pleasure of His will, or do we expect He will only do it as we pray and plead and sacrifice? All these things shut the door to God working. What we have to ask away from, to knock at, to seek through, are these pressing strivings of our own—
When we stay our feeble efforts, And from struggling cease, Unconditional surrender Brings us God’s own peace.
—a doctrine easily travestied, but a doctrine God never safeguards. [b]The whole basis of modern Christian work is the great impulsive desire to evade concentration on God. We will work for Him any day rather than let Him work in us.[/b] When a man or woman realises what God does work in them through Jesus Christ, they become almost lunatic with joy in the eyes of the world. It is this truth we are trying to state, viz. the realisation of the wonderful salvation of God".

Chambers, O. 1996, c1941. If thou wilt be perfect : Talks on spiritual philosophy.

All this just to serve as a primer...

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Mike Balog

A pressing need to draw attention to a few things.
Misunderstandings, patience, respect, elders, 'prophets'... Opinion.

Am learning so much daily, moment by moment, from the Lord, from the 'greats' that have gone before us, from many here, from each other, from the blindness as well as the light, from the young but more so from the old. Meaning, that I have seen come through here some as young as 14 or 15 that have more spiritual acumen than some that have been at this for years and ought to know better. Certainly there is always a learning and growth curve, but what of respect towards those who have been around this block a couple thousand times more than some of us hot shot upstarts?

We have a bazillion voices of the type mentioned here: [i]1Jo 4:1 Dear friends, stop believing every spirit. Instead, test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world.[/i]

The many have multiplied and subdivided and the vast majority of them can't possibly be anything but false, there all saying different things. Moreover, there seems to be a 'spirit of' this creeping into our own thinking often times and the ugliness of it being carelessly bandied about because it seems nobody is [b]listening[/b]...

To each other, to the Lord or to those who could truly help us all, the more seasoned saints amongst us. A disturbing trend is a lack of respect towards those that come here and share their life experience in this walk and it shouldn't be too difficult to tell which are which, maybe just by taking the time to do a little searching on the members previous postings for one. But there seems to be too much that is reactionary without giving any thought to anyone else that is participating amongst us.

We have heard from some high minded individuals effortlessly spouting off a mindset of "You need to do...thus and so", the thought of stereotyping individuals, slanderous comments, accusations, finger pointing...sigh...., to belabor the point...[i]of what manner of spirit you are?[/i]
Have we become a bunch of smart alecks, wiseguy's? For those of us fond of quoting Ravenhill, what might that mighty man of God have to say towards all this? Perhaps,

[i]" And you get to heaven and the eyes of Christ a full of Holiness and the place is brooding Holiness and you have all the saints of all the ages…and suppose Gabriel comes with a record of your devotional life? Heh??? We’ll hardly step out of time into eternity before we realize what FOOLS we’ve been."[/i]

This may not even be intentional often times and at other moments it makes one wonder, what in the world is going on in the hearts of the redeemed?

The under-lying problem is a preoccupation with self.
Self importance.
Self gratification.
Self opinion.

Will borrow a snippet from a newer member and more seasoned saint that sent me an article this morning:

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[b][u]One problem and one solution[/u][/b]

1 Pet 3:15 But [b]in your hearts [u]set apart Christ[/u][/b] as Lord…. (NIV)

We fail to realize we have only [b][u]one[/u][/b] enemy --- it’s us. We have only one solution… Jesus.
Scripture refers to this inward enemy using different terms: self, my life, soul, flesh and carnal nature.
(Thanks brother)

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Have tried to take in all that was stated from the many here both publicly and privately. Will confess my shortcomings in dealing with all this. Perhaps we have given too much latitude when a strong rebuke was needed. Perhaps we could have gone about this in a more private way, though some of that did and does happen but maybe not to the extent it should. The personal tendencies are to hope for self correction, a nudging to get or glean some perspective from other topics and what would seem to gather more import, but seemingly that is often not the case.

There seems to be a fixation on American thought, though this has become and is an outreach that is being utilized by the vastness of the planet as the recent numbers suggest. That in itself ought to be humbling enough and yet still....

Right now in various parts of the world there are untold and remarkably ignored, brothers and sisters being [b]persecuted[/b] for their faith in the Lord. What pray tell would much of this trivialness look like to them? Not suggesting that these things shouldn't be discussed, but to devolve into controversies and mud slinging while they are under threat of death, torture, abuse, the heart break of family's... and still the willingness to lay down their lives for the sake of the Lord.

And we have a conniption fit over a teen bible or some other secondary doctrinal issue. That the Lord would give us some eye balm and perspective. It is to our shame that we can't let go of our small mindedness.

Have pounded this into the ground and pray that somehow this might be embedded within us; That we might humble ourselves before the Lord, cease going out of the way to be offensive as if it was some kind of badge to wear, the thoughts mentioned here on that are well worth musing on alone.

Mat 23:23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, [b]and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone[/b].

2Co 12:19 Again, think ye that we excuse ourselves unto you? we speak before God in Christ: but we do all things, dearly beloved,[b]for your edifying[/b].

