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 Until the Day! Luke 17

Hi All!
UNTIL THE DAY!
The two specific examples Jesus gave about his coming show that God will NOT pour out his wrath on his people but will take us out just PRIOR to this Judgement.
It also highlights in both examples that things are very normal concerning what is going on the earth and its people.
In the Noah example -Eating-Drinking-Marrying and in the Lot example Eating-Drinking-Buying-Selling-Building.As a side note sin is still going on as we see no marrying in Sodom due to homosexuality being widespread.

Jesus shows that just prior to this Judgement everything is normal-no nuclear wars-no famine (their is food)the economy is functioning as normal(buying and selling)socially people are marrying and to a certain degree we can see that currency is being spent on buildings which is always a positive sign in the modern economy.
1-The return of Jesus described by himself here could not be directly after "The Great Tribulation" because of the normality of life highlighted OR the "Great Tribulation" is not that big of deal as to affect everyday life.
2 Both examples are specific about the Judgement-That it is a Judgement by God.That means that for gods people to go through the "Great tribulation" their would have to be a second "pouring out of Gods wrath" as they don't go through this one mentioned here in Luke.
3. UNTIL THE DAY god's people are taken out nothing happens but as soon as they are taken up(lot going up out of the valley)and Noah (rising up on the water) then God pours out his complete Judgement.
I am careful to say that this may be a taking out to "a safe place" or it could be the "rapture".
I have my own opinion of Course on which it is.
I find it helpful not get confused with normal tribulations/trials and the specific period of time known as "the great tribulation"
I would like to keep any comments as close to the points made as possible and in a friendly atmosphere as possible



Luke 17 24- 34
"For just like the lightning, when it flashes out of one part of the sky, shines to the other part of the sky, so will the Son of Man be in His day. 25 "But first He must suffer many things and be rejected by this generation. 26 "And just as it happened in the days of Noah, so it will be also in the days of the Son of Man : 27 they were eating, they were drinking, they were marrying, they were being given in marriage, UNTIL THE DAY that Noah entered the ark, and the flood came and destroyed them all. 28 "It was the same as happened in the days of Lot : they were eating, they were drinking, they were buying, they were selling, they were planting, they were building ; 29 but on the day that Lot went out from Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven and destroyed them all. 30 "It will be just the same on the day that the Son of Man is revealed

Yours Staff

 2012/6/20 6:50Profile









 Re: Until the Day! Luke 17

The apearance of normality that you present is just that ,appearance.

Sending gifts to one another after the killing of the two witness if Revelations can appear normal and also the appearance the the people is good now they are dead lets continue doing our thing.

Re 11:10 And they that dwell upon the earth shall rejoice over them, and make merry, and shall send gifts one to another; because these two prophets tormented them that dwelt on the earth.
(KJV)

Luke 17 and Mathew 24 are mini outlines of what is to come. The fullness is revealed in the Book Of Revelation.


Other things to consider.

the plagues that were poured out on Egypt were estimated to be over a roughly 9 month period. Space in between these plagues. During this time it is reasonable to assume that egyptians were continuing to eat, drink, and be merry at times.

I have a few more points but I have to go to work.
God bless

 2012/6/20 7:09
TMK
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Joined: 2012/2/8
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 Re: Until the Day! Luke 17

There is a potential problem with a "rapture" interpretation. Luke 17 continues:
-------
31 On that day, the one who is on the housetop and whose goods are in the house must not go down to take them out; and likewise the one who is in the field must not turn back. 32 Remember Lot’s wife. 33 Whoever seeks to keep his life will lose it, and whoever loses his life will preserve it. 34 I tell you, on that night there will be two in one bed; one will be taken and the other will be left. 35 There will be two women grinding at the same place; one will be taken and the other will be left. 36 Two men will be in the field; one will be taken and the other will be left.” 37 And answering they said to Him, “Where, Lord?”

And He said to them, “Where the body is, there also the vultures will be gathered.”
==========

The people here being "taken away" are being taken away to be judged, not taken away into the heavens.



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Todd

 2012/6/20 7:40Profile
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 Re:

hi,it is not just an appearance of normality according to jesus it is normal and he goes out of his way to point it out.what about the points i made yours staff

 2012/6/20 8:15Profile
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 Re:

hi tmk,if it isnt the rapture or taking to safety prior to judgement what is it? and their would have to be 2 tribulations?what about the 3points made specifically?yours staff

 2012/6/20 8:20Profile
proudpapa
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 the Harvest (let both grow together untill)

Mathew 13

24 Another parable put he forth unto them, saying, The kingdom of heaven is likened unto a man which sowed good seed in his field:

25 But while men slept, his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat, and went his way.

26 But when the blade was sprung up, and brought forth fruit, then appeared the tares also.

27 So the servants of the householder came and said unto him, Sir, didst not thou sow good seed in thy field? from whence then hath it tares?

28 He said unto them, An enemy hath done this. The servants said unto him, Wilt thou then that we go and gather them up?

29 But he said, Nay; lest while ye gather up the tares, ye root up also the wheat with them.

30 (Let both grow together until the harvest): and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn.


v39
the (harvest is the end of the world); and the reapers are the angels.

 2012/6/20 10:08Profile
proudpapa
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 White Robes of revelations

REV 7
13 And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they?

14 And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.

 2012/6/20 10:16Profile
TMK
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 Re: Until the Day! Luke 17

Hi Staff-

In regard to Point 3 (UNTIL THE DAY god's people are taken out)

The verses I quoted indicated that the people taken out are going to be dead-- that is why the vultures are gathering. The people taken out are not believers. Lots of people think that the verses talking about one being taken and the other left refers to the rapture of the church. But if they read on, Jesus answers the disciples question regarding where those taken are taken to, and he says, in so many words, to their deaths-- because carrion birds are circling.

If you think these verses refer to the rapture of the church, how do you interpret Jesus's words about the vultures gathering?

And remember-- in the cases of Noah's flood and Sodom and Gomorrah-- the wicked were "taken" not the righteous.


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Todd

 2012/6/20 10:28Profile
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 Re:

hi tmk, the problem with that is that it wouldnt be like the day of noah or lot which it would have to b staff

 2012/6/20 10:34Profile
TMK
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 Re:

In Noah's and Lot's cases the wicked were destroyed.

Jesus here is talking about the wicked being destroyed, likely referring to the desolation of Jerusalem in 70 AD. True believers escaped the city, the wicked stayed behind and were slaughtered. I can guarantee that the vultures did indeed gather. It was a holocaust of major proportions.


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Todd

 2012/6/20 11:00Profile





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