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Discussion Forum : Miracles that follow the plow : Not saved

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Joined: 2009/1/21
Posts: 1564
Locport, Illinois

 Not saved

I think the Lord has strongly revealed to me over the past 2 years that i am not saved, that is why i constantly am struggling and never overcome sin, my doubt, my fears or anything, that is why i am constantly posting the same stuff and nothing ever seems to change, this is not the life of a true believer. I do think it would bewise for some to not confirm my salvation anymore, even though Christ has came in my life 8 years ago, Christ moved and healed me and spoke to me, but it was never true conversion, if it was true conversion, then i most definitely lost it, but as muchas i remember i never came to cross, dealt with my sin or even committed myself completely to the Lord, i came to a knowledge of the Lord and even felt the presence of the Holy Spirit, but i have never seemedto overcome sin, but just seemed to stay in bondage to it, I have slowly for the past 8 year fell from my former faith and grown harder to the Lord, the Bible, sensing at all the Holy Spirit over the past year or two. I never wanted to fall and i wanted to overcome sin and truly be committed, but seemed to never happen. I stayed in my former condition with my wife prior to marriage for 3 and a half years without repenting, now a true believer would have never done that. Well i am pretty surethey wouldn't at least. Now i am not renouncing Christ by no means, I desire him and truly want to be saved, and i do want to live my life to glorify him and serve him, but i don't have the ability to do so because Christ i am pretty sure is not in me, now some say i should not say that and i should i need to make positive confessions of my salvation, but should as christians we take conversion as a small thing, is it not everything and the most important besides glorifying God and worshipping him. It very scary thing to assure people of their salvation, i have had a lot do that which has made it confusing for me. But i think this heavily cultural christianity to affirm people's salvation. From my understanding people like David Brainerd and Charles Spurgeon took the evidences of salvation very seriously. Now i pray that i am not wrong, because i would hate to say anything that is not true, but i truly think the Lord has revealed this to me and i think apart really has to do with my lack of faith especially and not overcoming sin orthe enemy in my life. Please pray for my salvation.

John Beechy

 2011/12/25 14:21Profile

Joined: 2006/6/10
Posts: 668
Northern Rockies, BC, Canada

 Re: Not saved

Better to be honest, regardless of what men may say of you, even if some may look down their noses upon your post - for Christ came for those who are sick brother, and not those that think they are well.
Keep striving friend to enter in through the straight gate, and work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.
Just keep humbling yourself, and God has promised to lift you up in due time.
"Blessed are the poor in spirit: for their's is the kingdom of heaven. Blessed are they that mourn: for they shall be comforted. Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth. Blessed are they WHICH DO HUNGER AND THIRST after righteousness: for THEY SHALL BE FILLED. Blessed are the merciful: for they shall obtain mercy. Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God." - Matthew 5:3-8
Merry Christmas friend - God works in those that are contrite and of a broken heart.
Pour out yourself to Him, that He may fill you to overflowing in His time, to the glory of His Name and forever, amen.


 2011/12/25 16:39Profile

Joined: 2007/2/8
Posts: 1583

 Re: Not saved

Hi Bible 4 life,
I want to say that I think that your struggle with sin proves you are "saved".The fact that you obviously hate your bondage to sin points that you want to please God and are saved.
I spent 23 years struggling with certain sins not that you will struggle for that long but it is Jesus who took that sin away and gave me success.You cant overcome it.
Look at salvatio this way-
I was saved: When Jesus came into my life and Irealized God exists and I was indwelt with the Holy Spirit.
I am being saved:This is where we are.God is working in us to overcome the world and sin that we struggle with and when we are sifted we turn to help our brothers n Sisters etc
I Will be Saved:In the Future God will ultimately save us by our death or by the rapture

I think your struggle can not be any longer or difficult than mine.God uses these things for the good to those who are in Christ.God even uses this sinful period,imagine that!I really feel that this song is for today.My suggestion is to listen to this song and be uplifted,Its called Holy Captivated.
Happy Christmas Staff

 2011/12/25 18:13Profile

Joined: 2008/9/26
Posts: 73
South Yorkshire, UK

 Re: Not saved

Firstly, thank you for your honesty - it is always encouraging when someone is able to be honest where it is truly difficult to do so, espcially in a setting such as this.

Secondly, be encouraged that such a confession of honesty places you ever more ready to come closer to Christ, to lose your life and find it hidden in Him, and to be made right.

Thirdly, I don't claim to any superior knowledge or such, but I was greatly encouraged by a post from yesterday - the link is below (hopefully):

I want to be careful not to steer your thinking too much on this at all, as God will speak in His way as best is needed for you, but I wanted to pass on this which was a blessing of encouragement to me and might be so to you too. In any case, I pray to our merciful, faithfulness and wonderful God for you, that you might know all the riches of full assurance of our God who rewards all who diligently seek after Him.

Jamie Adam

 2011/12/25 18:29Profile


When you come to Christ, you receive the Spirit of God, you repent from the nature and character of satan, you receive Jesus Christ as your master and you begin turning from these sins. The way you know that you’re turning from them because your heart doesn’t condemn you, you continue to walk in peace and you turn from them and you keep putting them under the blood. You are being washed by the blood, as you repent of these sins, they’re put under the blood and when they’re put under the blood God no longer sees you as a law (covenant) breaker and that’s how the blood is washing you and cleansing you. Eph 5:26 That he might sanctify (make holy) and cleanse (purge) it (the church) with the washing of water by the word.

That’s how you are being born again (continually) by the word of God, the word is washing you, because the word of God explains the nature of God, the nature of God and this gospel. It’s the power of the gospel that forms Jesus in you, so Christ can be formed in you. Rom 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth: (continually). Then you don’t turn back as the Galatians turned back, you go forward, and with it comes sanctification, purifying your heart, without which no one is going to see the Lord. You are going to pursue peace with all men, and you are going to put these sins under the blood and then you’re washed and you’re cleansed, and you’re washed and you’re cleansed, you don’t go back to the sin. Heb 12:14 Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord. If you do not move into holiness you will never see God. To accept Christ into your hearts by a sinners prayer and attend a church, because you got your ticket punched doesn’t make you holy. You are not saved, you will not hold out to the end and you will not see God. Matt 10:22 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name’s sake: but he that endureth (continually) to the end shall be saved. Only these shall be saved the bible says: I wonder why we have never heard these words from the pulpit? 40 years later serving lying preachers I am just learning this from the word of God!

You bear fruit and your fruit remains and you go on in until you possess the land, (your heart) and all of your sin has been put under the blood. For those who think that just believing that Jesus Christ is the Son of God, died on the cross and raised from the dead, that’s words isn’t it! That’s a commitment that you make when you first start and you receive the Spirit of God. What good is that commitment if you don’t follow through with it? Your words are nothing, then how am I redeemed by the blood? Your not redeemed by the blood until you repent and give up each sin. Each sin as you give it up, and you’ve really turned from it and you put it under the blood, that is when you’re redeemed from it. It doesn’t go under the blood until you repent and turn from it. Being redeemed by the blood is being washed by the blood. You are not cleansed from a sin until you repent from it. Saying that you believe Jesus Christ is the Son of God, died on the cross and raised from the dead does not mean you turned from it, or you will be like those in Gal 2 walking in sin and telling people I’m being lead by Christ.

If I start to rebuild what I have once destroyed Gal 2:18 Paul says For if I build again the things which I destroyed, (sin) I make myself a transgressor. I prove myself once again to be a transgressor. (sinner) If I repent from it and go back to it I’m not redeemed, I’ve not endured to the end, I’ve fallen away from the faith. The works of the flesh, you are not redeemed from them until you have truly repented from them in your heart. This will put the fear of God in you and will help your walk. Pro 1:7 The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge, but the fools despise wisdom and instruction. If I have repented of slander, unforgiveness, bitterness, envy, strife, criticism, and I haven’t turned from it in my heart, have I repented? I’m not being sanctified, I’m walking double minded. You have not really been redeemed until you turn from it. How can you be redeemed from something you love. If you love the character and nature of satan and do not do away with the selfish nature of satan, you better fear least you come short of it, Heb 4:1 Let us therefore fear lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it. You are to pursue peace with all men by doing away with the selfish nature of satan, and you better be sanctified to have a pure heart without which no one is going to see the Lord.

Is righteousness keeping the commandments of God? If I want to do away with everything but bitterness and unforgiveness, I’m still breaking the commandments aren’t I? I’m still practicing sin and I can’t enter into the kingdom of God. I have made an idol out of my sins and I am worshiping other gods. We are to love the Lord with all our heart and he will bring it to pass. This is the truth and the truth will set you free. John 8:31-32 &36 If you continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; and ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free. If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed.

Titus 2:11-12 For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men, teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lust, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world; Ungodliness, is not acting like God! What is not acting like God? To act like the nature and character of satan, which is the deeds of the flesh. Deny ungodliness, a form of godliness is ungodliness. Titus 2:13-14 “Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Savior Jesus Christ. Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good words.” Everyone who is looking for the blessed hope is purifying himself, (a wise virgin). He is going to redeem us from every lawless deed and purify us. Redeem and purify go together. He redeems you and he purify s you. If he is not purifying you he is not redeeming you from every lawless deed! That is what Jesus did at Calvary, we have the blood, we have the victory! You cannot get redeemed from every lawless deed that you choose not to give up because you don’t love the Lord with all your heart!! Repentance is turning from it without regret! A worldly sorrow is what we have been taught to say some words and be sorry, it’s a form of godliness.

Titus 3:3-5 For we ourselves also were sometimes foolish, disobedient, deceived, serving divers lusts and pleasures, living in malice and envy, hateful, and hating one another. But after that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward man appeared, not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; It’s not the deeds of righteousness that’s going to save you, but Jesus saved us by the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Ghost. The Holy Spirit brings the word and He starts washing your heart and renewing your mind. If you wash your heart of rebellion, it renews your mind and you think and act more like the Lord. As a result of the Spirit of God washing your heart, and removing selfishness from it, is all you have to do is obey. It’s not you that does it, you can’t do it. If you think you can, you are building another tower into heaven. The Spirit of God removes from your heart all selfishness when you suffer in the flesh, by putting it to death and the result is your going to have a heart that loves God and loves your neighbor as yourself. The branch cannot bear fruit apart from Jesus the true vine and you fulfill the law of God.

Salvation is loving the Lord more than doing any deeds of the flesh, and when you see in the word of God and the Spirit shows you, you are doing something wrong you repent from it, turn away from it, and don’t turn back to it, the result of loving the Lord with all your hearts is going to cause you to obey the commandments of God. Salvation is loving the Lord with all your heart, loving your neighbor as yourself and abiding in the word and in the Lord and enduring to the very end. That is true salvation, not the watered down version that we have gotten from the pulpit for the last 60 years! This is not what they teach today, remember according to the word of God, Sanctification = a pure heart = holiness and then you shall see God! I Cor 6:9-11 Know ye not that the unrighteous (practicing sin) shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, no thieves nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God. And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

by Milt Green

 2011/12/25 20:15

Joined: 2010/4/19
Posts: 447

 Re: Not saved


In the book of Romans (the inspired WORD OF GOD) it says:

For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

Now let's look at another scripture:

"God is not a man, that he should lie, nor a son of man, that he should change his mind. Does he speak and then not act? Does he promise and not fulfill?"

What you are saying in effect is:

I called upon the name of the Lord an I was not saved

Brother if you think that you are someday going to arrive at a place where your thoughts are instantly pure, you mind will cease to be wicked, you will forget all of the nasty things that effected us before we were saved you are VERY badly mistaken. Sure, I see posts on here where people claim that they were instantly delivered from bad thoughts once they 'were truly saved' but I would not hesitate to call them a liar right to their face in person.

Folks have a wonderful time telling you what they were delivered from but what they don't tell you is what they AREN'T delivered from. I was delivered from alcoholism, I have NO DESIRE to drink but what I'm not telling you is I sometimes struggle with the very same things you do, I hear the same lies from the devil and sometimes buy in, but once I recognize that it is in fact the voice of the devil it's easily remedied with a stiff rebuke of the enemy.

I hear the same crap that you do, here's a sampling:

"if you were really saved you would do X"

"if you were really saved you would do Y"

"if you were really saved you would be nicer"

IT'S ALL TRASH and lies.

The same Lord that saved me 16 years ago is the one that I rely on today for salvation, and that salvation is not based on how I feel today, tomorrow or in 2 weeks, it's based on what JESUS DID in the finished work of the cross. That same Savior who saved me then is the same Savior that sees me today, He saw my 'today' the day I was saved and still 'accepted me into the beloved'.

One of the brothers on this forum said something to me about a year ago that changed my life and hopefully it will help you:

On the day that you were saved how many sins did Jesus forgive? ALL OF THEM

On that day, when He looked at you from afar and saw you today how many sins did He forgive you from? ALL OF THEM

When you stand before Him in glory how many sins will He have forgiven? ALL OF THEM

I thank my God every time I remember you. 4 In all my prayers for all of you, I always pray with joy 5 because of your partnership in the gospel from the first day until now, 6 being confident of this, that he who began a good work in you will carry it on to completion until the day of Christ Jesus. -Philippians 1:3-6

The work of completion is not done from the beginning, if it was then there would be no need for something 'to be carried on to completion'. How can something be completed that is already finished? It can't.


