Twayneb - You made some very good points in your post.

The believer does not have to sin, but sin is always a possibility, and it is dangerous to believe that we have arrived at sinless perfection no matter how spiritual we think that we are. We must stay watchful and daily have faith in the finished work of Jesus Christ reckoning ourselves dead to sin and alive unto God. Like someone said so well that the problem with living sacrifices is that they have the tendency to climb off the altar.

Mike

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Mike

Mike

I agree. Living sacrifices are the type that have sacrificed themselves of their own will, and that is where the problem comes in. When the fire gets a little hot, I am always faced with the choice of crawling off the altar, or submitting and having another part of what I used to be burned out of me, which can be a bit painful at times. The result of staying on the altar is always glorious.

I believe someone said that Augustine brought in the idea of dual nature. I am not sure, but I agree with Phillip and some of the others on this thread that the old man, the old nature if you will, is gone and we are become totally new creatures with new natures. We just have to realize that the flesh is still around. Look very carefully at 1 Corinthians. Paul is writing to a people whom he says are sanctified. He calls them hagios (holy or saints), and yet shortly thereafter he says they are carnal. Carnal simply means of the flesh or fleshly. These people who were possessors of the divine nature (2 Peter 1:4) were walking in their flesh and allowing their old patterns of thinking and doing to govern them, separating themselves along lines of various teachers. (Some may even say a form of denominationalism.)

This tells me that even though I have received a new nature, I am still very capable of allowing my mind, will, and emotions to govern rather than my born again spirit. Galatians 5, Paul speaks to the church at Galatia, a people who had been born again. In chapter 5 he gives a great example of what I am talking about. Walk in the spirit, and you shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh. It is not a battle of two natures. It is a battle between a new nature and an unrenewed mind. We can see great transformation as our mind is renewed. I think that is good part of what happens as we come into what we often call spiritual maturity. Our own mind, will, and emotions come more and more into alignment with the word of God.

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Travis

I guess at this point it would be a good time to share a testimony. It starts with me walking out of the only church I had attended since I have known God. Now because of various reason and much praying which I won't go into here I decided to leave.

I had just crossed the street after leaving the church for the last time. I prayed Father, I know what you spoke to me about.........(My Calling), I believe what you have said, I don't know how you'll do it but I believe you'll do it. Mid step the Holy Spirit spoke to me "you'll be like Job". This as you can imagine was not what I wanted to hear.

Five years later in back slidden state while I was working in West Africa there I caught a viral infection this infection causes blisters to appear on the skin.

I needed to hear from God and decided to Fast and Pray. After my time of fasting and praying ended it was around the same time I was going back to work, I had this question in my head "what makes a great man of God great". So I went searching the internet to find out about the men of god to get a insight into their lives, I came across Duncan Campbell’s testimony on sermon index and (that's how I became a member on here) downloaded it onto my IPod to listen to it on the plane.

After having my meal the light was dimmed I got out my IPod and started to listen to Duncan's Testimony when I got to the point where Duncan says "Go for God whatever it takes" these words cut through me with tears streaming down my face I went to the toilet got on my knees (As best I could in a small toilet) and prayed. The sobs and tears just kept on coming I asked God to help me.

For my whole month while in Africa every time I had on my own with God he turned up all I seemed to able to do was weep. During this time God had been talking to me about Holiness and the need to be Holy, he should me that there was a system still in me that needs to be removed. This system is evil and it’s so wrapped up in your personality that you believe it's you, the reason you are who you are is because of this system, it controls, it manipulates, it lies, and it affects every part of you, your mind, your will and emotions.

When I got back to Scotland, I got a book from a woman who had not put it to print yet it was called Revival the Call of Holiness this was God confirming to me what had been speaking to me about in Africa.

From there I have started studying and reading up on the subject. I AM NOT sanctified (Made Holy) yet no but my faith level are increasing as I study the subject of Holiness.

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Colin Murray

I for myself admit that i dont know completely myself and little do i know Christ. God is the one who knows us better than we know ourselves.
Sin is a mystery of iniquity and sin is lawlessness and to make things worse we have inheret a fallen nature with a mortal body.The effects of Adam original sin have brought spiritual and physical death and alienated us from God.

I have read some of the posts here from my brothers in Christ and it makes me aware that we are dealing with deep issues that need wisdom and revelation by the Holy Spirit. Im sure that most of us here have honest desires to follow Christ and love Christ as our Lord & Saviour.
Our experiences if we come to an honest evaluation & confession are not often according to that high standard required of us in the Sermon on the mount. Descipleship is a life of self-denial and total surrender (or abandonement) to God, its a life of continual obidience to God as we depend on Jesus to be our all in all.We have to die daily, and bear the cross and follow Him. To be saved all we need is repent and trust Jesus as our Lord and Saviour ( included here is to belief that he died on the cross for our sins and rose from the dead the 3rd day), but to be a disciple there is a condition 'if' to be fulfilled.

Without having any desire to debate or for controversy, my aim is to understand to my best the word of God concerning our regenarated and sanctified state & nature after we have believed. Most of us come with prejudices from our religious background or with theological leaning when we read the Word of God. It is clear that often we miss the mark and get lost in theological chaos of man made systems and water down the word of God or try to interprete it according to our experience.

I have a question? Has Christ provided for us a full salvation? And what does that mean? Our we to live the rest of our live with a dual nature (sinful & holy at the same time?)If Christ has destroyed the works of the devil of the cross and overcame the ennemy for us, why do we have this fatalist philosophy that we will never get rid of indweling sin in our life? That our nature is so totaly depraved that even Christ on the cross could not completly redeem it. That there is no eradication of sin and purification of the heart provided for us on the cross?

This is not selfish & sinless perfection im talking about, im talking about Jesus being all in all in us, im talking about him being our life and sanctification and that He is able to save us to the uttermost. Im talking about this higher & deeper life that is the priviledge of every child of God. Life that is in constant transformation by the grace of God fromone degree of glory to another degree of glory. As not having already attained but aming higher for God and progressing in our walk of faith.

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Redi

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Colin Murray