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Lysa
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Joined: 2008/10/25
Posts: 3421
This world is not my home anymore.

 Re: areadymind


I liked what Areadymind mind stated: "Daniel chapter nine is what we do codek...we pray prayers of repentance for our wayward people, even if we are not involved with it ourselves. Daniel received vision from God when he repented on behalf of his own people, though his own sin was never mentioned."

This is the most merciful thing I've ever read in the many topics about homosexuality on sermonindex. Thank you for posting this, areadymind.


_________________
Lisa

 2010/4/16 6:17Profile









 Re: Failing the GRACE OF GOD!





"It seems to be a move to actually spiritualize and turn sin into a virtue. It is paganism via the word of God...truly the scriptures are being wrested to destruction."...Areadymind...


Your post was so good Areadymind, I considered just a bump...but I wanted to point out this one issue though,; the unthinkable;

That we could be so deluded as to anoint Sin as a virtue. It's shocking, if we consider it.It is as though that the wicked have discovered a new avenue of GRACE, and are proudly trumpeting it as revelation.


"I'm gay and it's good!", "I'm a Christian New ager."...or I'm all inclusive. My God is bigger than your hateful bigotry!" Thereby , all religions, and humane works are of God, and lead to God!...and God is love! How dare you say that I am lost in Hell!"


and then, inevitably;...."Christians whom hold to a literal interpretation of scripture are becoming a hiss and a byword more and more." [ Areadymind..]


We are sneered at, hated, and despised more as each day passes. I think that the open door is the twisting of the doctrine of the Grace of God, combined with a humanistic apparition of God's love.


When viewed outside of Scripture, we must interpret life within our selfish and lust filled ambitions, and to survive, mold the Holy Creator into an image akin to our own total depravity.


Just like the Mormon doctrine of the Father fornicating with his harems in heaven, and birthing spiritual children into earth..[ thereby justifying 5 wives for each man, and the rape of many a budding teenage girl...via "marriage"..]; so the emergent "grace" filled church has created a similar passage for all sodomites to practice their abominations sanctified before all.


god is love, after all.....


Hebrews 12:13-15 (King James Version)

13. "And make straight paths for your feet, lest that which is lame be turned out of the way; but let it rather be healed.

14. Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord:

15. Looking diligently lest any man fail of the grace of God; lest any root of bitterness springing up trouble you, and thereby many be defiled;"


The scripture also makes it clear that we can..

"FAIL THE GRACE OF GOD!"....and must be holy, as He is, to fellowship Him. Otherwise, He can and will cut us off.



 2010/4/16 13:29
Areadymind
Member



Joined: 2009/5/15
Posts: 1042
Pacific Ocean

 Re: BrotherTom

It is intriguing Tom, that you quoted Hebrews 12:15...
The following is more personal testimony than it has directly to do with why I posted the thread, though I think the concept links to the musicians story.

You made me think back again to my original story about the Spirit of the age and how when I was under my own deception, there was a very direct linkage to bitterness that had crept into my heart. At the time I was angry to a degree with a particular group of believers whom I felt then, and still feel today (even though I have completely forgiven them) as if they had wronged me inadvertently. My own spiritualization of sin did have a linkage to this bitterness. Praise God for His endless mercy that He delivered me from this gall that I was in. Bitterness has severed many walks with God.

I cannot count how many people whom I have known over the years who allowed just a little bit of bitterness to creep in and before you know it they were justifying their sin and in a place of hatred of other believers. Then...they just disappeared.

Quote:
That we could be so deluded as to anoint Sin as a virtue. It's shocking, if we consider it.It is as though that the wicked have discovered a new avenue of GRACE, and are proudly trumpeting it as revelation.



So true Tom...especially the idea of proudly trumpeting it as revelation. I think this concept has been expressed in some of the books of this X-religeneration.

This is exactly why I think that the book of Jude is so incredibly important (I know I have posted this idea like I am kicking a dead horse on this forum...but I will one more time) and that preachers need to be preaching the message Jude talked about. Especially how he starts the epistle after his "disclaimer" in verse three. (It is a total distraction that many use verse three of Jude for the idea of apologetics...Jude is not talking AT ALL about defending the faith against Buddhism, Islam, the occult, fill in the blank with other religions etc...he is talking about those amongst our ranks that seethe with a naturally rebellious spirit, whom then foment into outright falsehood. Jude is about a battle within the kingdom.)

