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Discussion Forum : Devotional Thoughts : How to manipulate God!!!

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Joined: 2009/12/4
Posts: 1860

 How to manipulate God!!!

If you were hoping for some kind of hidden key to find out how to manipulate God into doing what you want Him to do, I am afriad I have misguided you with the title. I will discuss this common misconception that we can by our works manipulate God into doing what we want.

This misconception, though I don't know the origin seems to run like wind amoung many rings of Evangelical and Pentecostal movements. The reason I decided to discuss this was because I was listening to my local Christian radio station and to my dismay they were doing a pledge drive. I appreciate pledge drives on the whole but some of things these people say to get you to give is just ridiculous.

Radio Guy-"God wants to do something new and exciting today but He wants you to do something new by giving, giving Him the opportunity to do something new and creative in your life."

These are the kind of statements I dispise and can't stand, it plays on the poor unfortunate soul that maybe going through a spiritual rut and is desperate for God, He decides to give wanting to see something new and exciting. My rebuttal to this is simply I am not against pledge drives but this has got to stop. God is infinite in all things including His will. WE can't manipulate this His will, will be done one way or the other.

What would be a more appropriate phraseology? I believe "Give according to the Spirit's leading, infact follow the Spirit every day trusting in Christ whether something new and exciting happens or not." Now I haven't been as faithful to following the Spirit as one ought my faith is still mustard seed sized however from what little experience I do have when following the Spirit in most if not all cases something New and Exciting happened to me.

Another thing that gets my goat is giving to change the blessing of God toward you, things are rough and finiances down, along with your luck. SO GIVE God will change your luck in a licky split. He'll prosper you right up and you can rest assure He will bless you infinitely. The problem with this is God has already blessed you infinitely that is how He does things, if you are in Christ you are infinitely blessed and accepted.

God blesses according to His will and His blessing doesn't always look material in nature, you maybe going through struggles so that Christ can bless you with an extra helping of trust or patience. But Brother or Sister rest assured Christ Jesus takes care of His Children. Thinking you can or have to manipulate God to bless you only shows how little your faith is. Give according to the Spirit expecting nothing in return, Why? Because GOD IS WORTHY, PERIOD, POINT BLANK.

Sorry I needed to get these thoughts out of my head, I don't look to offend but to tear down a stronghold that has stood for a long time especially where I live, still standing actually. Ultimately my point is this Give according to your faith IF the Spirit leads you to Give, and not because you want God to do something but because you Love God and He is worthy of your gift.

God Bless,

Matthew Guldner

 2010/10/21 23:13Profile

Joined: 2006/5/22
Posts: 2680
Nottingham, England

 Re: How to manipulate God!!!

It doesn't take much to realise we can't manipulate God.

And no one has a monopoly on Him either.

If our giving is done simply to look for a return, our motive is corrupt, to say the least.

Luke 6v38, 'Give and it shall be given to you...'

Scripture tells us that God loves a cheerful giver. There should be joy when we give, not grudgingly, 2 Cor 9v7.

Personally, I don't listen to these people, or give to them. I will only give to ministries I trust.

As for the new and exciting line, or lie, it's amazing how easily people are taken in by this. But since it appeals to our flesh, we will gladly listen. Tie it in with God's name and you have a winner.

Sad but true.

Let our giving, and all we do, be for God's glory, the salvation of men, and the furtherance of the gospel.

God bless.

 2010/10/22 3:42Profile

Joined: 2010/8/30
Posts: 449
Paradise, California

 Re: How to manipulate God!!!

Give according to your faith IF the Spirit leads you to Give

Yes, Spirit Led giving! What a joy it is to give under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit!


 2010/10/22 5:14Profile

Joined: 2010/10/21
Posts: 14

 Re: How to manipulate God!!!

You hate the "lie" because you are Christ Jesus' sheep! It is so amazing when you go to all these "what God has for you churches", and actually find folks sitting in there. I wonder how they expect to grow with the notion that God is still going to do something after he has given christ to die for us. How arrogant and ungrateful!!! Everything God "has done", WAS (not will be done) done in and through Christ, and that our only blessing is Jesus Christ plus nothing period. If Jesus is not enough for any of these "so called followers", if there is still something missing after we have become children of God, then it means Christs work on the cross is irrelivant. All that we recieve from the Spirit, is already in Jesus and it is all Spiritual! You hear them talk about "all spiritual blessings in heavenly places", then interprete that to mean money and cars coming your way if you give money!! It is so wrong! Money and cars can not be found in the realm of the spirit, so they do not apply to spiritual blessings in heavenlies.

Take note that in the old testament, when God made promises he said "I will do this", refering to what he will do in the future that has not been done, in the new testament, Jesus said "I am" (refering to what God had promised he 'will do'), he himself was the fulfilment of Gods promise, and in the despensation of penticost you hear Pual saying "he has done", not "he will do" all over again. That which was promised has been given in and through Jesus. Even if we have not seen the end of it, in the realms of eternity, "it is finished", done!

"According as his divine power "hath" (past tense) given unto us all things that [pertain] unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:"-2 Peter 1:3

"Blessed [be] the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy "hath"(hath not will) begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,"- 1 Peter 1:3

"Now he that "hath" wrought us for the selfsame thing [is] God, who also hath given unto us the earnest of the Spirit."-2 Corinthians 5:5

So you see that it is a very unscriptural notion to hold that "God is going to do something". if you do something for him. Our business is to do what he has commanded period, he rewards us with his presence!

Only thing Jesus says we should ask for is the Spirit of God! And by the power of the same Spirit, we are led to give and we give out of the freedom provided for us to do so by the very same Spirit!

The "How to manipulate God" doctrine, is predicated on spiritual pride. Some of these people need to ask God to give them a revelation of his awesome might, so that they can become humble in his presence. I don't know from whence such thoughts to manipulate God comes from, it is surely not from Gods Spirit!

 2010/10/22 6:28Profile

Joined: 2009/12/4
Posts: 1860


Does anyone know the start of this "Manipulation Doctrine" I am guessing it was at the beginning, infact I know it was Paul tells us in 1 Timothy 6:4-8

"1Ti 6:4 He is proud, knowing nothing, but doting about questions and strifes of words, whereof cometh envy, strife, railings, evil surmisings, 1Ti 6:5 Perverse disputings of men of corrupt minds, and destitute of the truth, supposing that gain is godliness: from such withdraw thyself. 1Ti 6:6 But godliness with contentment is great gain. 1Ti 6:7 For we brought nothing into this world, and it is certain we can carry nothing out. 1Ti 6:8 And having food and raiment let us be therewith content."

So I guess this is the origin funny how so many prosperity people ignore this very verse. The Word of Faith movement even states the more faith you have the more stuff you have, and if you don't have stuff then your faith is too small. this line of thinking brings about Condemnation when the Lord doesn't "bless" them like they think He ought.

Matthew Guldner

 2010/10/22 10:05Profile

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