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 Any humanism with a political makeover here?

I haven't decided completely but rather am just wondering. It's just been released and many are signing it. Someone once said he didn't like the idea of intelligent design because all it said about God was that there was an intelligent designer out there. It didn't identify or name him. Who would introduce their wife for example as just "this is my wife"? This document only speaks of nature's God without any real specificity on who this deity is. That raises interesting questions about the founding of this country. But that isn't the only part of the document that gives me some misgivings. Is there something or better still someone beyond principles and ideas we need to return to? I'm just wondering out loud on this Sat morning.


The Mount Vernon Statement

Constitutional Conservatism: A Statement for the 21st Century

We recommit ourselves to the ideas of the American Founding. Through the Constitution, the Founders created an enduring framework of limited government based on the rule of law. They sought to secure national independence, provide for economic opportunity, establish true religious liberty and maintain a flourishing society of republican self-government.

These principles define us as a country and inspire us as a people. They are responsible for a prosperous, just nation unlike any other in the world. They are our highest achievements, serving not only as powerful beacons to all who strive for freedom and seek self-government, but as warnings to tyrants and despots everywhere.

Each one of these founding ideas is presently under sustained attack. In recent decades, America’s principles have been undermined and redefined in our culture, our universities and our politics. The selfevident truths of 1776 have been supplanted by the notion that no such truths exist. The federal government today ignores the limits of the Constitution, which is increasingly dismissed as obsolete and irrelevant.

Some insist that America must change, cast off the old and put on the new. But where would this lead — forward or backward, up or down? Isn’t this idea of change an empty promise or even a dangerous deception?

The change we urgently need, a change consistent with the American ideal, is not movement away from but toward our founding principles. At this important time, we need a restatement of Constitutional conservatism grounded in the priceless principle of ordered liberty articulated in the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution.

The conservatism of the Declaration asserts self-evident truths based on the laws of nature and nature’s God. It defends life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. It traces authority to the consent of the governed. It recognizes man’s self-interest but also his capacity for virtue.

The conservatism of the Constitution limits government’s powers but ensures that government performs its proper job effectively. It refines popular will through the filter of representation. It provides checks and balances through the several branches of government and a federal republic.

A Constitutional conservatism unites all conservatives through the natural fusion provided by American principles. It reminds economic conservatives that morality is essential to limited government, social conservatives that unlimited government is a threat to moral self-government, and national security conservatives that energetic but responsible government is the key to America’s safety and leadership role in the world.

A Constitutional conservatism based on first principles provides the framework for a consistent and meaningful policy agenda.

It applies the principle of limited government based on the
rule of law to every proposal.

It honors the central place of individual liberty in American politics and life.

It encourages free enterprise, the individual entrepreneur, and economic reforms grounded in market solutions.

It supports America’s national interest in advancing freedom
and opposing tyranny in the world and prudently considers what we can and should do to that end.

It informs conservatism’s firm defense of family, neighborhood,community, and faith.

If we are to succeed in the critical political and policy battles ahead, we must be certain of our purpose.

We must begin by retaking and resolutely defending the high ground of America’s founding principles.

February 17, 2010


Edwin Meese, former U.S. Attorney General under President Reagan

Wendy Wright, president of Concerned Women for America

Edwin Feulner, Jr., president of the Heritage Foundation

Lee Edwards, Distinguished Fellow in Conservative Thought at the Heritage Foundation, was present at the Sharon Statement signing.

Tony Perkins, president of the Family Research Council

Becky Norton Dunlop, president of the Council for National Policy

Brent Bozell, president of the Media Research Center

Alfred Regnery, publisher of the American Spectator

David Keene, president of the American Conservative Union

David McIntosh, co-founder of the Federalist Society

T. Kenneth Cribb, former domestic policy adviser to President Reagan

Grover Norquist, president of Americans for Tax Reform

William Wilson, President, Americans for Limited Government

Elaine Donnelly, Center for Military Readiness

Richard Viguerie, Chairman, ConservativeHQ.com

Kenneth Blackwell, Coalition for a Conservative Majority

Colin Hanna, President, Let Freedom Ring

Kathryn J. Lopez, National Review


We the undersigned join in our support of the guiding principles of The Mount Vernon Statement.

