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Logic
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Joined: 2005/7/17
Posts: 1791


 The Purpose of the Tree

The reason of the Tree of the Knowledg of Good & Evil.

If God never pt the Tree of the Knowledg of Good & Evil in the garden, how would Adam have to serve God or to aknowledge HIM?
The Tree serves as a link to God's authority, and by obeying the command, Adam serves God and acknowledges HIS authority.

God put the tree there to set up a way to prove love and for a deterrent of worshiping their spouse. Not for God's benefit, but for Adam & Eve's benefit.

If Adam never had a way to express his loyalty or devotion to God through obedience, Adam could have worshiped Eve in his relationship with her more than God, and vise verse.

That is what Mamone is. [b]Matthew 6:24[/b] [color=990000]No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. You cannot serve God and mammon.[/color]
Mammon = that which is given to you.

Eve was Given to Adam, and if Adam did not have any connection to serve God in any way, Adam would have surly worshiped Eve and Eve would have worship Adam.

Any Thoughts?

 2008/8/30 12:43Profile
HeartSong
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Joined: 2006/9/13
Posts: 3165


 Re: The Purpose of the Tree

Was Adam Given to Eve?

 2008/8/30 12:50Profile
theopenlife
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Joined: 2007/1/30
Posts: 926


 Re: The Purpose of the Tree

Hey Logic, interesting subject.

I find this proposition difficult to swallow, without more reasoning:

"Adam would have surly worshiped Eve and Eve would have worship Adam."

I'm not convinced that in his unfallen state he would have.


I'm not concluded on this subject, but here are some other views I came across today while thinking about it:

-----

for God to create people who could appreciate His glory and His goodness then those people would have to have at least an awareness of non-goodness and non-glory. To know God as God we would have to have some concept of not-God.

The question then raised was: So does that mean we'd have to sin? That seems wrong.

That is where the tree of knowledge of good and evil comes in. I often ask myself why God put it there. After all, it really ended up ruining things. And that's when a thought hit hit me. Perhaps the tree, even before it was eaten from, by its very presence and its forbiddenness, already provided knowledge of good and evil (in an innocent yet very real way).

After all, they had knowledge of good all around them: Created life as creatures in right relationship with their Creator. They had knowledge of evil right in front of them. You could disobey if you wanted to. You could have created life as creatures in wrong relationship with Your Creator. There was God or not-God; life or not-life; good or not-good. To use Barth's words, there was Yes or No; Light or Shadow.

And so there is the tree. Just be being there it gives humankind the freedom they need to have to actually love God and experience good. Just by being there it also gives them responsibility. Trust and obey God or not. Perhaps when they bit the fruit, they already 'knew' good and evil, but now they 'knew' it in an intimate way. Interesting that a couple chapters later Adam knew Eve, and the idiom means they had sex with each other.

---------

Wayne Grudem's take on it:

Quote:

"In the Garden of Eden, it seems quite clear that there was a legally binding set of provisions that defined the conditions of the relationship between God and man. The two parties are evident as God speaks to Adam and gives commands to him. The requirements of the relationship are clearly defined in the commands that God gave to Adam and Eve (Gen. 1:28–30; cf. 2:15) and in the direct command to Adam, “You may freely eat of every tree of the garden; but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall die” (Gen. 2:16–17).

In this statement to Adam about the tree of the knowledge of good and evil there is a promise of punishment for disobedience—death, most fully understood to mean death in an extensive sense, physical, spiritual, and eternal death and separation from God.2 In the promise of punishment for disobedience there is implicit a promise of blessing for obedience. This blessing would consist of not receiving death, and the implication is that the blessing would be the opposite of “death.” It would involve physical life that would not end and spiritual life in terms of a relationship with God that would go on forever. The presence of the “tree of life...in the midst of the garden” (Gen. 2:9) also signified the promise of eternal life with God if Adam and Eve had met the conditions of a covenant relationship by obeying God completely until he decided that their time of testing was finished. After the fall, God removed Adam and Eve from the garden, partly so that they would not be able to take from the tree of life “and eat, and live for ever” (Gen. 3:22)."

 2008/8/30 12:57Profile
Logic
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Joined: 2005/7/17
Posts: 1791


 Re:

Quote:
theopenlife wrote:
Hey Logic, interesting subject.

Thanx & thanx for responding.

This is only a subject that I started to study.
So I don't mind objections. However, All I ask is all give correctly interpreted Scripture to back their POV up.
What I mean by "correctly interpreted Scripture" is that all people have their own interp. of Scripture, some are correct, and some are not.
When one gives a verse or makes blank statementes of fact, please put a commentary of their own words of how they interperet the verse or passage of how the fact is proven.
Unless it is so very self explainatory.

Quote:
"Adam would have surly worshiped Eve and Eve would have worship Adam."

I'm not convinced that in his unfallen state he would have.

Adam and ever sinned just as we do today.
The are made of weak flesh that noe one can pleas God with.
The cause of Adams fall is the flesh:
[b]1John 2:16[/b] [color=990000]For all that is in the world,[/color]
[b]1:[/b] [color=990000]the lust of the flesh[/color]
[b]2:[/b] [color=990000]the lust of the eyes[/color]
[b]3:[/b] [color=990000]the pride of life,
is not of the Father, but is of the world.[/color]

Gen 3:6 [color=990000]And when the woman saw that the tree was...[/color]
[b]1:[/b] [color=990000]good for food,
and that it was...[/color]
[b]2:[/b] [color=990000]pleasant to the eyes.
and a tree to be...[/color]
[b]3:[/b] [color=990000]desired to make one wise
she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat.[/color]

We are no diferent that they were, even before they sinned.

