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Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : how does a new testament prophet equip the saint for work?

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lydian
Member



Joined: 2009/7/16
Posts: 19


 Re:

clintstone

brilliant, this was really what i was getting at, and your answer makes a lot of sense, thankyou.

interesting what you said about the gifts of the spirit also, will have to meditate on that.

 2009/7/16 18:41Profile
rbanks
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Joined: 2008/6/19
Posts: 1262


 Re:

Great posts twayneb and clintstone,

If I could add something here we must not depend on so called prophets to give us direction in our personal lives because we are to have an unction from the Holy One where we are to know all things whether they be of God or not because you do not want to be following a false prophet.

We must not depend on a prophet to lead us and tell us where to go and what to do.

A prophetic word is always a word from God for the edification of the body and is to speak to the spiritual man but the spiritual man must be following the leading of God's spirit within him.

Blessings to you all!

 2009/7/16 19:56Profile
clintstone
Member



Joined: 2008/4/20
Posts: 201
tulsa,ok.

 Re:

hello rbanks , I have laid my hands on people to be healed and the virtue did not flow out of me and i knew that i needed to give them some instructions to do , so that they would be healed if they did what i instructed . But , the instructions came fro the Holy Ghost and they have did as i told them and were healed . Now as far as being led by the Spirit of God , a prophet will confirm what the Holy Spirit has already told someone . I have God give my words to ministers , at stores and resturants , and i do not know them and have never seen them before , and the words of God , I give them always fit thier situation . This makes me think who am i that you would have me speak to your servants , and i just bow down and thank Him for using me . Oh! , how I long for the day to see this vision I have to come to pass, and this vision is about Jesus transforming man into His likeness . I have had a real hard time believing God would call me to such a vision but He has , and i hope too attain unto it . The only place i know of it coming to pass is a place in the wholehearted Spirit of Prayer. This Vision of God will be found by me when i seek Him with all my heart and not let up till is see it openly . The process of the ministration of the Holy Spirit comes to pass in our lives the same way the birthing of a baby comes to pass . First we have to feel and sense an emptiness , and have a need of filling that emptiness . Second we need to become open and naked before God , everything revealed , and opened too Him. Third , we have to have the conception from Him , a vision from Him , a seed given . Forth , we have to have the gestation period , for the ideals developement ,the seeds growth inside of us . Fifth , we have to have travail , there has to be this deep need to get the seed ,the vision out , to bless the world with the conception of God that we have recieved . The ministraton of the Holy Spirit always comes through us in this way . That which is natural points to the physical. Leonard ravenhills son preached on this at the church i attended in 1991 , leonard was there too , it was a great pleasure to be there in those meetings .. I know this was off the subject but felt this would help someone here ,, God bless . Clint


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Clint Demoret

 2009/7/17 19:11Profile
murrcolr
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Joined: 2007/4/25
Posts: 1572
Scotland, UK

 Re: how does a new testament prophet equip the saint for work?

[b]Doctrine[/b]

Eph 3:4-5 whereby, when ye read, ye can perceive my understanding in the mystery of Christ; which in other generations was not made known unto the sons of men, as it hath now been revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets in the Spirit.

The above verses clearly associate Prophets with receiving revelation directly from God, and that revelation is not necessarily regarding the future but rather doctrine.

Corinthians 13:2 the gift of prophecy is explained as "understanding all mysteries and all knowledge." A "mystery," in New Testament terminology, is a secret, something unknowable apart from direct revelation. The underlying assumption is that the gift involved special revelation.

[b]The Past[/b]

Jesus could tell the hidden past of the woman at the well, He was immediately recognized as a prophet John 4:19

[b]The Future[/b]

Agabas exercised the gift of prophecy in a predictive way: he foretold a coming famine and also Paul's coming sufferings Acts 11:27-28, Acts 21:10-11

What you need to focus on right know is your relationship with God, his Spirit will work the work in you and accomplish what needs to be done as you lay down your life. Don't be in a hurry to step into ministry as the devil has tricked many in this way. There are timings for things to be done and you must go with Gods timings because if you go in your own time you will get out from under Gods protection.

Prayer should be your main concern, you should love to pray and communicate with God.

Your life style must be Holy, you can't be one thing at church and another at home, when it's time for you to preach you must live what you preach. You can't just preach the message [b]you must be the message[/b]


_________________
Colin Murray

 2009/7/19 19:53Profile









 Re:

AbideinHim said:

Quote:
Not everyone that moves in the gift of prophecy as listed in 1Corinthians 12 is a prophet. Anyone that is filled with the Holy Spirit can be used by God in prophecy. Prophecy is not some weird mysterious thing as some have made it out to be, but is simply speaking forth the will of God for the purpose of building up the Body of Christ.

Amen Very Good.

 2009/7/19 21:36
intrcssr83
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Joined: 2005/10/28
Posts: 246
Logan City, Queensland, Australia

 Re:

Has anyone read Wayne Grudem's [i]The Gift of Prophecy: In the New Testament and Today?[/i]

I heard a sermon by John Piper on NT propecy wherein he compared the cessationist and charismatic views, citing Richard Gaffin who held to a cessationist position that NT prophecy was on a par in authority to scripture and thus had ceased; and Grudem whose thesis is that NT prophecy was a completely different phenomenon to biblical inspiration and thus can be operated in the church today.
[url=http://www.desiringgod.org/ResourceLibrary/Sermons/ByDate/2004/186_Using_Our_Gifts_in_Proportion_to_Our_Faith_Part_1/]John Piper - Using Our Gifts in Proportion to Our Faith (Rom12): The Gift of Prophecy [/url]


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Benjamin Valentine

 2009/7/19 22:41Profile
lydian
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Joined: 2009/7/16
Posts: 19


 Re:

hi MURRCOLR

good post, again some more stuff to ponder

by the way, who was the following for? me(Lydian) or someone else?

