Brother Krispy, no not at all. I was not at all disturbed by your comment. I just felt my need to make things clear. Many think that Indians are not taught English well, it is not true as we have decent educational system with English as primary Language. Curtsey of British who ruled us for over 200 years. I think i have a problem when I read what I have typed I read it as what I have intended to write instead of what I have actually written.

Forgive me if I ever sounded arguing with you. This is one thing that I am trying to avoid.

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Sreeram

"We also do not allow debating of calvinism and armianism, we have found after 10 years of running this forum that these debates do not produce fruit or obedience in Christian walks."

With all due respect brother Greg, I say this with as much meekness and gentleness as I can (and if I could send you a private PM on this I would).. But since instituting this rule, you yourself have violated it and posted articles that speak to the these very subjects. How can you hold others to a standard that you have not held yourself too? If you've repented of the double standard, that's one thing.. but if you haven't.......???

Sure I understand Hulsey. That's not what I'm talking about though.

If I was to post an article by a Calvinist that explains some aspect of Tulip and why the other understanding if false (or an Arminian artilce vise-versa), the thread would be lock. Yet these "type" of articles have been posted before by Greg since the instituting of this rule.

I commented about it in the past on one of the articles, but it was just brushed off. Anyway, just hoping the standard is universal if there is going to be one..... We lose credibility when it's not.

Those that have been around a while see trends in these forums. The reason why 'most' Calvinism and 'Arminianism' threads end up being shut down is because they lose their profitability. Sometimes something may be useful and even I would like to post on it, but a hail of gunfire erupts as if a battery was opened up on each side of the debate. I see this happening right now (and for some time) with threads related to the Law or laws, etc. We had to lock certain threads back in Nov. and Dec. (I think) over the Law of Moses, etc. Some of you will recall that I drew swords with some of these people and we eventually banned them for their persistence. Sometimes people will just move to a different computer, sign in under a different name, and start up again. Usually they do it subtly and get bolder. They act out and we have to ban that IP as well. That is the sad state of things.

The challenge is that most of us have full time jobs and families and cannot watch these forums as we would like to. This is when folk take advantage that are moving in what I wrote above. We can't keep the birds from circling our head but we try to keep them from building a nest in our hair (as it were). This is where other forum posters come in that are learned and wise and gracious. They can challenge these ideas. What is not helpful is to go off calling people names such as heretic and liar and such. That is immoderate behavior. To do so often gives the person the notion that they are actually WINNING the 'debate' because the other person is resorting to emotional responses. This could have the effect of actually deceiving the person further because they think their arguments are prevailing.

Moreover, how can we challenge a 'heretic' if the people yelling about the heretic are out-of-line in the tone of their posts? Pretty soon we have a whole room full of people pointing at each other and in the confusion little can be done. Better a patient man than a warrior, a man who controls his temper than one who takes a city. (Proverbs 16:32 NIV) I am a VERY passionate person about my theological views. I have thrown down in these forums in the past on many occasions. I have tried to be more moderate over the years and deal rightly about things. It is difficult and we covet your prayers that God would give us the wisdom on how to handle things. God Bless.

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Robert Wurtz II

"What is not helpful is to go off calling people names such as heretic and liar and such. That is immoderate behavior. To do so often gives the person the notion that they are actually WINNING the 'debate' because the other person is resorting to emotional responses."

Robert, what do you call someone who propagates that one must keep the Levitical Law, the Sabbath, the Feast Days etc... to be right with God? Not just once, but over and over and over again. What did Paul say about them in Galatians? Was Paul out of line to write his letter in the tone and content of what he said? Was he just emotional? I can't see instances in which Paul let me like that just hang around in hopes that they would learn something. He sought to shut their mouths and warn the believers so that they didn't get deceived by men seeking to bring people back under that law.

Here's the danger. You have someone come on SermonIndex and starting a thread titled "Abandoned by God". Someone is needing help. Then you have theEphah telling this person they need to repent for not keeping the law (All the Law), and that they need to call God only Yahweh and that they should never use the word Amen (because they feel it's pagan in origin). If you all feel it's ok, then ultimately that's how the forums will operate. I personally feel that the immoderate and reckless behavior is not the calling out of false teaches, but instead is the attitude that allows these men to prevail and continue to spread their false teaching and influence others.

There is definitely a place for being moderate in our discussions. I think the whole Cal/Arm discussion is a great example of where patience, grace, and long suffering should be extended. However, can it be said that the same grace should be given to one seeking to bring people back under the law as a form of righteousness and right standing with God?

Anyway, I leave my comments about the Judaizer at that. Please just consider that God may be trying to show you something through all of this.

(by the way, in another post you mentioned me being new to the forums. I've actually been around for years. My other account had hundreds of post over many years.)

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Robert Wurtz II

I really dont want to get involved in this conversation, but I just wanted to quickly comment on this: