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 Will these seem like the good old days in a few years?

Unemployment is really tough now. Believe me I know how hard it is to get a job now in America. We have a president who is not really concerned about it, and what incentive is there for businesses to stop exporting our jobs to China and Mexico? They refuse to stop allowing foreigners to come by the thousands/day in spite of a real unemployment rate of 17%.

Anyway, do any of you put a lot of stock in "The Vison" by David Wilkerson? Here's a statement that seems to be exactly the situation today:

"I see total economic confusion striking Europe first and then affecting Japan, the United States, Canada, and all other nations shortly thereafter.
It is NOT really a depression I see coming-but a recession of such magnitude that it will affect the lifestyle of nearly every wage earner in America and around the world."

The PIIGS countries in Europe are going to default on their debt. It's just a question of when. Then what will happen with the Euro? Japan has a massive national debt that they wont really be able to get out of. The U.S. is soon going to raise it's debt, and we will be in seroius trouble before long. I can see the dominos falling just like Pastor Wilkerson said they would in that vision he had in 1973. How could Wilkerson get a continent right for the first to fall, then an Asian country second, then U.S. third and Canada fourth which still has a relatively small national debt. He predicted accurately the current status of each country and continent. What are the chances of getting a continent right, follwed by 3 countries in the order of their financial condition? The odds against that are extremely high. Anyway, how do you think it will all shake out in a few years? In spite of how tough things are now, will we look back on these as the good ole days?

 2011/7/18 0:24

 Re: Will these seem like the good old days in a few years?

The End of the American Dream

by Thomas Watkins

I’m writing about something sacred to me, and you will understand as I go on. I am 59, and I have been given dreams and visions, along with many other experiences with God since 1972, the year of my salvation and indwelling. In general , I have not shared them, except in a limited way, and that as the Lord has led.

In March, 2003, six years ago , I was in the spirit in a vision.

I saw a most beautiful company of men and women preparing for an event. They were Christians, and fearfully holy, and beautiful. They were dressed in simple and humble attire.

They were not young, nor old. It reminded me of the military days when I and my fellow soldiers would prepare for a mission, gathering material and supplies and strategy. These were the holiest people I have ever imagined. They glowed with Heaven’s Presence, and their eyes were like lamps; emitting light and love. They were frightening.

The scene changed and I saw a multitude of American people , trudging along like the bomb-out of Dresden Germany… with dirty suits, with heads down , homeless, in a crowd that poked along for miles and miles. Children held the hands of parents, trudging along, with a general air of depression and despair. They had lost everything.

Every molecule of the sky and the Earth and the substance of that vision spoke a word….”THE END OF THE AMERICAN DREAM.” I also knew it would center around a “mortgage greed craze.”

The scene changed again, and I was there, watching as another mass of people were trudging along. They were all minorities, mostly black and Hispanics. I then realized that the first group were all white. The difference being that they, the minorities were very, very angry…..riot motivated angry. These crowds stretched for miles. “The End of the American Dream.” was over them all. These too, had lost everything…homes, cars, and all luxuries and possessions: they were in the street.

I can only guess at the numbers…..maybe a total of about 3 million split between both groups. I saw signs of traditional ministries following this group…but without much impact.

The vision ended.

Implications and thoughts.

Firstly, I think the fall of the American economy and dream is permanent. I do not think that we will ever see America rise to the prosperity levels that we saw previous to October 2008. It is over. I could say, “never to rise again.”

Secondly, it is going to get much, much worse. If 3 million people are homeless, then it means that many more were displaced, perhaps 20 to 25 million. The 3 million are just those who have no friends or family to take them in.

Thirdly, the economy will not recover…ever.

The economy is collapsing, along with jobs. We will see the fuller impact beginning the summer of 09′. Renters also will be affected, and perhaps more vulnerable. Everyone has bought into the idea that your CREDIT RATING is the thing that makes you a success. The Lord showed me men in dirty suits, which reads to me that the middle and the upper middle class will also be there among them. The rich, and the nearly rich have acquired debt as a lifestyle, to enjoy and be entitled to the American dream to the fullest. From gourmet Pet food, to the “better colleges”, classy cars, along with the “Prize”…the 5 bedroom brick Tudor semi-mansion in the ‘burbs….the middle class has taken the bait…and who will deliver them?

All believed that America would just go on putting out for ever..and it would never end. It has now.

As I write, the largest reverse migration in American history is happening: Mexican migrants returning to Mexico. In the past several months, over 2 million have returned home to the south, to survive with their families. There is no longer the construction industry. It has vanished, along with the absence of a credit market. The mass exodus continues, and the poor and service industries are always the first to fall.


There are 4 sins that are paramount in the last days; Immorality, Murder, Theft and Sorcery. America was founded in Christian Puritanical beliefs, that spread throughout her government and judicial system, and the fibers of every realm of society. Volumes could, and are written on her demise, but it is suffice to say that America, hand in hand with the freedom to do ANYTHING she likes, or is pleasurable, (has believed) it is our RIGHT: guaranteed by our constitution.

