Thanks ArtB., Of course there is a necessary attribute of self love, or we would never be able to live with ourselves, or feel anything good about ourselves. Consider things like integrity, or an infants glowing smile as he peers into your eyes. Everyone here reading this was once there.

I am not talking about that in itself; it is an attribute given to each child born on Earth. I am talking about a spiritual condition when this ascends to dominate one's motives, and then, however subtly it occurs, our magnificent obsession is no longer God, but our well being and promotion. I quote my RE: below.

"A philosophy, that God exists solely to bless you, and enhance your life, has created a narcissistic faith that is all about loving yourself. Surely Jesus never meant this kind of loving your self. In a strong sense, it is much like the original sin of Lucifer, to overcome God Himself.".................

This has become a plague in our modern fellowships, and has led many into the jaws of the "Great Falling Away" itself. Why? Because when you cease to serve Jesus as Lord, but insert another god you worship, be it yourself on the throne, or demons, you lose the Graces of life and faith, that will only come from Him. "In Him is light, and He is the light of all men."

This is also the fundamental issue in the statement "Jesus is Lord"......not ourselves.

Thanks for your reply, Brothertom.

I agree that conceit and/or narcissism are not good traits for one to have.

We ought to be sincerely seeking the good for many others. And when we all do that, it results in delightful and a unique reality; we all end up having many people seeking what is good for us too. If we were all loving servants to each other, then we will have many servants seeking our best interest too.

We all wish to be loved and noticed. Give we love generously and we will generously receive love. Love from the heart will bear its' fruit.

_________________
Arthur Biele

"We ought to be sincerely seeking the good for many others. And when we all do that, it results in delightful and a unique reality; we all end up having many people seeking what is good for us too. If we were all loving servants to each other, then we will have many servants seeking our best interest too."

"We all wish to be loved and noticed. Give we love generously and we will generously receive love. Love from the heart will bear its' fruit."....ArtB

Yes! Absolutely true, Art! This is our future as a body, as a church.

"But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ:

"From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love."

We are on the way...as this new-life body is emerging from the ashes of dead religion.

"Tell that to Jesus, Paul, Jeremiah, and numerous others from the past. They seemed more concerned that a lie would spread, than just letting a lie sort itself out. Is it possible that they should have not confronted the lies, and just kept their mouths shut and let God sort things out?

If you saw a small child trying to put a fork in an electrical socket because someone told them that if they get it in in just the right way that they socket will spit out candy, would you try to tell them that it's not true? Or would you just let the electricity sort them out?

We have a really messed up version of love these days, that doesn't involve confronting and standing against lies. This version of love can't seem to be found in the Scriptures though.

Reading the edit you've done on your post, I want to also say that I agree we shouldn't seek to be confrontational, however many times the truth confronts. If Jesus had just kept His mouth shut about all the lies of the pharisees, and just said, "well I disagree, but God can sort you out" they probably would have never killed Him."
EverestoSama

_________________
Diane

One of the motives of Satan is to defile mankind, to deceive mankind, and stain him with his own evil. He uses man to do this, actual agents of himself who promote the lie to do so. This began in the garden, as Eve, end Adam "ate of the fruit" of the knowledge of good and evil.

The prominent sign of the end times IS deception, not revelation towards God. This is accomplished by MIXTURE; even as Jesus' temptation by Satan was...A word mixed with God's, but not fully. or slightly twisted...like..."Allah and Jehovah are the same God of Gods."

If we are not grounded in the Spirit that bears perfect witness to the Bible, The written Word; then we are susceptible to deception, and the thing about this that makes it so important is, that your Eternal Home is decided about how you respond to the deceiver. Jesus HIMSELF RESPONDED TO SATAN; IT IS WRITTEN!

MATTHEW 24.....ABOUT TODAY.
"And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.

Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.

For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.

Behold, I have told you before."...Jesus of Nazareth.

Jesus wept over Jerusalem because He saw their end coming; Wrath because they recived not the love of the Truth...Himself. Titus annihilated the city, with tens and thousands of crucified innocents lining the highways.

Paul warns:
"For I have not shunned to declare unto you all the counsel of God.

"Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood.

For I know this, that after my departing shall grievous wolves enter in among you, not sparing the flock.

Also of your own selves shall men arise, speaking perverse things, to draw away disciples after them.

Therefore watch, and remember, that by the space of three years I ceased not to warn every one night and day with tears."

Why did they warn? Because they loved, and true love is wanting someone to be with Jesus forever, not in the awful fire with Satan and his. Jesus wept as He warned. Paul wept as he warned...because people must know when they are being decieved.

This was as important to Jesus as was His wonderful teachins about Truth and life and the Cross....otherwise....His sacrifice would be to no avail, if ignored and the truth of it twisted.

religion counts too.

"We have a really messed up version of love these days, that doesn't involve confronting and standing against lies. This version of love can't seem to be found in the Scriptures though....EverestoSama..

It seems, Grant, that Paul the Apostle agrees with you.

"Wherefore I witness to you this day, that I am clean of the blood of all men. "..[ through love, he warned..]

For I fled not away [For I flew not away], that I told not to you all the counsel of God!"

Take ye attention to you [Take attention to you], and to all the flock, in which the Holy Ghost hath set you bishops, to rule the church of God, which he [hath] purchased with his blood.

I know, that after my departing, ravening wolves [snatching wolves] shall enter into you, not sparing the flock;

and men speaking depraved things shall rise of yourselves [and of yourselves men speaking wayward things shall rise], that they lead away disciples after them.

For which thing wake ye, holding in mind that by three years night and day I ceased not with tears admonishing each of you."...[ He wept out of passionate love that none would perish..]...Wycliffe Bible

We hate our brother if we see him perishing in the lie, and do nothing to rescue him.

"AM I MY BROTHER'S KEEPER?".....Cain