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Paul preached a pre-tribulation position

Where is it in scriptures where it says that there will be 7 years of tribulation? (3 1/2 years of tribulation, 3 1/2 years of wrath)

 2009/7/5 12:57


To Deepthinker:

In the book of Daniel. God gives Nebuchadnezzar a dream that he cannot remember. God gives the interpretation of the dream to Daniel--it is a birds eye view of the History of the World, starting with Nebuchadnezzar, King of Babylon, who ruled the world by the Help of God, followed by Meads and the Persians (Darius & Cyrus), followed by Greece (Alexander the Great), and followed by Rome (The thighs and legs of iron). The Roman Empire will be revived, at the beginning of the last 7 years that the Government of Man rules the earth. This last "kingdom" is described as the one with the ten toes of iron and clay. At the end of this last "kingdom" of man, Christ will come, the stone that was cut without hands, the chief cornerstone, and destroy the last kingdom of man, and will rule and reign on the earth for 1,ooo years:
Rev 2:34-35
34. Thou sawest till that a stone was cut out without hands, which smote the image upon his feet that were of iron and clay, and brake them to pieces. 35. Then was the iron, the clay, the brass, the silver, and the gold, broken to pieces together, and became like the chaff of the summer threshingfloors; and the wind carried them away, that no place was found for them: and the stone that smote the image became a great mountain, and filled the whole earth.

We are now in the time of growing pains of the Revival of the Roman Empire, in the time of the kingdom depicted as being of Iron and Clay.

This last kingdom will be replaced by the 1,000 year reign of Jesus Christ upon the earth. Jesus will rule & reign with a rod of iron during this period.

After that, He will let Satan out of the bottomless pit one last time to decieve the nations. All nations will march against Christ at Jerusalem, and he will destroy them all by the words of His mouth.

All the lost from the beginning of time will then be judged at the Great White Throne Judgment, and the books will be opened, and their own works will be judged by the standard, the Bible. They will all be found guilty, and bend their knees to Jesus Christ as Lord, before they are cast into the lake of fire, with Satan and his fallen angels, forever and ever.

Then, God will create a new heaven and a new earth, and we will be with him forever. He will wipe away our every tear!

Revelation 21

1. And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
2. And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
3. And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
4. And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.
5. And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.
6. And he said unto me, It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.
7. He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.
8. But the fearful, and unbelieving, and abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
9. And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb's wife.
10. And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God,
11. Having the glory of God: and her light was like unto a stone most precious, even like a jasper stone, clear as crystal;
12. And had a wall great and high, and had twelve gates, and at the gates twelve angels, and names written thereon, which are the names of the twelve tribes of the children of Israel:
13. On the east three gates; on the north three gates; on the south three gates; and on the west three gates.
14. And the wall of the city had twelve foundations, and in them the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb.
15. And he that talked with me had a golden reed to measure the city, and the gates thereof, and the wall thereof.
16. And the city lieth foursquare, and the length is as large as the breadth: and he measured the city with the reed, twelve thousand furlongs. The length and the breadth and the height of it are equal.
17. And he measured the wall thereof, an hundred and forty and four cubits, according to the measure of a man, that is, of the angel.
18. And the building of the wall of it was of jasper: and the city was pure gold, like unto clear glass.
19. And the foundations of the wall of the city were garnished with all manner of precious stones. The first foundation was jasper; the second, sapphire; the third, a chalcedony; the fourth, an emerald;
20. The fifth, sardonyx; the sixth, sardius; the seventh, chrysolite; the eighth, beryl; the ninth, a topaz; the tenth, a chrysoprasus; the eleventh, a jacinth; the twelfth, an amethyst.
21. And the twelve gates were twelve pearls: every several gate was of one pearl: and the street of the city was pure gold, as it were transparent glass.
22. And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it.
23. And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof.
24. And the nations of them which are saved shall walk in the light of it: and the kings of the earth do bring their glory and honour into it.
25. And the gates of it shall not be shut at all by day: for there shall be no night there.
26. And they shall bring the glory and honour of the nations into it.
27. And there shall in no wise enter into it any thing that defileth, neither whatsoever worketh abomination, or maketh a lie: but they which are written in the Lamb's book of life.