This can be paralleled with ancient Israel as they often drifted the same way…and through out time, the Lord has so dealt with Nations by sending judgment.


The CHURCH is the salt of the Earth, and the American Church has, overall, lost her saltiness, her savor. We have been exposed, uncovered as one loving prosperity, and living and loving such riches as the prior Kings of the Earth knew not. We have willfully believed that happiness, health and prosperity have become our rights! God has ordained that we are the head, and not the tail.

There is no longer a Word about Sin, for there really is no sin, just principles! God is all inclusive, and God is Love. If there is no sin, then there is no repentance, and we are Earth bound.

Of course, we will fly away to more luxury and peace later, but that is in the by and by. The Blood of Jesus is no longer the pillar of our faith..but instead our pillar is the living of a purpose filled life, and that with your best life NOW! Happiness and Prosperity, along with good health to make you live longer and enjoy it, of course.

The end of the matter and conclusion concerning this sordid and unbiblical church is simple. THE CHURCH NO LONGER NEEDS GOD, or HER GLORIOUS MASTER, THE LORD JESUS! He exists only to serve her, like a butler, and to protect her rights, and of course, she shall never suffer.

When this vision is matured, the Church will realize that she does need God. The church will need Him more than she ever believed she would.

Judgment:Immorality. America and pornographic Hollywood, making billions yearly, importing our filth to nations that still blush, not being Christian. We have elevated sodomy to the halls of congress, and marry homosexuals. We teach our children, by law, the rightness of inclusiveness: that this is natural and must be accepted. We sell sex , millions of times a day on our airwaves, and are awash in sexual enhancement products, and endorse public displays of horrific and blasphemous “art forms”.

It is indeed a river of filth, and shows no signs of abating. Watch one minute of VH1 or MTV. This is our legacy.

Judgment: Murder. Over 50 million innocent children taken (alive) from their mothers wombs; that’s one out of six today in America. Don’t worry, God has covered His eyes, and didn’t see. Violence and death, and the “mass murderer”. This was generally unknown in America, with very few exceptions. It is a spirit.

My own brother was murdered, assassinated. The murderer was never brought to man’s justice. The US government does not hesitate to do so either, if it serves our political interest.

Remember KHADAFI?, and his tent in the sand…and his daughters that were blown to bits by an American cruise missile?

Judgment: Theft. I have written in my Bible, “THE BANKING SPIRIT.” Every element of business has morphed into a predator mentality, from the car dealer, to the investment Banker and your local bank, to the mechanic and Neighbor, Fairness, and doing the right thing has been replaced by deception and greed, to profit. It is a jungle out there, and everyone wants to rip you off. Have you ever felt that way? That’s because theft is rampant…

Judgment: Sorcery. Witchcraft and her covens are growing exponentially. Harry Potter, and some 30 TV shows and more cartoons about the occult are feeding our children a steady diet of satanism, not counting the hundreds of dark video games they devour. Well, as long as they are quiet!

The other side of sorcery is DRUGS: We have joyfully embraced drugs for any and all discomfort or pressure or unhappiness. Psychotropic drugs that “calm the nerves”, are casually dubbed “MEDICATION”; PSYCHOLOGICALLY EQUATING IT WITH REAL CURES, like penicillin, or the Polio cure. It is not. they are drugs…dopa!

The medical practice of the Physician has been reduced to a pill pusher…a pill for everything!It is the chief advertising dollar in America. It is estimated that one in six Americans use Marijuana.

Methamphetamine’s are a plague to mid America. Our prisons are bursting, overcrowded two to one , or worse. Thousands are beheaded and murdered today, as we speak, in Mexico over control of the dealing of this evil lust and addiction inside America.

You cannot tell the difference between the Church, and the World….except that possibly the Church doesn’t drink and party as much, and goes to meeting on Sunday.


Hope and Faith

God will provide. He has never forsaken one who has put their trust in Him, never! He has never broken a Promise, never, to any who Love Him, and even to those who call upon His Name!

There is a great division coming however, and it will prove to be a division between those who love Him, or love their own lives more.

How will we respond without prosperity? Will we be, as righteous Job, and still trust and say: “Even though He slay me, yet will I trust in Him!”, or will we be selfish, and despise His chastening, and Him too, when things are no longer? How will we relate to the homeless, the poor?, and especially to Christians that have lost everything? (see Acts 4:32) Will we open or homes, and will we give? Even unto our last cup of meal and oil to cook it with?

Will we give all unto the Lord, no matter the cost, or circumstances? Will we lay our lives down for our brother and sisters, no matter what?..or..will we get all we can, and can all we get? Some will…and the days of Ananias and Sapphira will return again. (see Acts 5:1-11 )

This will end in a purified church. The true Church will be greatly affected, for when we suffer, we stop playing Church, and become the Church.