I have always like this quote from Marcus Tullius Cicero, and I think it applies to this conversation. Even though he meant it politically...I rob it and apply it spiritually “A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murderer is less to fear. The traitor is the plague.”

"For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ." Jude 4

It was these words that began to completely change my life and saved me from being a cultural christian. God used this passage to radically open my eyes to what was going on around me. After I had spent months meditating on this passage of scripture (as well as the whole book of Jude,) I became cognizant of this style of teaching. I started to hear it everywhere. I looked back over my own discipleship and recognized that I had been subtly taught this. Not intentionally, at least I do not think it was so, but I learned it nonetheless. Because of current traditions and the way the gospel is so often presented, we are not taught what grace is in its full sense. We have been taught well what it is in a partial sense, but I think that a partial sense is destructive. Grace is more than just forgiveness, if you don't think so then wrap your head around this..."But grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and forever. Amen." 2Peter 3:18. If we are to grow in "forgiveness" then I guess I have to sin more, for how else can I grow in grace if grace is unmerited forgiveness, or favor?

I am not setting up a straw man, this is how I have been taught over the years to understand grace...it is almost always presented as God's unmerited favor, forgiveness, and love regardless of what we do. And to an extent it is. I just have come to see grace as a billion times more than that...it is forgiveness with capacity. Grace is like a heavenly capacitor, charged to an infinite asymptote and released through Christs blood from the cross, through the Spirit. It not only saves us but gives us the voltage we need for perfection. It is the answer to Galatians rhetorical question, "Are ye so foolish, having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect in the flesh?" HEAVEN'S NOOOO!!! We are perfected through faith in the same thing that saved us to start with, the resurrection Power of Christ. Grace is so much bigger. So much more vast, the grace of Calvary is the very wellspring of God's nature...the more we grow in this grace...the less distinction we find between our nature and God's nature. It is the destruction of the flaming swords preventing entrance to Eden in the final sense, but certainly restores fellowship in the now sense. Eye has not seen...ear has not heard...

It is my own personal opinion, and is not a hill I am willing to die on, but I see Jude as being a prophetic epistle...even down to its placement in the bible. Right before the Revelation...it is the last word on doctrine prior to the Apocalypse...and I do not see that as a coincidence. It seems to me as if Jude is our line in the sand during the beginning of sorrows. As it would seem to me that Jude almost saw our day...he was so tuned into the idea that men had, and were going to corrupt God's grace and make it into something that benefits those who are only...pathetically...wretchedly... natural. "But these speak evil of those things which they know not: but what they know naturally, as brute beasts, in those things they corrupt themselves." Jude 10

The question for me has never been, should I show mercy to a sinner. Christ showed us that we are always to go low and show compassion on one caught in the act of adultery, which was the only time we ever saw him write anything. Which makes that event significant even if we do not know what he wrote.

The thing that is a struggle in so many of our circles today is brute beasts. Too many of us know these kinds of believers...and often times it is the rule and not the exception that they are using the grace of God to maintain a natural state. I only know this because I was one of them. Praise God he opens blind eyes. At the end of the Epistle there are two solutions to this mass deception from wicked men, "And of some have compassion, making a difference; And others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire; hating even the garment spotted by the flesh." Jude 22-23 People whom have been swayed by this kind of deception need either compassion...or fire, and I think only the Spirit of God can give us the knowledge as to which is needed. It is not something we can play Russian Roulette with.

Sorry for the long post...


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Jeremiah Dusenberry

 2010/4/16 18:06Profile
KathleenP
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Joined: 2008/4/3
Posts: 228
Maine

 Re:

Wonderful and thoughtful post Areadymind. It takes great amounts of prayer and wisdom to address this sort of subject, although I know many will criticize it to justify their own lusts.

The words may be strong, but there are so many that simply drowning before our eyes because they idolize these musicians even above their own pastors. I have always feared that the music that was introduced into the churches was planted by the fallen cherub himself.

I am so saddened by the parents who will someday stand before God and give an account of why they did not rule their houses well and deliver their children safely to the cross. These are perilous times for sure.

I remember being taken aback when someone that was involved heavily in satanism and then was saved, exposed the fact that trained witches and wizards would plant themselves in churches to infect the body with sin.

They creep in unawares, and with subtilty, introduce false doctrine and rebellion. They know the Word far more than most Christians do because they are literally trained to cause the saints to fall. If they appeared outright evil and sinful, they would never be received, but they are charismatic and know how to gain the praises of the congregation.