But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord.

If we are instantly completed, where does the need for being 'changed from glory to glory' come in? I mean it CLEARLY SAYS we are changed, from 'glory to glory' if we are perfect why do we need to be changed? No, we press on towards perfection, knowing that HE is the author and finisher of our faith. We have one responsibility: to be clay, He is the Potter. Or be a sheep, He is The Shepherd, if He needs us to go 'over there' He will lead us. His grace is always sufficient.

One thing is for certain, if you keep on comparing yourself to others, you will fail. This is the reason that Paul says it's not wise to compare ourselves with others, we have One to compare ourselves with, and His name is Jesus! With that I have encouraging words for you: WE ALL FALL SHORT!! But in His marvelous, wonderful grace He chose us anyway, while we were yet sinners.

I'm not even sure you have ALL of Brainerd's diaries if you did you would see THAT HE HAD THE SAME STRUGGLES THAT YOU ARE, read the beginning of his first diary. If you only have his second work you miss this VERY important first part.

As Christians we keep ourselves from sin, but we RELY on grace.

I am going to pray for you, and I'm going to pray for more people like you, the Lord loves honesty, you are an example to me. Thanks for your wonderful, brutal, honesty.

Who gave that to you? It was the Lord!

Very much love!!

 2011/12/25 23:06Profile

Joined: 2011/4/24
Posts: 210
Toronto, Ontario, Canada

 Re: Not saved

I would say that for myself as well that I am probably not saved as well, due to a sister confronting me yesterday about how she has observed my life and telling me that I'm not a Christian because of my life, and also just being a hypocrite in a lot of the things I do. I realized today that I know a lot of truth and the Bible, and even preach it, yet barely live it. It was really convicting. But now I'm also very dull-hearted and immune to God, I don't know if there is any hope for me left. I can't pray like I use to or even read the word like I use to. The dear sister also said to me that I don't have love, and that is true of my life, as I've been clubbing people on the head with truth, instead of speaking the truth in love. Brethren, please pray for me as well for my salvation, I need to know Christ as He really is. It's been an absolute failure for the last two years.

- Michael Liao

Michael Liao

 2011/12/25 23:08Profile

Joined: 2011/9/30
Posts: 1211


Michael, bibleforlife and anyone else that is not manifesting the life of God in them (bearing fruit), there are many things in modern Christianity that are very confusing and have led many astray from the Life of Christ.

I do want you to give up "trying" to live the Christian life because no one can live it. The Christian life is Christ! Christ is Christianity! Christ is not a book, not a religion, not a set of doctrines. Christianity is the dynamic, personal Spirit of God functioning in man.

Don't give up searching for the truth and if you don't mind, I would like to suggest that you start your journey all over again at square one.

I have recently been set free from many misconceptions relating to "Christianity" and I would like to share with you what I have found.

Anyone of these booklets will be helpful but "Christianity Is Not Religion" is a very good place to start.

Set some time aside and read these books and enjoy your new found freedom and understanding in Christ. And know that He loves you and is for you and if you have never clearly seen this, I am sure you will now. Get ready for LIFE, because it is coming.

There is much hope my brothers, because Christ is alive and for you. The problem is we have had too much religion masquerading as Christ.

May your New Year be very blessed in Him. This is your year.
Galatians 2:20

Jim's writings are the most Christocentric writings I have ever read. I have been reading too many Bibliocentric things and not enough Christocentric and believe me the difference between both is light years. I never would have thought the difference was so vast. I always thought they were the same. His book below, Christianity Is Not Religion will explain it very clearly. I think SI should definitely have a link to Jim's teachings.

I don't have words to explain as of yet how great these teachings by Jim Fowler are. Some other books that have greatly blessed me I have left a short comment by them as I have not read them all yet.

Chicken Bones of Christian Thought - "Excellent"
Christ at Work in You - "Very liberating"
Christianity is NOT Religion - "Brings needed understanding"
Frequently Asked Questions - 160 pages could not put it down.
Commentary on Galatians
Commentary on Hebrews
Commentary on the Four Gospels
Man as God Intended
Ninety-five Theses - "Outstanding"
Old English Bibles
Parodies of Piety - "Truth delivered with humor".
Spirit-union Allows for Soul-rest
TheoLogic - "Awesome"
Union with Christ
What’s That in Your Hand?

 2011/12/26 2:06Profile

Joined: 2005/6/18
Posts: 1481


hi, being saved is not what you do ,it is what He did.

 2011/12/26 8:23Profile

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