Quote:
And that's when a thought hit hit me. Perhaps the tree, even before it was eaten from, by its very presence and its forbiddenness, already provided knowledge of good and evil (in an innocent yet very real way)...
...They had knowledge of evil right in front of them. You could disobey if you wanted to.

I like this.
They knew about good and evil by the fact od the name of the tree.
However, they have not yet experianced evil.

Quote:
And so there is the tree. Just be being there it gives humankind the freedom they need to have to actually love God and experience good. Just by being there it also gives them responsibility. Trust and obey God or not. Perhaps when they bit the fruit, they already 'knew' good and evil, but now they 'knew' it in an intimate way. Interesting that a couple chapters later Adam knew Eve, and the idiom means they had sex with each other.

This is good.
However, [b]If[/b] God never put the Tree of the Knowledg of Good & Evil in the garden, [b]how[/b] would Adam have to serve God or to aknowledge HIM?

Couldn't the Tree serve as a link to God's authority by obeying the command and by acknowledging HIS authority?

 2008/8/30 13:24Profile
Logic
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Joined: 2005/7/17
Posts: 1791


 Re:

Quote:
HeartSong wrote:
Was Adam Given to Eve?

In a way, yes.
Why not?

 2008/8/30 13:24Profile
Christinyou
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Joined: 2005/11/2
Posts: 3707
Ca.

 Re:

Genesis 2:22-23 And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man. And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man.

1 Corinthians 11:3 But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God.

If man is the head of the woman, he must be the the head even as Christ is the head of the man.

Philippians 2:6-8 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God: But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men: And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.

This is from the stand point of the man in this death, even giving himself for his bride.

Ephesians 5:25-28 Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it; That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word, That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish. So ought men to love their wives as their own bodies. He that loveth his wife loveth himself.

If God gave woman to man, then it is his responsibility to make her as his wife or bride, presenting her even to himself holy and without blemish even as Christ has His bride the Body of Christ His Church.

This is not possible without Christ in both husband and wife, for the capacity of Christ to present unto Himself His perfect Church the Bride of Christ.

"That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word, That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish. So ought men to love their wives as their own bodies."

Who did God give Christ to? His own body the Church. Same for the man and the woman. She is for the man and he is for the woman. That the two may be one flesh and bring for fruit, that the two might be One Spirit and bring for much fruit. The fruit of the flesh is children, the Fruit of The Spirit is; Galatians 5:22-26 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law. And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts. If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit. Let us not be desirous of vain glory, provoking one another, envying one another.

Ephesians 5:9 (For the fruit of the Spirit is in all goodness and righteousness and truth;)

Which is Christ in you the Hope of Glory, that brings the man and woman into the same glory in Christ and each other.

Man for woman, woman for man, both one in Christ for God and Christ by the Holy Spirit, also to each other. "Love one another even as I have loved you."

In Christ: Phillip


_________________
Phillip

 2008/9/3 15:01Profile
HeartSong
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Joined: 2006/9/13
Posts: 3165


 Re:

Thank you Phillip.

 2008/9/3 15:56Profile
Abide
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Joined: 2004/10/18
Posts: 52


 Re: The Purpose of the Tree

Eve was Given to Adam, and if Adam did not have any connection to serve God in any way, Adam would have surly worshiped Eve and Eve would have worship Adam.

Yes, logic that is correct, as a shadow of things to come. It is not good for man to be alone, so God in his infinite wisdom created a helper suitable for him and her name was Eve. I will elaborate more as time permits. I'll leave you with this, obedience is better then sacrifice.

If Adam never had a way to express his loyalty or devotion to God through obedience, Adam could have worshiped Eve in his relationship with her more than God, and vise verse.

 2008/9/3 16:16Profile
Christinyou
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Joined: 2005/11/2
Posts: 3707
Ca.

 Re:

How could Adam worship Eve, when He agreed with Her in the lie of the devil and then blamed it on Her. Adam could only worship self.

How could Eve worship Adam when she was deceived and transgressed and wanted Adam to agree with her decision instead of believing Adam, to whom God gave the commandment, "Don't Eat". Eve only wanted to be self right.

They could not even worship each other, because of selfishness. Which was the major problem with Satan, putting self above God.

In God giving man to woman and woman to man, it only took 6 days to mess that up.

In Christ: Phillip


_________________
Phillip

 2008/9/5 20:46Profile
Logic
Member



Joined: 2005/7/17
Posts: 1791


 Re:

Quote:
Christinyou wrote:
How could Adam worship Eve, when He agreed with Her in the lie of the devil and then blamed it on Her. Adam could only worship self.

Ada had more regard for Eve that God as he took the fruit from her.
How much more regard would Adam have for Eve, if there wasn't a tree for him to give regard to God through?

It was only after Adam sinned that he blaimed Eve.

Quote:
How could Eve worship Adam when she was deceived and transgressed and wanted Adam to agree with her decision instead of believing Adam

That is your answer.
She wanted Adam to agree with her.
She never honored God and asked Him about it.

How much more regard would Eve have for Adam, if there wasn't a tree for her to give regard to God through?

Quote:
In God giving man to woman and woman to man, it only took 6 days to mess that up.

Can't be so sure in the timespan, it is only speculation.

 2008/9/9 15:23Profile





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