Yes, I so believe the epistle of Jude is prophetic as well as II Thessalonians, II Peter, and James to mention a few. If we read watered down versions of the Word, and spend no time in brokenness and prayer, we greatly risk being deceived.

I have visited this young woman's website, and done some research which convinces me that she simply does not know the Lord. There isn't even a hint of anguish or shame for the sin she is in. Worst of all, she is performing in the "Lilith Tour" this year. Look that word up and it's Hebrew meaning, and tell me a professing Christian could do this to our Lord.

Somehow, we have forgotten who we are insulting and mocking first and foremost. They have turned the truth of God into a lie and convinced people that it is okay to sin so that "good may come". God forbid.

He is a great and dreadful God and now we fear the opinions of others, and are not willing to stand in the gap.

Dear saints, how grieved our Lord must be that we shrink when others challenge His Word by their deeds. I do not believe in screaming and hollering, but I truly believe in addressing these things with great soberness of mind.

Let us pray for those that are bold enough to hold fast to sound doctrine. May the time come when God will be able to show Himself strong on behalf of those whose hearts are perfect towards Him.


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Kathleen

 2010/4/16 19:52Profile
ginnyrose
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Joined: 2004/7/7
Posts: 7497
Mississippi

 Re:

Quote:
"Lilith Tour" this year. Look that word up and it's Hebrew meaning, and tell me a professing Christian could do this to our Lord.



ABSOLUTELY NOT! This is hideous, demonic...No one can embrace this mindset and be a follower of God!

SICK!!! almost makes one vomit!

Ok, so I respoded emotionally - good thing there are people who can think rationally and inform others why this thing is so ungodly...God bless you.

ginnyrose


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Sandra Miller

 2010/4/16 20:06Profile









 Re: The black days of LOT.....

by ginnyrose on 2010/4/16

"Lilith Tour" this year. Look that word up and it's Hebrew meaning, and tell me a professing Christian could do this to our Lord."

ginnyrose said;

ABSOLUTELY NOT! This is hideous, demonic...No one can embrace this mindset and be a follower of God!

SICK!!! almost makes one vomit!

Ok, so I responded emotionally - good thing there are people who can think rationally and inform others why this thing is so ungodly...God bless you.

ginnyrose


And your emotional outburst echo's the Lord Jesus. Remember it was he who said he would vomit some out of His mouth...WHY?.. They make Him sick too.


Lilith , in the ancient world, is the queen of lust and magic. She , being so, is also the queen of the unclean. I remind you that as Satan does, so this demon does yet exist. To dedicate music to it, and a tour, would denote a reprobate mind; total depravity. This lady is absolutely reprobate, having a seared conscience, to do so.


In a way, the thread has come full circle. THE DAYS OF LOT!....Where the ancient world was being taken over the second time..[ after the flood..] by Satan, and the mystery Satan worship of Babel...[Babylon]. So again, we see Babel raise her monstrous head, as in the Days of Lot.


Even then, the Lord chose a righteous SEED to overcome, and a Righteous son, Abraham, to carry Him against all odds. There would have never been a LOT in Canaan, if there were not an Abraham. Isaac was impossible. Impossible to be born, and highly improbable he would survive. The promise, and the intervention["God will provide father!"...Isaac's proclamation while on the alter...]


Black is, and always has been the color of Mystery Babylon; the color of the witch. Today, we again see the days of Lot. It is the color of New Age, the color of One world under one god, and it is not the Lord Jesus. One World government, one world ruler, who is worshipped by all. I see the Black horse; Revelation 6:5

"When He opened the third seal, I heard the third living creature say, “Come and see.” So I looked, and behold, a black horse, and he who sat on it had a pair of scales in his hand."


This is but one of the spirits unleashed upon the earth in the end times. I believe that the scales denoting prices is not famine, [ though there will be famines..] but a world wide price fixing, as the citizens of the world under the anti-christ are all fed equally, and with the same cost...[ also there will be a one world currency..]


The days of Lot. Satan almost won again, but the Lord decided to put an end to the second wave and rained down fire and brimstone. The black horse, however, will appear to win....TO TEST ALL THE INHABITANTS OF THE EARTH!


EVERY nation kindred and tribe will be under that power before it's over, with some of the remnant here and there, protected....while others of us are murdered and hunted, for refusing to cooperate.


