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Discussion Forum : Scriptures and Doctrine : Sin nature!

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holiness1214
Member



Joined: 2008/7/31
Posts: 9


 Sin nature!

"Disclaimer" While I did read some of the posts I did not take the time to read all of the other posts so I am sorry if I repeat someone else.

First look in Genesis, Gen 1:27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them. Here it tells us that when God created us we were in His likeness and in His image, but now move on after the fall of man and read Gen 5:3 And Adam lived a hundred and thirty years, and begot a son in his own likeness, after his image; and called his name Seth:. Just by looking at these two verses alone we can see that there was a change from what we were to what we now are. and lest anyone should say that these verse are simply talking about physical likeness, they need only look in Eph 4:24 And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness. Two other verses I wan to mention before I move from Genesis. Gen 6:5 And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually. Gen 8:21 And the LORD smelled a sweet savor; and the LORD said in his heart, I will not again curse the ground any more for man's sake; for the imagination of man's heart is evil from his youth; neither will I again smite any more every thing living, as I have done. In both of these verses God sates that man is not good by nature but rather evil by nature.
Now look in Psalms 58:3 The wicked are estranged from the womb: they go astray as soon as they be born, speaking lies. Psa 51:5 Behold, I was shapen in iniquity; and in sin did my mother conceive me. Isa 48:8 Yea, thou heardest not; yea, thou knewest not; yea, from that time that thine ear was not opened: for I knew that thou wouldest deal very treacherously, and wast called a transgressor from the womb. All three of these verse say that from the very womb we are sinners, and lest someone should say that these verses only apply to certain individuals or certain groups of people compare them to Eph 2:3 Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others. In this verse the all inclusive word "all" is used. Furthermore this verse goes so far as to say that we are by nature the children of wrath. Many more verses could have been cited but to save space I hope that these will suffice to give an answer to your question that YES there is a sin nature.






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Luke

 2008/11/24 1:49Profile
holiness1214
Member



Joined: 2008/7/31
Posts: 9


 Re: Sin nature!

This was meant to be put on the post about "sin nature" that already exist.


_________________
Luke

 2008/11/24 1:53Profile









 Re: Sin nature!

Quote:
All three of these verse say that from the very womb we are sinners,

Amen, I agree.

 2008/11/24 11:54
FireinmyBones1
Member



Joined: 2004/1/17
Posts: 219
Michigan

 Re:

I don't think the question should really be are we born with a sinful nature. Rather it should be do we retain that same sin nature after we are born again. The answer to the second question is an emphatic "NO!". This is where I take issue with much of the "holiness" and "deeper life" teachings. While I agree with a good portion of it, this little bit of leaven works it's way through the whole loaf pretty effectively.


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Jeff

 2008/11/24 15:38Profile









 Re:

[b]1)[/b] if inherited sin means [u]our natural ability to be tempted[/u] then it is no cause for guilt. Jesus was able to be tempted.

[b]2)[/b] if inherited sin means [u]wanting to sin[/u] then we don't have free will, aren't guilty, nullify the cross, and make an image of the beast and worship it.

[b]3)[/b] if inherited sin means [u]something about our nature that makes temptation more difficult to resist[/u]. Then Jesus had it and overcame. Otherwise antichrist is true.


[i]Does anyone have any alternative definitions that fit in a sentence?[/i]

 2008/11/24 15:47
AbideinHim
Member



Joined: 2006/11/26
Posts: 3783
Louisiana

 Re:

Quote:

"I don't think the question should really be are we born with a sinful nature. Rather it should be do we retain that same sin nature after we are born again. The answer to the second question is an emphatic "NO!". This is where I take issue with much of the "holiness" and "deeper life" teachings. While I agree with a good portion of it, this little bit of leaven works it's way through the whole loaf pretty effectively."


Brother, I agree with you that when a person is born again that he is no longer a sinner by nature. He is a new creation with a new nature.

Galatians 5 was written to believers. We are instructed to walk in the Spirit so that we will not fulfill the lusts of the flesh. The flesh still needs to be dealt with in the believer. The spirit and flesh are still at war with one another. A spiritual believer is one that has put on the new man and put off the old. A carnal Christian is one that has been regenerated, but is still being controlled by the desires and impluses of the flesh.