""What you need to focus on right know is your relationship with God, his Spirit will work the work in you and accomplish what needs to be done as you lay down your life. Don't be in a hurry to step into ministry as the devil has tricked many in this way. There are timings for things to be done and you must go with Gods timings because if you go in your own time you will get out from under Gods protection.

Prayer should be your main concern, you should love to pray and communicate with God.

Your life style must be Holy, you can't be one thing at church and another at home, when it's time for you to preach you must live what you preach. You can't just preach the message you must be the message""

If it was for me, then i should say, im an Evangelist, not a young prophet seeking counsel(although by the questions im asking it would seem like it). I asked these questions, more of a desire to understand the 5 fold roles better as i believe God is calling me to be a vessel regarding church planting in scotland (im from Peterhead by the way)
what you have said is great advice tho. The last thing we want to do is birth an "ishmael" ministry. Id rather wait many years for the promises to come than try and and make it happen.

God bless

 2009/7/20 7:50Profile
lydian
Member



Joined: 2009/7/16
Posts: 19


 Re:

hi intrcssr83

mite have to have a listen to the piper sermon and take a look at waynes book. cheers

his name rings a bell, is he a calvanist that wrote a book about doctrine?

 2009/7/20 7:54Profile
murrcolr
Member



Joined: 2007/4/25
Posts: 1572
Scotland, UK

 Re:

Fit like, Im fae Buckie but moved hoose into the toon a few years ago.

Quote:
What you need to focus on right know is your relationship with God, his Spirit will work the work in you and accomplish what needs to be done as you lay down your life. Don't be in a hurry to step into ministry as the devil has tricked many in this way. There are timings for things to be done and you must go with Gods timings because if you go in your own time you will get out from under Gods protection.

Prayer should be your main concern, you should love to pray and communicate with God.

Your life style must be Holy, you can't be one thing at church and another at home, when it's time for you to preach you must live what you preach. You can't just preach the message you must be the message



It's something God spoke to me but it's good advice for anyone and for any ministry gift regardless of the calling on your life.

A Prophet is Ordained by God not men have a look at Jeremiah this typical of what happens.

Jer 1:4-5 Now the word of Jehovah came unto me, saying. Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.

A Prophet before he is sent understands the Holiness of God and the sinful condition of himself and men and God does a work of Holiness in his Prophet before he is sent.

Isa 6:5 Then said I, Woe is me! for I am undone; because I am a man of unclean lips, and I dwell in the midst of a people of unclean lips: for mine eyes have seen the King, Jehovah of hosts.

Isa 6:7 and he touched my mouth with it, and said, Lo, this hath touched thy lips; and thine iniquity is taken away, and thy sin forgiven.

Isa 6:8 And I heard the voice of the Lord, saying, Whom shall I send, and who will go for us? Then I said, Here am I; send me.

They will have a defined message.

Isa 6:9 And he said, Go, and tell this people, Hear ye indeed, but understand not; and see ye indeed, but perceive not.

Also there will be a defined area of influence.

Isa 1:1 The vision of Isaiah the son of Amoz, which he saw concerning Judah and Jerusalem, in the days of Uzziah, Jotham, Ahaz, and Hezekiah, kings of Judah.

Jer 1:5 Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.

When the Prophet is sent by God he will remind the People who God Jer 2:5. He will remind the people what God has done for them Jer 2:7 and he will confront the sin in the people. Jer 2:8 Jer 2:13

Repentance will be called for Jer 3:22 they will be reminded of the promises of God how he can deal with there sin Jer 4:1 If the people do not turn and repent then Judgement will come Jer 4:12.

Know you can get that to lesser degrees of prophets for example on a church level Acts 11:28 and a personnel level Acts 21:10.

But you can't just limit the Prophet to operating in only the above. Prophets reveal the mysteries that are in scripture Esp 3:5 Rev 10:7 they also are the foundation of what the church is built on Esp 2:20 They will tear down things but he will also build and plant Jer 1:10 There lifes are examples Jam 5:20 They will be driven by a deep love for God and for people 1Cor 13:2 they will walk in the more excellent way 1Cor 12:31 and will understand that way because it says in Jas 3:17 But the wisdom that is from above is first pure, then peaceable, gentle, easy to be entreated, full of mercy and good fruits, without variance, without hypocrisy. The Prophet a true Prophet is full of the wisdom from above. Leonard Ravenhall describes a Prophet as totally "otherworldly."

The Prophet will be misunderstood and hated Matt 23:34 and revered when he is dead Luke 11:47. They are strong Ezek 3:8 and fearless Ezek 3:9 because of the work God does in them. He is equipped by God to face the generation that he lives in Ezek 3:9 he speaks the truth if they like it or not Ezek 3:11.


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Colin Murray

 2009/7/20 17:35Profile
intrcssr83
Member



Joined: 2005/10/28
Posts: 246
Logan City, Queensland, Australia

 Re:

Quote:
by lydian on 2009/7/20 19:54:48

hi intrcssr83

mite have to have a listen to the piper sermon and take a look at waynes book. cheers

his name rings a bell, is he a calvanist that wrote a book about doctrine?



Yes, Wayne Grudem is the author of the [i]Systematic Theology[/i] textbook. Doctrinally, he can best be described as a Reformed-Charismatic: he holds to a calvinistic soteriology as well as a "Third Wave" view of spiritual gifts that C. Peter Wagner, Jack Deere, John Wimber, The Vineyard Movement, et al, are known for. An odd combo to be sure, but he's well-reputed among those on both sides.


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Benjamin Valentine

 2009/7/20 18:48Profile





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