DeepThinker wrote:
Paul preached a pre-tribulation position

Where is it in scriptures where it says that there will be 7 years of tribulation? (3 1/2 years of tribulation, 3 1/2 years of wrath)

 2009/7/5 18:56

Joined: 2008/5/23
Posts: 611
Monroe, LA - USA


Lordoitagain, how solid are you in what you believe to be the truth concerning endtime bible prophecy?

I try to heed the scriptural admonition:

1Co 8:2 And if any man think that he knoweth any thing, he knoweth nothing yet as he ought to know.
1Co 8:3 But if any man love God, the same is known of him.

If I can love God and be known of Him that is the most important thing. I try try not to put very much "stock" in what I can "figure out" regarding the end times. Jesus clearly told his disciples:

Act 1:6 When they therefore were come together, they asked of him, saying, Lord, wilt thou at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel?
Act 1:7 And he said unto them, It is not for you to know the times or the seasons, which the Father hath put in his own power.

Having walked with the Lord for some 33 years now, I have repeatedly had my ideas "blown out of the water" when more light was shed on subjects that I thought I understood very well. It is dangerous to "arrive" at what we think is "the truth" on a matter and then begin to rationalize and reason away plain and obvious scriptures that defeat our theories regarding an issue.

I once told a JW that the situation that Jesus spoke of in Luke 16 was not just a parable, it was a true account. Jesus began it with "There was a certain rich man" . . . he was making it very clear that he was not just telling a parable to illustrate, he was giving an actual detailed account. The JW got angry at me and said: "you're just gonna reject the truth over two words . . .there was . . ." In reality, he was the one who was rejecting the truth, because in black and white (or red and white) it is plainly written, but his theory which ignores eternal punishment for the wicked didn't go along with "there was".

If we solidify our theories and aren't willing to face the reality that we are mere mortals who can only see through a glass darkly, we can end up being too proud to face reality when someone shows it to us in plain greek!

I have to go along with Whitestone:

Not every believer has been given the benefit of a higher education (some have none) but God writes His laws in the heart of every believer and I believe they are the same laws for each Saint. It is natural man that puts the shackles on new converts. Here is the answer for that. Titus 3:9: But avoid foolish questions, and genealogies, and contentions, and strivings about the law; for they are unprofitable and vain.

We do not worry ourselves if there will be a rapture, or not. What does that matter? We follow Jesus, if it is His will that we suffer we trust He will allow us to do it with grace.

It is only on the part where you say this filthy world will continue forever where I balk.

I have had very little higher education. The few hours I studied in college I mostly wanted to learn Spanish. I have met MANY Hispanics who had very little education (if any) who knew the Bible better than most Americans with a high school education. I know a little Honduran man who had NO public education, but after he got saved (around age 20), he taught himself to read (in Spanish) by reading the Bible. Knowing God is what he prioritizes on. He's very poor and humble but very knowledgable of the scriptures. When he was in Honduras and Guatemala, he went to churches that had members constantly praying and fasting. He told of a funeral that several of them went to where they gathered around the dead lady and prayed for about 30 minutes, and watched her rise from the dead!

OH to be known of God . . . .

1Co 8:2 And if any man think that he knoweth any thing, he knoweth nothing yet as he ought to know.
1Co 8:3 But if any man love God, the same is known of him.

. . . in such a way that I can call on Him in such a moment and see Him work His wonders!

To me it is a vain pursuit to study prophecy for the motive of "arriving" at a solidified belief. I have heard MANY discussions, sermons, etc. with strong presentations on pre, mid, post, etc . . . however, THERE IS an end coming:

Mat 24:14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.

As soon as the last unreached people group and language (in all the world) gets the message . . .

. . . THE END!

Michael Strickland

 2009/7/6 1:13Profile

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