There will be a shift from institutionalized pew sitters, and the clergy laity model, to the BODY, edifying itself in Love. The “House Church will become the norm, and the professional clergy will dry up for lack of money, and real anointing. The least of the Brethren will become a battle cry, and for those who want Jesus, their compassion’s will abound and increase, even unto abandonment…..and that is what this HOLY company is about.

They will be completely abandoned to Christ, and will impart that spirit. They will take the lead as examples, to minister to a grieving America, and will do so in real Power and Love.

There will again be a difference between the holy and the profane, and it will be obvious.

The catastrophe will be the stepping stone to REVIVAL, but not in the way of REFORMATION. It will be upheaval….a Revolution! It will be a rebirth, a true renewal based on Resurrection Life from Heaven, not reform in Doctrine only.

Many, many will return to Christ, and many will receive Him as Savior, as they behold real Glory and Love. Many will go on in their dead religion, and reject compassion. Many lost will be saved, and there also will be real healing’s and signs, that are indisputable, accompanied by brothers and sisters who want no glory of their own. Holiness will be all about them, and all will see.

This will be an awesome time for those willing to pay the price. We may not have a lot, but the promise is, “God will provide!” - this is a conditional promise however, fulfilled unto those who honor, fear, and Love Him.

Remember these words:


Jesus will become the rise and fall unto many. Many religious people and false Pastors and Prophets will be exposed in this pressure….Many. Many holy will gain Jesus, and true Salvation in this time. There will be those who give all, and truly please their Master. It will be, as the old novel begins, “THE BEST OF TIMES, AND THE WORST OF TIMES.”

The best for those who fall at His feet, and say: “JESUS IS LORD. IT IS HE, AND HE ALONE WHO IS LORD!” - to the rest, it will be the worst.

God himself is in the center of this “Meltdown”, and it is He who is applying the fire!”

Brother Thomas Watkins


 2011/7/18 8:57

 Re: Vision

Thanks brother Tom for sharing the vision that you had from the Lord. The vision I believe. I believe it was from the Lord. But when you get to the "Why?" section of your post, I think even you would admit that it is your interpretation of things and not necessarily from the Lord. Is that correct? And I'm not saying you are right or wrong as to "Why?".

 2011/7/18 10:08

Joined: 2011/6/16
Posts: 183


The Vision was good overall. Bro. David had many good insights from the Lord that have come to pass.

A NT prophet does not "foretell" events. He speaks forth Christ is about the simplest way that I can put it. Many will know what I mean.

If NT prophecy was the same as OT prophecy and NT prophets were judged as OT prophets, then even Bro. David would fail the test, but that is not what NT prophecy is all about.

In Christ,

 2011/7/18 10:22Profile


It is a sobering word. Particularly as Aug.2 approaches. We need to be grounded in Christ.

 2011/7/18 12:10


I think the republicans in Washington, DC will cave into the democrats and our president. The situation in Europe is really much worse. It's like where the U.S. will be in 5 years.

I also think the brother that posted the vision about the poor people may be right. Our best days may in fact be behind us, and they wont be coming back.

 2011/7/18 13:03


It is a sobering word. Particularly as Aug.2 approaches. We need to be grounded in Christ.

While I do believe things will either stay the same or get worse at least for awhile, I also do not put much stock in people's "prophecies and visions".

The economy is cyclical, it has always been that way. There are very real reasons for why it tanked, and why it has not revived yet. These reasons are fixable, the question is "does anyone want to fix it?"

OK... I'll bite... what is Aug 2nd?


 2011/7/18 16:00


August 2nd is my mom's birthday.

 2011/7/18 17:34

Joined: 2011/6/16
Posts: 183


It's politics season. Neither party wants to be blamed for the U.S. getting a lower credit rating or default.

They will play their chess game and make each other sweat and in the end the debt ceiling will be raised, but at what cost to everyday people?

Our best days of outward prosperity may be behind us, but our best days as Servants of the Lord could be in front of us. It is our choice.

In Christ,

 2011/7/18 17:55Profile


Thanks again brother Tom for sharing that vision. And also I agree with your take on things that have happened and will happen in the U.S.

Here's a guy whose financial advice I trust. I worked with him for 2 years. He was a YWAM guy many years ago. He has a free financial newsletter now with over 1 million subscribers:

From John Mauldin:

As I write, Europe is starting to unravel. This is going to be much worse than 2008, at least as far as Europe is concerned, and odds are high that it will be very bad for the US. And the markets are still acting as if the problems in Europe can be resolved. The recent bank stress tests were a joke, as they assumed no Greek or Irish defaults. This simply can’t be. There is a banking crisis of massive proportions in our future.

As Lacy notes, we are testing the economic theories of three (I think von Mises should be added) dead white guys. The dominant theories are being shown to be wrong. The sooner we acknowledge that the better. But don’t hold your breath waiting for the major economic schools to come to grips with their failure.

This is a real problem, and there is just no way to avoid it. I wish I had more positive things to say.

Your trying to figure this out analyst,

John Mauldin, Editor
Outside the Box
[email protected]

 2011/7/19 3:11

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