| Gloom and Doom|
There seems to be a lot of "gloom and doom" posting on Sermonindex.
Are we supposed to be "doom and gloom" Christians?
"For God has not given us a spirit of fear, but of power and of love and of a sound mind." I Tim. 1:7.
People will say it is important that we know just how bad it is getting, and how we need to know what is going on. And God willing we might even be martyred next week.
But you would have to be awfully dumb to not see that things are moving in the wrong direction.
The danger with "doom and gloom" posting is that it creates "doom and gloom" thinking, which is something that Christians are decidedly NOT to engage in:
"Finally, brethren, whatever things are true, whatever things are noble, whatever things are just, whatever things are pure, whatever things are lovely, whatever things are of good report, if there is any virtue and if there is anything praiseworthymeditate on these things." Phil. 4:8.
And from our Lord:
Therefore do not worry, saying, What shall we eat? or What shall we drink? or What shall we wear? For after all these things the Gentiles seek. For your heavenly Father knows that you need all these things. But seek first the kingdom of God and His righteousness, and all these things shall be added to you. Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about its own things. Sufficient for the day is its own trouble."
I guess the question we should ask when bringing up "doom and gloom" subjects is "What is the reaction we are looking for?" Because regardless of how innocent our intentions may be, many people may freak out or fret, neither of which is a godly reaction. Worry and fear drive people from the Lord, by defnition.
| 2012/6/15 15:28||Profile|
| Re: Gloom and Doom|
If a New Testament Christian "freaks out and frets" it's because of one reason only.
They haven't read the entire New Testament.
How much is given to eschatology.
And have they cross-referenced all of that NT eschatology to the Old Testament?
There's no way a person can not see the days we were born into if they've seriously studied their Bible.
I have no pity for the "freakers and the freters".
But I will uphold the weak in the faith, with my life.
Some of us feel honored to have GOD choose us to be born into "this generation".
| 2012/6/15 15:50|
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But you know, some people study the bible viciously and literally freak out if even 666 comes up on their phone as if the mark of the beast has just invaded somehow. Those who have this mindset become a danger to some people especially when it comes to 'end times' stuff because essentially they end up crying wolf too much because they react to seemingly every little thing that could be an 'end times' item according to their understanding of the bible.
I don't get myself immersed in it as others do and therefore I dont' have the freakout shakes as some tend to have. I know some people think these types of Christians are near schizo as a result.
| 2012/6/15 17:15||Profile|
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I think American Christians do however need to start preparing our Hearts for Persecution, We are fat and hooked on the grain bucket, we will follow the Grain Bucket right into the slaughter plant.
| 2012/6/15 17:22||Profile|
| Re: Gloom and Doom|
TMK please bear with me. I am not trying to slam you.
Instead of labeling this "doom and gloom" which also gives a reaction in many that says,"Yea we need to focus on the good etc etc".
This is the carnal natural tendency of all of us to seek the easy way. I am guilty of this first and foremost.
Every one of Gods prophets apostles and teachers were labeled, "doom and gloom" by those who did not want to repent of the sin that was bring the doom and gloom message.
TMK I am not saying this is you.
However I do not like to use terms like this or "legalist" or "easy believism" etc cuz it really tempts us to divide more and more from what is scriptural. It throws the broad brush a dismiss the messnger from being heard.
"ALL the counsel of God must be proclaimed. Therefore posts and messages will contain pointing out of bad news and the need to repent so we can enjoy the good news.
| 2012/6/15 18:06|
Monroe, LA - USA
| Re: |
I dont know everyones motives for the things that are posted here on SI, but to be sure none of really know even our own motives
only God does (Jer. 17:9-10), but I believe that I can explain some of the motivation for it:
Jesus gave similar exhortations:
Luc 21:34 And take heed to yourselves, lest at any time your hearts be overcharged with surfeiting, and drunkenness, and cares of this life, and so that day come upon you unawares.
Luc 21:35 For as a snare shall it come on all them that dwell on the face of the whole earth.
Luc 21:36 Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man.
Mat 24:4 And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you.
Mat 24:5 For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.
Mat 24:6 And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet.
Mat 24:7 For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.
Mat 24:8 All these are the beginning of sorrows.
Mat 24:9 Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake.
Mat 24:10 And then shall many be offended, and shall betray one another, and shall hate one another.
Mat 24:11 And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.
Mat 24:12 And because iniquity shall abound, the love of many shall wax cold.
Mat 24:13 But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
It is human nature to relax in the good times and not be preparing ourselves spiritually as Jesus said, watching and praying, and such hard times can come upon us unexpectedly and our love can wax cold and we can be among those who do not endure to the end and therefore are not saved in the end.
Why would Jesus exhort: Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man. If all we had to do was to think on good things, such exhortations wouldnt be in the scripture.
Of course such exhortations are not to induce fear of men: Mat 10:28 And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.
There are several things in Gods Word that can appear to contradict one another, but taken by Gods leading can produce a balanced mindset that will carry us through to the end. The same Bible that says fear not says: pass the time of your sojourning here in fear. The same writer who said: Rejoice in the Lord alway: and again I say, Rejoice also said I say the truth in Christ, I lie not, my conscience also bearing me witness in the Holy Ghost, That I have great heaviness and continual sorrow in my heart.
