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Joined: 2008/6/19
Posts: 1257


Matthew 12:36-37 But I say unto you, That every idle word that men shall speak, they shall give account thereof in the day of judgment. For by thy words thou shalt be justified, and by thy words thou shalt be condemned.

Blessings...from brother rbanks

 2012/4/14 21:12Profile


David Wilkerson has a powerful message on this subject. It is on SI titled "God is Training A Holy Remnant". I will warn the religious who are easilly offended that he states the denominational church system is largely abandoned by God, controlled by satan, and God is working outside of organized religion in these last days to name a few.

 2012/4/14 21:14

Joined: 2008/4/1
Posts: 531
America's Heartand

 Re: God bless you too Lisa

@ HezWellig-

Wow... all I can say is that you are certainly ill informed. I know probably 200+ of those people working at AOG headquarters. Running a printing press is just a job to the vast majority of folks there or elsewhere. It is not seen as a "mission" or "life's passion" to any of them that I am aware of. I have family in that department and am sure of which I speak. Several of the employees are not even AOG. One need not be AOG to run a printing press, clean rollers, etc. There are folks of several faith backgrounds employed at AOG headquarters. Certainly the lions share are AOG but certainly not cornered on the market.

I personally know few people making $25,000 a year that can afford to just take a 10% / $2500 pay cut. Can You? If so maybe you can contact them and be the first pledge to give them $2500 to save their jobs... that do not exist. Could you honestly pay someone $25,000 when there WAS NO WORK TO DO?!?! If you can then get on the phone and raise support to pay for jobs that consist of looking at the walls. If you aren't willing to put your money where your mouth is then you are in error to cast negativity at others. That would be the epitome of hypocritical. imho.

I also noticed you fail to take into account the massive prayer, evangelistic and church planting efforts that are showing tremendous results. Are you against that as well??? I have no problem listing the numbers of people making commitments to Christ..or church growth at all. In fact neither does the Bible. Read the book of Acts again... you will find salvations, spirit baptisms, and church growth recorded in numerical detail. I fail to see why following the book of Acts is cause to be called, in jimdied2sins words, " a daughter of the great whore of Babylon"

The link you share attacking the New York District concerning church foreclosures was filled with a vast amount of misrepresentation. When local autonomous churches choose to affiliate with the AOG they willingly choose to enter into a cooperative fellowship. The AOG isn't even a denomination. It is a cooperative fellowship of local self governing autonomous churches that choose to work together to accomplish greater good.

On of the items that is commonly contained in the constitution and bylaws when a local church incorporates concerns any buildings, property, etc. that the church may obtain over time. It is common for that to include a clause that states if the fellowship goes through a split or if leadership later arises that wishes to lead it out of the AOG they may do so. However, since the facilities ministries, facilities, etc. were established under the AOG, the resources were raised for AOG churches, and that district may well have invested funds, etc. to get it started then the clause often will retain the facilities for any people that wish to remain as an AOG fellowship. About the only way to have a church "seized" is for a couple of leaders (pastors, etc.) to try and take the church out of the AOG and take it totally independent. Many "independent" churches were "started" this way. The attempting to take the church out of the AOG would be a clear violation of the charter that was willingly adopted by the church at its inception. If there are people who wish to remain in the AOG the facility will be used by them to continue the church. THAT is about the only way these things go to court. A local leader tries to take the church and its facilities out of a fellowship and under his own independent authority... a violation of the churches stated constitution and bylaws thus requiring the AOG to act in behalf of the members who have requested to stay in the AOG. Not much of any other way this happens... actually none that I have ever seen or been made aware of.

You are speaking of things that you have very limited, if any, awareness and knowledge of. They are not as you seem to have represented them. I feel bad having to defend brothers from your vicious statements. However, that is sadly the case on far, far, far, to many threads on SI. Attackers are a plenty on the threads here.

Sadly, you fail to notice the tremendous good, evangelism, discipleship, and spiritual growth happening in the fellowship. I see it every day. It is just a group of like minded people and churches that have willingly chosen to work together to accomplish the great commission. That is a worthy endeavor.... the criticism of it by those doing little if anything for God is not. imho.

 2012/4/14 21:32Profile

 dear brother Solomon

i was "raised" up in the Assemblies of God, so i JUST might have SOME knowledge of the polity of the denomination.

That said, i will not speak one ill word against the AoG, even i see and hear and discern things that grieve no end.

When, as a Jew, (and NOT a secular, ethnic Jew) i walked into an AoG Church for the first time,led there by God the Holy Ghost, after having apprehended that Jesus is Messiah is REAL, i had no clue, about ANYTHING the Gentiles had done to The Way. i never knew the theological differences, say between the roman institution and New Testament Protestant Churches AND Denominations, nor did i even know what Pentecostalism was.......i was open, no presuppositions.

so for you to counter me, with such remarks, ie

Wow... all I can say is that you are certainly ill informed.

is dont know what i know, you dont know that i've sat in many district presbyter meetings and breakfasts....or taught many a childrens church out of a cirriculum, sent by Springfield, which i will not editorialize on, but grieved over, when i prepared in mind and prayer.

and you wrote this:

You are speaking of things that you have very limited, if any, awareness and knowledge of. They are not as you seem to have represented them. I feel bad having to defend brothers from your vicious statements. However, that is sadly the case on far, far, far, to many threads on SI. Attackers are a plenty on the threads here.