In the end, those who believe in the resurrection of Jesus, will gain life...either by His coming, or by enduring through death. "Even though He slay me; Yet will I trust in Him!", declared righteous Job.


Many have fallen away, back into the snares of the World, the Flesh, and the Devil...just as it has always been. We must remain faithful, and as Noah, warn others...that there is a flood a'comin'!
HalleluJah!

 2010/4/17 11:05
KathleenP
Member



Joined: 2008/4/3
Posts: 228
Maine

 Re:

Thanks Brothertom. It is no wonder that this nation is referred to as Sodom and Egypt.


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Kathleen

 2010/4/18 6:53Profile
MaryJane
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Joined: 2006/7/31
Posts: 3057


 Re:

I have been thinking about this thread for a couple of days now and wondering about something. It seems Jennifer Knapp has said that she was always this way, that she just pretended not to be "who" she is before and I think I read something along those lines about Ray Boltz as well. My question is music that they did before, should it be listened to knowing that they are living in open rebellion to God and in sin? I was thinking that all of it should be thrown out but wonder what others think? Was the christian music they wrote and sang about before ever really from the Lord or was all of it just a lie??
I myself am often shocked at how easy it is to be deceived. I keep telling my children you must be in the Bible and have daily fellowship with the Lord, you must know His voice because the enemy is always waiting to try to use and opportunity to draw us away from the Lord.

God Bless
mj

 2010/4/18 12:06Profile
Areadymind
Member



Joined: 2009/5/15
Posts: 1042
Pacific Ocean

 Re:

MJ Said...

"It seems Jennifer Knapp has said that she was always this way, that she just pretended not to be "who" she is before and I think I read something along those lines about Ray Boltz as well."

I would be curious to see a link or something where she said that...although I got that implication in the article that I posted in the first place and kind of derived that attitude myself just from some of the other stuff I read. There are many "Christian" bands I no longer listen to because their music is just plain filled with so much compromise and beastlyness that I mostly only listen to worship music or instrumental anymore. However, that is only me and has no bearing on anyone.

However MJ...this is an issue of conscience. If listening to her early album, which if I remember right, was pretty right on, causes you to sear your conscience in any way or harden you to being sensitive to the Spirit then by all means throw that meat sacrificed to Idols out on the street. However if you are ignorant of the light of truth, and it is simply edifying then I guess don't become un-ignorant.

However, I would lean toward throwing the worshipers of Diana into confusion, Acts 19:29. In such a way as to hear them say that we, "ought to be quite and do nothing rashly." As the town-clerk of Ephesus told Paul. This comes from being people who simply preaches the gospel in the Power of the Holy Spirit so that those who hear it are full-on confronted by their idolatry. The casting out of Idols and garbage linked to Idolatry is a fruit of the gospel reformation in peoples lives.

This sermon [url=https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/mydownloads/singlefile.php?lid=10843&commentView=itemComments]A Time to Cry[/url] by David Legge, was the sermon that really hooked me into this website. I had randomly subscribed to the classics podcast because I found it on itunes looking for Tozer sermons. If you have not listened to it yet I could not recommend it more. I weep when I listen to this. And have heard it probably ten times now. David Legge is mourning over the fact that the sheep of God are smoking in God's anger because of the fact that the wicked have taken over the house of God. He gives a gut-wrenching, heart-felt exposition from Psalm 74 that speaks to this whole discussion very well. Take time to give it a listen...

Hope that helps MJ...if not, sorry.

In Christ.

-Jeremiah


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Jeremiah Dusenberry

 2010/4/18 21:26Profile
MaryJane
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Joined: 2006/7/31
Posts: 3057


 Re:

In my post I said that Jennifer Knapp said she had always been this way and I wrote that as if it was a direct quote. I worded my post incorrectly and should have taken more care. What she said was she hoped that people would give her a chance as she breaks away from the yoke of being something she just can't be. She did talk about relationships that she had with women when she was in college that she was admonished about even though they were not physical.
Just wanted to clear that up, from the many articles out there I do think this is something she has known or had in her life for some time, it is not a new revelation for her, that was my understanding at least.

I am not the one who listened to her music actually it was my son. He told me though that he does not feel right in listening to her music any longer, but to be fair he also said he has not really listened to her stuff in awhile.
He was sorry to hear that she is so lost and we will both be praying for her.

God bless
mj

 2010/4/18 22:04Profile





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