There is a great concern for many in modern western churches who have been SO VERY unbalanced in their diets of the Word; therefore, people here on SI want to present the least served items on Gods menu so that we can all have a well-balanced spiritual diet that will keep us through the hard times. The warnings about coming persecution such as those that Jesus gave in Matthew 24 are not heard much in many churches. A sincere Christian who hasnt been faced with that reality could suddenly think that God has left or forsaken him if hes thrown into a fiery furnace, and feels the heat, or if in a Lions den he is mauled. If all he has ever heard is God will deliver you if you have faith it may come as a shock that Gods plans sometimes include severe torture and death.
| 2012/6/15 18:40||Profile|
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Quote: "TMK please bear with me. I am not trying to slam you."
I don't feel slammed; I knew (and was hoping) that people would bring up all the verses mentioned.
I agree that scriptures tell us to be "sober" and "alert."
In his Olivet Discourse, Jesus did make some dire warnings and predictions, all of which were fulfilled in the disciple's lifetime when Jerusalem was sacked by the Romans in 70 AD. And of course his warnings worked-- the believers fled the city and escaped the carnage, which was indeed terrible. I don't think many believers today understand how awful that event was.
I just wanted to start a discussion on the need for balance; because like it or not many people, even mature believers, feels pangs of fear or worry when they read things about how terrible it is soon going to be, how we are going to be thrown into concentration camps here in America or be held down and have implants forced into our bodies that will doom us all to hell etc.
If it happens, oh well. We need to be ready, agreed. But we don't get ready by reading alarmist posts-- we get ready by being on solid footing in our relationship with the Lord. If that is where it should be, we will have the grace and courage to face whatever may come our way.
| 2012/6/16 8:50||Profile|
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God sounds the prophetic "alarm" out of His love. It's because He knows there are MANY of His who are not ready for what's coming & the prophetic "alarmist" (as you call it) call is a trumpet. He sounds is to rattle up His people to see they aren't in the condition they think they are in. Sure, there are "so called prophet"-types along for the ride sending out fear-mongering, but there is also the truly prophetic camp of saints in the fold through whom God is blowing the shofar.
When, in Acts, a certain prophet in the Body told the church to prepare for a coming famine in Jerusalem, the church took it seriously, as directly from the Lord, & prepared. It was an act of Gods mercy. Some probably said, "oh, there's no need to worry, just trust God (basically He can send down manna if need be), & didn't take the prophetic cry real 100% seriously with sobriety followed by prompted action. They either starved, if isolated, or had to get food from those in the Body who heard the cry, trusted in the Word from heaven, took it dead serious, & followed it with the faith in action work of preparing/storing up for the soon coming famine. Who was more spiritual REALLY?
Do we need to trust in God 100% come what may? Absolutely! Do we need to grow more in Him now and come closer and shed more of the weights that hinder and entangle us? Absolutely! Do we need to truly die to self, take up our cross daily, & follow Him whithersoever He goeth? Absolutely! The fact that God continues to cry out through His prophets the way He does is de facto proof that WE ARE STILL NOT READY SPIRITUALLY for what's ahead. We aren't sober in our self-evaluation. We are so far off, as a whole and individually (most of the Body, especially in the West), that God is lovingly, kindly, mercifully sounding the trumpet louder and louder as enemy troops approach the city walls!
As far as "balance", the Body balances itself out. The eye can't say to the arm "I don't need you", nor can the feet say to the eyes "quit seeing ahead so clearly, I'm walking just fine where we stand right now". The eyes look ahead for danger in the Body's environment & where it's headed. It's what they do. I mean, how "balanced" was John the Baptist, Jeremiah, Isaiah, Amos, Joel, Ezekiel, etc. under that type analysis? They were as God made/called/gifted/empowered them to be. They in turn balanced out the rest of the Body, just as the rest of the Body balanced out them. But when they spoke, the Body listened. The true Body did. The rebellious wrote them off, got sick of listening to them, & eventually ignored them to their own peril.
How balanced was Noah? He looked like a crazy man preaching against wickedness & building a boat talking about a judgement coming FOR DECADES! They all laughed him to scorn, eventually of not immediately, but only Noah & His family were saved while the whole earth drowned in their disbelief of His message. Cause it wasn't "His" message, but God's! "As it was in the days of Noah, so shall it be in the coming of the Son of Man." The Alarm is an act of love & mercy. "Don't despise those who Prophesy".
Love in Christ - Jeff
| 2012/6/16 10:26|
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Doom and Gloom and Drama sells,in books,on TV,in the movies, and in real life scenario's, and not even Christians are immune to it. Most Doom and Gloom and Drama in most folks lives is self inflected, you do have a choice to walk away, to turn the tube to another one of the hundreds of channels, etc. For some odd reason that demon spirit, easily invades some weak minded folks minds, even Christians, if you are watching it, listening to it, are reading it, "you" are only being a contributor to that demon spirit. I always "as most men do anyway" keep the remote in my hand, so when the drama starts to fill the air during a commercial or show change I start flipping. No doom and gloom or drama wanted here, and the best thing is anyone that comes to visit knows this, funny thing is it hasn't slowed my visitors any, matter fact I have gained a few.
| 2012/6/16 12:07||Profile|
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Good post jeffmar thank you for taking the time to write that out.
| 2012/6/16 12:15|