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As long as we really are, in all honesty, loving God with all our heart, mind, soul and strength he will lead and be our God

Hi hoohoou. Did you know that is exactly what I believe sinlessness is? Loving God with all you have and loving your neighbor as yourself. Anyone who is currently loving God and neighbor is sinless perfect in my understanding. However, I only mean moral perfection (of choice) not mental, physical, emotional perfection. I don't believe we are required to be physically, mentally, and emotionally perfect. We are morally perfect as long as we love God and neighbor.

If you love God with all your heart, soul, mind and strength (all of your current ability) then you are morally perfect (sinless perfection).

 2010/2/16 13:19


The American evangelical church, which is the One True Religion, teaches that we are saved by reciting the sinner's prayer and we don't have to bother with all that obedience and sanctification stuff if we don't happen to feel like it. That settles it. Anyone who believes otherwise is anti-American and probably an al Qaeda sympathizer.

The fruit of Full Sanctification is a preoccupation with brawling over the doctrine of full sanctification. We know this because everyone who achieves sinless perfection spends the rest of their lives brawling over Wesleyan doctrine, like when Wesley organized a community of perfected saints, and then had to disband it to keep them from killing each other.

 2010/2/16 13:27


Those who read our posts will be encouraged to not sin and be truly convicted knowing that they could have avoided sin but still chose to.

I agree with this and pray that it is true. How can you have a revival without repentance and obedience? Is God too busy to start a revival? Are we waiting for him? Or is he waiting for us?

 2010/2/16 13:28

Joined: 2009/1/21
Posts: 1564
Locport, Illinois


ifound a video hereby tim conway sinless perfectionism by tim conway.

John Beechy

 2010/2/16 13:29Profile


"I'm sorry if I've misunderstood or misapplied your rebuke. Please tell me if I've taken you the wrong way." benjoseph

Hi BenJoseph. If there's one thing I can see here among the disagreements is your heart in this. And I think we can both agree that we both hate sinfulness and love Christ. This is most important with the love of eachother being tantamount to these. God bless.

(edit) Let me also add that the Bible says that God is not unjust. This cuts through the theological bantering on sinlessness in certain area's such as children and the handicapped. I have no worries that God will pardon justly, and see perfectly, without partiality or inconsistency. I don't need perfect theology to know this nor connect the dots rightly to understand it. Judgement that is reserved for us will always be just and perfect regardless of how any of us see this played out.

 2010/2/16 13:31

Joined: 2006/1/31
Posts: 4991


I will lock this thread now because it is going round and round, this topic is one of many often debated through this forums history, and seeing this thread is spinning downwards and not seeming to the best of my judgment to be building any one up in the most holy faith either.

And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name JESUS: for he shall save his people from their sins. (Mat 1:21 KJV)

This is a promise for us to claim personally, God is a savior from sin, the name Jesus even means just this, every time we pray in "Jesus name" we are praying "save me from my sin" paraphrased. Salvation occurs in many different tenses, past , present, future tense, so be assured, God wants to save you from all sins, the past ones, your present ones, and your future ones. And scripture speaks very horrible things of those who use that to excuse a life of sin. Its a great comfort to me that day by day i am being transformed into his likeness, i was predestined for this very purpose, so to me it is easy, when i am perfect, reached a sinless state i will be like Christ in all areas.

Some may reach that here on earth, i dont know, myself have not reached that goal, to be as Christ in all areas, in my mind, heart, actions, my devotion etc. But Christ is my goal. And i rejoice in the fact he has promised me to save me from my sins. And he lives in me.

A discussion about being free from sin ought to make the readers rejoice and by reading gain a greater desire to be free from sin, a stronger longing to become like Christ.

And i dont think we have that in this thread i am sorry to say. Let us press on towards perfection in how we communicate and the choice of words we use also, even when communicating a good thing.


 2010/2/16 13:43Profile

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