Mike


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Mike

 2008/11/24 18:25Profile
holiness1214
Member



Joined: 2008/7/31
Posts: 9


 Re:

1. Jesus was born sinless and never had inbred sin Luke 1:35 And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God. John 14:30 Hereafter I will not talk much with you: for the prince of this world cometh, and hath nothing in me. Rom 8:3 For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: . The place you are speaking of is 1Jn 4:3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world. but to say that this verse teaches that Jesus had to struggle with the sin nature would make Him unholy (holy=free from sin) and if He had been unholy then He could not have been a Sufficient sacrifice for our sins Heb 9:14 How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God? 1Pe 1:19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and2 without spot:.
The sin nature is not what makes a person able to be tempted. This can clearly be seen from the story of Adam and Eve. After God created them He said they were good and since God abhors sin we know that they were not created with sin. Jesus also had no sin nature as I pointed out previously and yet He was tempted.
2. Just because you want to do something does not mean that you have to do it. A diabetic may want to eat chocolate cake but he knows if he does it will be bad for him. Just because a person wants to sin does not make them innocent of sin. If this was the case then fornicators, adulters, and drunkards would be innocent before God, But in Galatians 5:21 says otherwise. A person still has a choice to deny the flesh or serve the flesh.
3. The sinful nature is not something that makes it impossible to resist temptation. The sin nature
affects us in two ways: 1, it makes us sinners from birth. 2. it gives us a natural propensity to ward sin.


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Luke

 2008/11/29 18:25Profile
thomasm
Member



Joined: 2007/8/17
Posts: 116
Lloydminster, Alberta, Canada

 Re:

Re:
Eph: 2; 1-9 (niv)As for you , you were dead in
your transgressions and sins, in which you used
to live when you followed the ways of this world
and the ruler of the kingdom of the air, the
spirit who is now at work in those who are
disobedient. All of us also lived among them at
one time, gratifying the craving of our sinful
nature (flesh) and following its desires and
thoughts. Like the rest, we were by *NATURE*
objects of wrath. But because of his great love
for us, God who is rich in mercy, made us alive
with Christ even when we were dead in
\ transgressions- it is by grace you have been
saved . And God raised us up with Christ and
seated us with him in the heavenly realms in
Christ Jesus, In order that in the coming ages
he might show the incomparable riches of his
grace, expressed in his kindness to us in Christ
Jesus. For it is by grace you have been saved,
through faith- and this not from yourselves, it
is the gift of God- not by works, so that no one
can boast.

*nature* Strongs #5449 phusis; from 5453; growth
(by germination or expansion) i.e. (by impl.)
natural production (lineal descent); by extens. a
genus of sort; fig. native disposition,
constitution or usage;-([man-]) kind, nature ([-al]).

Gal; 2:15 "We who are Jews by *BIRTH* and
not 'Gentile sinners' know that a man is not
justified by observing the law, but by faith in
Jesus Christ."
The word birth is the same Greek word.


2Pet:1: 4 has the same word. "Through these he
has given us his very great and precious
promises, so that through them you may
participate in the divine *NATURE* and escape the
corruption in the world caused by evil desires."


Just some food for thought.

Love in Christ tom


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Tom weighill

 2008/12/5 17:02Profile
Totality
Member



Joined: 2008/11/23
Posts: 68
Sulphur Springs, Texas

 Re:

Quote:
A spiritual believer is one that has put on the new man and put off the old. A carnal Christian is one that has been regenerated, but is still being controlled by the desires and impulses of the flesh.



agree, and yet disagree. I agree with the first and part of the second part. I know that there are such men as carnal Christians, Paul writes about them in 1 Corinthians 3:1-3. But in this verse he was merely talking about infants in Christ. So I personally do not believe that a 14 year old Christian can be carnal *I speak in years after salvation*

But I agree with you on everything else.


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Maximino Cosme II

 2008/12/7 7:04Profile
bobmutch
Member



Joined: 2008/6/26
Posts: 90


 Re:

benjoseph:
>>>3) if inherited sin means something about our nature that makes temptation more difficult to resist. Then Jesus had it and overcame. Otherwise antichrist is true.

Surely you don't believe this? Jesus was sinless and didn't have a sinful nature.


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Bob Mutch

 2008/12/8 11:54Profile





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