Current count: more than 24,500 signers.


_________________
David Winter

 2010/2/20 11:03Profile
TrueWitness
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Joined: 2006/8/10
Posts: 536


 Re: Any humanism with a political makeover here?

There is a reason why intelligent design does not specify God as being the designer. This is because once you identify God as the designer, you are espousing religious ideology which will have ZERO chance of being taught in schools. If you can get people to admit that life was intelligently designed, it is only logical that only God could have done it. So I perfectly understand and support the intelligent design movement. They are Christians and not secular humanists. But the argument has to start with nature and show that only God could have done it, rather than starting with God. Unbelievers will always reject God as a starting premise.

 2010/2/20 11:13Profile
docs
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Joined: 2006/9/16
Posts: 2222


 Re: I hear what you're saying

At the risk of running a rabbit trail that diverts away from the document I shared, I hear what you're saying. I wasn't implying those advocating intelligent design are not Christians. There's somewhat of a controversy surrounding the presentation of intelligent design though. The phrase you used - "rather than starting with God" - is where the debate probably finds its largest point of disagreement. The Bible begins with "in the beginning God." Then it explains nature in this context instead of presenting nature and letting it logically lead to God. Many say the argument doesn't always have to begin with nature. But having said that, I'm not an expert and can't be a judge. Those people are trying and I'm just mentioning what some of the objections are.

But my main point was to ask whether the document I shared might be seen as being part humanism with a political make over? If analyzed from the point of foundational Biblical belief and theology where would it come out?

Blessings to you this day.


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David Winter

 2010/2/20 11:36Profile
sojourner7
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Joined: 2007/6/27
Posts: 1573
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 Re: Any humanism with a political makeover here?

More conservative thought with the noble
intention of steering this nation right
with a return to the ideals and principles
of our Founding Fathers. What this nation
needs is a great revival and a turning from
our materialistic, prideful, selfish, stubborn
ways to follow and serve the interests and
principles of GOD AlMighty!!


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Martin G. Smith

 2010/2/20 12:17Profile
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Posts: 1124
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 Re: Any humanism with a political makeover here?

May I draw attention to the fact that this forum should not be used to voice political views however well founded they are. Thanks for understanding.

 2010/2/20 14:57Profile
IWantAnguish
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Joined: 2006/6/15
Posts: 343


 Re:

Quote:
May I draw attention to the fact that this forum should not be used to voice political views however well founded they are. Thanks for understanding.



Privatization... the logical fallacy that our ideals and beliefs ought not to flow into public areas of our lives.

Our culture of post-modernism has done a good work on you.

Please understand that the only reason America was able to rise to greatness was because of the convictions and beliefs that our founding fathers had about God.


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Sba

 2010/2/20 15:30Profile
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Joined: 2009/12/12
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 Re:

I understand your heart IWantAnguish. I think narrowpath was referring more to [url=https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=27354&forum=13&0]forum rules.[/url] God bless.


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Paul

 2010/2/20 17:17Profile
narrowpath
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Joined: 2005/1/9
Posts: 1124
Germany NRW

 Re:

Quote:
I understand your heart IWantAnguish. I think narrowpath was referring more to forum rules. God bless.



Thanks, Giggles, I was actually looking for these but could not find them.

 2010/2/20 17:58Profile
docs
Member



Joined: 2006/9/16
Posts: 2222


 Seems I may have unintentionally crossed a rule

I read the forum rules part (thanks to Giggles) about what is not allowed and realized I may have fudged. But I can say it was unintentional and not purposefully meant to cause any disruption in the forum rules. I'm more or less concerned with the church and all the things trying to distract us from the true task today and was wondering if some of the stuff in the document though good might also be a distraction.

But enough and blessings to all of you. And thanks to the moderators here.


_________________
David Winter

 2010/2/21 13:42Profile





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