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Discussion Forum : General Topics : New Book Released: The Better Covenant by Ron Bailey

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ccchhhrrriiisss
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Joined: 2003/11/23
Posts: 4779


 Re:

I look forward to this! Thanks for the head's up!


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Christopher

 2012/3/1 11:01Profile
Enochh
Member



Joined: 2007/8/22
Posts: 116
Indianapolis

 Re:

got this on my kindle yesterday. on second chapter. all i can say is wow. what a feast. highly recommended.


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Jeff

 2012/3/2 7:44Profile









 Re:

I have just finished the book. It is very well written - I like the style, and Mr Bailey has an exceptional gift in opening up the scriptures in a way that makes them understandable today. But I find it confusing - his theology that is.

He quotes holiness writers from the past - Murray, Wesley, Chambers and others and seems to be working out their theology as he goes along, but when he gets to the crunch, he denies their teaching.

I just find him very unclear as to whether he believes in second blessing holiness or not as he seems to be saying that those who are not experiencing the promises, have not been really converted yet.

This lack of distinction is very common today and I am disappointed that this book is following the same path.

 2012/3/2 12:05
RobertW
Member



Joined: 2004/2/12
Posts: 4636
St. Joseph, Missouri

 Re:

I finally ordered the hard copy version yesterday as well. It has been a few years in the works so I will be greatly excited to finally receive it. I would also love to see Abraham My Friend in print, but we will see what the Lord will do.


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Robert Wurtz II

 2012/3/2 12:40Profile
philologos
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Joined: 2003/7/18
Posts: 6566
Reading, UK

 Re:

krautfrau on 2012/3/2 14:05:28
"I just find him very unclear as to whether he believes in second blessing holiness or not as he seems to be saying that those who are not experiencing the promises, have not been really converted yet."

You could always ask him. ;-)


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Ron Bailey

 2012/3/2 15:02Profile









 Re:

Well ok Ron, what sayest thou?

 2012/3/2 15:42
SHMILY
Member



Joined: 2009/12/13
Posts: 203
Northern Idaho

 Re: New Book Released: The Better Covenant by Ron Bailey

Greetings Ron

Just thought you might like to know I ordered my book on Feb 29. When I ordered it the estimated delivery date was March 13. The estimated delivery date on the shipping conformation was March 6. It arrived today ~ March 5. I am looking forward to reading it. (I am west of Seattle.)

REJOICE! =)
Mary

 2012/3/5 21:37Profile
philologos
Member



Joined: 2003/7/18
Posts: 6566
Reading, UK

 Re:

Thanks Mary. It seems that Createspace perhaps under promises and over delivers! Good to hear.


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Ron Bailey

 2012/3/7 4:30Profile
philologos
Member



Joined: 2003/7/18
Posts: 6566
Reading, UK

 Re:

Hello krautfrau, my apologies for the delay.

I have too many friends who came into rest as a second experience to deny second blessings but my book endeavours to examine the implications of the New Covenant rather than to toe a particular party line. Wesley clearly distinguished between the two covenants and Chambers, as with a few English holiness teachers, taught that there was a distinction between conversion and regeneration. Wesley, in a Plain Account of Christian Perfection, say "I use indifferently the words, regenerate, justified or believers". Chambers would certainly not have used them 'indifferently'.

I am a passionate believer in 'entire sanctification' but I find some of Wesley's teaching on this a little confusing myself. For example when would Wesley see the 'indwelling Spirit' event? At regeneration or sanctification?


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Ron Bailey

 2012/3/7 4:49Profile









 Re:

Ah - now I understand the purpose of your book. Thanks. I got the feeling that you were building things up to avoid triggering the switch off due to the later legalistic errors of the holiness movement and the usual misinterpretation of sinless perfection, but the big moment did not arrive. I did get the impression however, that this is the best way to approach things these days and thought the way you seemed to be building up to it was brilliant.

I agree with you about Wesley and have been very frustrated with him at times. Indeed Chambers, one of my favourites, would not use the words indifferently.

My own opinion about Wesley, great man though he was, was that, being a theologian, he had read too many holiness writings before the corresponding experience himself, and that he was badly advised imo to preach till he experienced it. I think that leads to confusion and that one should only preach that which one is qualified for.

I also think that he got confused between the second blessers and the third blessers but this was due to him only reaching the second blessing stage himself.

His theology is certainly confused but I think he taught that the Spirit is present at the first stage and only dwells in His fullness at stage two. I believe that this led on to Keswick theology and it is not the same as traditional holiness teaching, the clearest of which I have found amongst the early Quakers.

The two covenants as I understand it, are both in force, the old one applies when a believer has not entered fully into His rest.

Now I am not clear on the terms you have used ie conversion, regeneration and sanctification. Can you be more specific please? Thanks

Brenda

 2012/3/7 8:01





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