"vicious"? "attacking"?...i'll forgive for your presumption on my "limited awareness and knowledge"....but "attacking"?

no, my brother, i am GRIEVED to the core of my being by it all! GRIEVED! Heartbroken! and i would tell you all the reasons why i feel this way, but its all so painful, that i dont even want to type the WORDS on a public forum, except for one thing, i WILL bring up.

Knowing the genesis of the denomination, Brother Cashwell of Dunn, NC...and reading Frank Bartlemans account of Azusa Street, where he exulted "that the colorline was washed away in the Blood"...and seeing the two main denominations borne out of the Revival, which MANY today, grievously say was no revival at all, these two denominations being, AoG, predominatly white, and COGIC, the Church of God in Christ, which is black.

Now i know all about, letters and statements signed between the two, reconciliation, etc. And i begged, pleaded, implored by dear brother and best friend, pastor of my initial Church, "lets get back to Azusa, lets fly in the face of the world, and search out a COGIC Church, and in the Love of Jesus, lets become sisters Churches, going back and forth to the other facilities"....and there was absolutely no traction on what the Holy Spirit led my heart to say.nothing happpened.

i wasnt mad, cross, angry, vicious, just sad and grieved. Like i am now, about the WHOLE of the North American Church, so divided...and i might add, becoming SO POLITICIZED...and i dont want to expand on THAT either.

Now, i tell you what i AM doing in my area, which is very rural now. i am engaging in deep personal work, but i have also been going to Church after Church...the nearest town is 700 souls, and thats a larger town. God had me do something i never thought i would, i walked into a United Methodist Church, listened to the message, loved on the saints, loved on the pastor, burned him a worship cd, and when i went in there, i had no presuppositions, or prejudgements, but i can tell you this, it felt as cold and dry as a tomb, nice facilities, nice people....but no tarrying at the altar, the folks bolted out the pews once the final hymn was sung. Then i went to the "other" Church, which was a "oneness" Pentecostal Church, UPCI, and i wanted to flee, but God told me "stay" i did, and i very sweetly asked the pastor, isnt UPCI "oneness"...oh my, he asked me, "how's you know that word?"...just told him i did, and then he proceeded to try and "sell" me on "oneness"...or "Jesus Name Only"...just like a salesman, he's a dear man, believes what he feels led to believe, i listened for a spell, nodded, and just said, "well, guess we'll agree to disagree"...and i said it sweet.

SO, here's where i'm led, as 95% of the areas Churches are either United Methodist, Lutheran or roman. There is an old storefront, used to be a second hand store, now its empty, hundred year old bldg, on Main street of this 700 person, i'm good friends with the fella who owns the bldg, and its just sitting empty. So i'm going to ask the man, doesnt know Jesus, but he likes me, knows i follow Jesus, if i can rent it off him, and then i'm going to call the two pastors i mentioned above, and ask them if they'd care to join me in a Tues or Thurs night prayer meeting, no agenda, except to ask God to pour His Waters on a dry and thirsty ground, and beg God come down in Power and saturate the district with His Spirit, and bring Revival...and on the front of that storfront, i'm going to put up a wooden sign with One Name on It, JESUS.

Lord hasnt given me the call yet, i'm waiting on Him......and there's one human agent, now with the Lord, who i been listening to speak, and thats Len Ravenhill, and if you think what i wrote was "vicious"...maybe you havent been listening to Len at all...or maybe you just hear him different, i dont know.

Now if i stumbled you, ie made you angry, or cross with my words, i beg your forgiveness, but i'll tell you what i'm NOT going to do, i'm not going to be a soft sissy boy, "yes and amening" what the crowd wants to hear, when God the Holy Spirit leads me otherwise. Better to have the crowd against me and the LORD with me, then the other way around, and thats whats been happening in the Body of Christ in North America as far as the Spirit testfiies to me.....there it is my brother, May the Grace of God and the peace of the Holy Spirit and the Love of Jesus be on you, forever...flee babylon. neil

 2012/4/15 7:49

Joined: 2012/4/17
Posts: 1

 Re: Assemblies of God lays off 47 people at HQ

For all the arm-chair generals who think this is (or isn't) a good idea, please keep one thing in mind. On Thursday there were 47 people who felt their world crash down on their heads. I live in Springfield and I've heard tales of grown men crying. I know of families that are seriously hurting. I know of people who received a pink slip who were the victims of players who still have jobs. I know people who still have jobs who feel a great deal of survivor guilt. They feel quite relieved to have a job, but they're in pain for their friends and family members.

So whether or not the layoff was the right decision is in God's hands. He is just and He can take care of all His children. But please have more compassion than judgment. This is painful for those of us in Springfield, and particularly painful for 47 people without a job in a down economy.

 2012/4/17 20:14Profile

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