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fieldlaborer
Member
Joined: 2009/4/20
Posts: 30
| | American or Christian? | | [url=http://www.voe.org/index.php?option=com_wrapper&view=wrapper&Itemid=91]Perry Stone[/url]
I was watching Perry Stone's MannaFest broadcast and heard him say there are times we need separate being a Christian from being an American. Something seems wrong with that statement, what do you think?
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 2010/2/22 13:21 | Profile |
fieldlaborer
Member
Joined: 2009/4/20
Posts: 30
| | Re: American or Christian? | | Note: You have to watch the video to see the context the statement is made in. I took it as him saying there are times we need to lay our Christianity aside to be an American. |
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| 2010/2/22 13:45 | Profile |
sermonindex
Moderator
Joined: 2002/12/11
Posts: 39795
Canada
Online! | | Re: | | Quote:
I was watching Perry Stone's MannaFest broadcast and heard him say there are times we need separate being a Christian from being an American. Something seems wrong with that statement, what do you think?
Actually I believe he is wrong. We have to 100% of the time realize we are not american, canadian or any other country are allegiance is the kingdom of God. God is not here to bless our countries because we as Christians are in them but His heart is for His Church (spiritual).
Jesus said my "kingdom is not of this earth." - That is the kingdom we are a part of.
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SI Moderator - Greg Gordon
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| 2010/2/22 13:51 | Profile |
MaryJane
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Joined: 2006/7/31
Posts: 3057
| | Re: | | Quote:
Actually I believe he is wrong. We have to 100% of the time realize we are not american, canadian or any other country are allegiance is the kingdom of God. God is not here to bless our countries because we as Christians are in them but His heart is for His Church (spiritual). Jesus said my "kingdom is not of this earth." - That is the kingdom we are a part of.
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Greg I agree with you completely. I am a Christian who happens to live in the United States while I am here. I am not a Christian first and American second(for me this is a divided heart) I am a Christian first and last, I happen to be occupying space in the US until the Lord calls me to be with Him. While here I will obey the laws of the land and pray for those around me and who are in position of authority but for me I want to be about His Kingdom, that is my home, my native land:)
God Bless
maryjane |
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| 2010/2/22 14:00 | Profile |
iansmith
Member
Joined: 2006/3/22
Posts: 963
Wheaton, IL
| | Re: American or Christian? | | [b]But our citizenship is in heaven[/b], and from it we await a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ, who will transform our lowly body to be like his glorious body, by the power that enables him even to subject all things to himself. (Philippians 3:20-21)
I was born in America, but my citizenship is in heaven! We will not be singing 'God bless America' around the thrown; instead we will be crying out "Holy is the Lamb that was slain!"
We need to stop making our nation or political parties into idols. American Evangelicalism has been hijacked by a political party and has hindered the church from being an effective witness in these dark times.
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Ian Smith
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| 2010/2/22 16:01 | Profile |
ccchhhrrriiisss
Member
Joined: 2003/11/23
Posts: 4779
| | Re: | | Hello...
I believe that we can be a Christian AND an American...just like I can be a father/husband and a son/brother.
The same man who said: Quote:
[b]But our citizenship is in heaven[/b], and from it we await a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ, who will transform our lowly body to be like his glorious body, by the power that enables him even to subject all things to himself. (Philippians 3:20-21)
...also said...
Quote:
25 And as they bound him with thongs, Paul said unto the centurion that stood by, Is it lawful for you to scourge a man that is a Roman, and uncondemned?
26 When the centurion heard that, he went and told the chief captain, saying, Take heed what thou doest: for this man is a Roman.
27 Then the chief captain came, and said unto him, [b]Tell me, art thou a Roman? He said, Yea.[/b]
28 And the chief captain answered, With a great sum obtained I this freedom. And Paul said, But I was free born.
29 Then straightway they departed from him which should have examined him: and the chief captain also was afraid, after he knew that he was a Roman, and because he had bound him.
Acts 22:25-29
Paul stated emphatically that he was a Roman citizen. Yet, he was the apostle that took the Gospel to the Gentiles throughout the "Roman world."
Our allegiance, of course, is to God first. However, God has, in His good purpose, allowed us to be born in the nation of our temporary citizenship. I can do the work of an evangelist in this temporary citizenship even as I hold a secular job in order to take care of the needs of my family, the poor and those in the Body of Christ. Ultimately, my desire as a Christian in America is not that people sing [i]God bless America[/i] -- but to get people in America to choose to bless God.
Personally, I see nothing wrong with paying my taxes...driving on roads paid for by taxes...or petitioning elected officials in the government (or even unjust judges) about how they might better spend those taxes. I do not believe that this is "unspiritual" (in a sinful sense of the word) any more than it is a civil duty as I realize that God raises up nations, governments and principalities as a "minister of God to thee for good" (Romans 13:4-5).
There is a danger of making an idol out of political systems...or political parties. However, there is also a danger of raising a voice in error too. We need to pray to God for the wisdom on when and how to speak or recognize such things. After all, we are pilgrims and ambassadors of God to this temporary world.
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Christopher
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| 2010/2/22 16:44 | Profile |
wind_blows
Member
Joined: 2009/1/4
Posts: 353
| | Re: | | Quote:
However, there is also a danger of raising a voice in error too. We need to pray to God for the wisdom on when and how to speak or recognize such things. After all, we are pilgrims and ambassadors of God to this temporary world.
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What did you mean by this if you don't mind me asking:)
love in Him
Ellie |
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| 2010/2/22 16:50 | Profile |
ccchhhrrriiisss
Member
Joined: 2003/11/23
Posts: 4779
| | Re: | | Hi wind_blows...
There are times in which I have seen fellow believers raise their voices and speak with absolutes in regard to any sort of involvement in the nation of their temporary citizenship. There have even been believers who spoke out against government authorities -- even to the extent of dismissing the faith of men or women who work in government.
Is this what God has called us to?
If we are going to lift our voices as the Spirit leads...and indicate our words as such...then we need to make certain that it is the Spirit of God who is actually leading us to speak. This is especially true if we attempt to speak with "spiritual authority" and express such things with in the form of an "absolute."
I hope that this clears up what I meant a little better. We should not be afraid of speaking out in regard to the Truth. However, we should still be "slow to speak" when it comes to things that might have a little of our own intellect mingled in those words. We must be able to distinguish between the holy and the profane.
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Christopher
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| 2010/2/22 17:00 | Profile |
| | Re: | | Sermonindex writes....................
"Actually I believe he is wrong. We have to 100% of the time realize we are not american, canadian or any other country are allegiance is the kingdom of God. God is not here to bless our countries because we as Christians are in them but His heart is for His Church (spiritual).
Jesus said my "kingdom is not of this earth." - That is the kingdom we are a part of."
Amen brother..........Frank |
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| 2010/2/22 17:54 | |
| | Re: | | iansmith writes.....
"I was born in America, but my citizenship is in heaven! We will not be singing 'God bless America' around the thrown; instead we will be crying out "Holy is the Lamb that was slain!"
We need to stop making our nation or political parties into idols. American Evangelicalism has been hijacked by a political party and has hindered the church from being an effective witness in these dark times."
Amen brother, I totaly agree.........Frank |
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| 2010/2/22 17:56 | |