Joe 2:12 "Yet even now," declares the LORD, "return to me with all your heart, with fasting, with weeping, and with mourning;
Joe 2:13 [b]and rend your hearts and not your garments[/b]." Return to the LORD, your God, for he is gracious and merciful, slow to anger, and abounding in steadfast love; and he relents over disaster.

1Co 1:10 Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, [b]that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment[/b]. 1Co 1:11 For it hath been declared unto me of you, my brethren, by them which are of the house of Chloe, [b]that there are contentions among you[/b].

[b]For none of us lives to himself, and no one dies to himself. If we live, we live to honor the Lord; and if we die, we die to honor the Lord. So whether we live or die, we belong to the Lord.

For this reason Christ died and returned to life, so that he might become the Lord of both the dead and the living. Why, then, do you criticize your brother? Or why do you despise your brother? For all of us will stand before the judgment seat of God. For it is written, "As certainly as I live, declares the Lord, every knee will bow to me, and every tongue will praise God." Consequently, each of us will give an account of himself to God.

Therefore, let us no longer criticize each other. Instead, make up your mind not to put a stumbling block or hindrance in the way of a brother[/b].
Rom 14:7-13

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Mike Balog

God Bless You! That was powerful!! and as someone between the milk and the meat you got the message out for me that would have been some of my complaints here, but that's just like God "Right On Time"
Thanks Bill

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Bill

The writer of the quote is very right. But you know seeing that this website is a good site, you'll always get some spitfire (not referring to anyones handle) trying to gather a crowd unto himself.

I remember reading Frank Bartleman's book "Azusa Street". The Spirit was moving people were getting filled with the Spirit etc.. and Frank and a few others have decided to not interfer with the Spirits workings but allow Him to have free will in the Church meetings.

Many upstarts were coming into the Church with their hell and brimstone messages of condemnation only to be eschorted out the door.

To bad for Annais and Sapphira though they never made out the door but dropped dead for interuppting the flow of the fear of God that was in thier midst. In a way they had to die to establish a holy reverance for both God and the Apostles, that this is not some light show you've come to watch but this is serious business.

I have presented an alternative message regarding the end times etc.. but if someone doesn't see it my way that doesn't mean that I will get in a huff and start condemning people, that is silly. If we can't walk away friends, then there is something wrong with our character.

I enjoy a good debate, but if it turns nasty, then it's best to dissolve it for the sake of unity.

I just love coming here and being able to share and learn from others, because if I had it altogether then I certainly do not need you or anyone else. But I am glad that I do need you and my other brethern.

God Bless

Karl

This was taken from the following posting:
[url=https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=4869&post_id=34060&order=1&viewmode=flat&pid=34055&forum=35#34060]Let's bake a cake[/url]

And has only been edited to make sense as it applies here.

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.... the penchant around here for thinly disguised and overt cynicism towards one another over difference of opinion is not casually done away with by a wave of the hand or another pronouncement to lighten up, even if it is not said in so many words.

This is unnecessary, it is grievous and it must cease!

There has been more than enough patience granted around here for those who want to press their own particular agenda's at everyone else's expense, whether that is intentional or not.

This stubborn refusal to consider others more valuable than themselves. The attempt to bring these issues to light in so many different ways, the divisiveness, the slandering, the lack of respect for those who have much experience in the things of the Lord and even the operator of this website, Greg Gordan, all being disregarded.
Am frankly disgusted with it.

Any number of postings related to this:
[url=https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?viewmode=flat&order=0&topic_id=4560&forum=12&post_id=&refresh=Go]WARNING[/url]

Another, and a well stated approach, read TonyS amongst the others, especially:
[url=https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=4857&forum=35]Let Us Be Cautious With Our Words[/url]

It has been reiterated over and over again what the thrust of this ministry is and now the tendency to drag it down into the gutter...:

[url=https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=7&forum=12&16]Community Rules[/url]

Within these guidelines is something that is completely overlooked.

[b] If you're replying to a post, stay on topic as much as possible.
-If you're posting a new topic, do not post something that has been discussed numerous times. Browse the forums first or use the Search function.[/b]

The sense of audacity and self promotion is appalling, no consideration, no contemplating, no searching not only of the forum but of the heart.

Have backed off here for awhile, because these things always cause self examination of my own intents and planks. One is an issue of [b][i]conduct[/i][/b], that which 'we' try and moderate. The other is the issues of the heart.

Have no 'thus saith the Lord' to pronounce.
Have no desires other than to learn and grow in the things of the Lord and this site is [i][b]Rich[/i][/b] in them.

Greg Gordan has poured himself out into all that you see and hear, here. Countless hours, money, sweat and certainly tears over what has been happening around here of late, especially now that he can't give the attention to this site that he once did as he pursues studies in a Bible college.

All this is [b][i]Freely[/i][/b] given.

And to some it seems it's just some place to spout off any old thing that comes to mind.
Prior to this I was not angry, but grieved.
Now I am angry, as if that mattered. But let me just state that if Greg were as involved now as in times past, much of this would never had seen the light of day.

Futile as it seems, this will be posted in the ignored "WARNINGS" thread as well.

Disgusted.

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Mike Balog