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Discussion Forum : Articles and Sermons : Oh Horrible Decree by Charles Wesley

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Giggles
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Joined: 2009/12/12
Posts: 592


 Re:

Quote:
In some way, Gods grace has appeared to all men. bringing salvation to them. We know it does not mean all will be saved, that would not be in agreement with many other scriptures. But it does mean, Gods grace has appeared to all... can that be without the spirits work? can any man see Gods grace without the spirits working? I dont know for sure, but there are many alike verses also that speaks of Gods love for all men and his will to see all men come to repentance.



I think part of God's grace appearing to all men or Jesus being the Savior of all men (1 Tim. 4:10) etc speak also of God's goodness to all men: in giving the rain and harvest in its seasons, in restraining the wickedness of man from running completely free, in allowing people to experience positive emotions (joy, peace, love, fufillment, etc) and meaningful relationships...every good thing man can experience is given by God only because of the work of Christ. And all men are partakers of this goodness and in that sense Christ is their Savior because He has saved them from absolute chaos and wrath while they live on earth, but He is especially the Savior of those who believe (1 Tim. 4:10) because they are given the full inheritance of His cross-work---literal salvation of their souls.


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Paul

 2010/2/13 17:27Profile
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Joined: 2008/5/21
Posts: 349
Las Vegas, NV

 Re: Oh Horrible Decree by Charles Wesley

Quote:
we know that the father must draw us and we know we are spiritually discerned before coming to Christ, are you saying that at the hearing of the gospel that some will resist the spirit or believe on it. I think that God has to work in us first. I think scripture speaks on that, but who really knows but God.


bible4life, this was already addressed in the doctrine of Prevenient Grace (ie. Common Grace that leads, or draws, unto Saving Grace). Did you read the previous explanation on Romans 2:4?

Quote:
The Jesus who said, "Love your enemies," also said, "Hate your mother and father." We have to be so careful.


Indeed, we need be very careful, and as such I would have to question Natan's comment, that this is "very very wisely put." The manner in which these verses have been opposed the one to the other tells me you are still confused on the relation between God's Love and Hate.

Be certain you do not mistake man's love and hate for the divine Love and divine Hate. For if by "Hate your mother and father" you intend to say "be [i]malicious[/i] to your mother and father" then we have a serious problem. For the "wrath of man does not work the righteousness of God" that is in Christ Jesus, the Savior from our sin. That is to say, very briefly, even God's Hatred is in agreement to the mighty working of His Love unto the salvation of all men — recall, "the wrath of God is revealed from heaven" and "Turn at my rebuke, and behold, I will pour out my spirit on you; I will make my words known to you."

Quote:
Hopefully, no one would be so proud as to assert that he or she comprehends the love of God. The nearer He draws us, does His love not become more incomprehensible?


Be also careful with these kinds of statements. For the purity and harmony of Truth manifests itself in that the Beginning of all Truth is in full agreement to the End of all Truth. It is therefore not necessary to entirely comprehend Truth in order to know some things as perfectly true or to know some things as absolutely false.

Nonetheless, to the finite mind, the Infinite Deity will always be incomprehensible to us; however, that does not mean we cannot apprehend anything about the Godhead because of what He has revealed concerning Himself; nor does this mean that God "becomes more incomprehensible," for God changes not — rather it is we who become more aware of our own inadequacies.


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Jordan

 2010/2/14 19:49Profile





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