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pastorfrin
Member



Joined: 2006/1/19
Posts: 1406


 Re:

Quote:

ccchhhrrriiisss wrote:
Hi pastorfrin...
Quote:
"The Bible tells us"
This is definitly not a quote; so how can one take something that is a positive statement that is taught throughout the Bible and turn it into a negative? Who does this edify?

Actually, it appears that she was trying to quote it. It isn't a concept that she is relating, but a specific set of words that she seems to try and quote.

But why? What was she trying to say? Let consider her words: "[i]To minister to the needs of God's creation is an act of worship. To ignore those needs is to dishonor the God who made us[/i]."

I certainly agree that we should do our best to not pollute rivers and oceans. We shouldn't be given to litter. We should keep the world as lovely as possible because to do otherwise hides the fact that the "The heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament sheweth his handywork" (Psalm 19:1 - a [u]real[/u] verse).

Earth was created for mankind. God gave mankind dominion over the entire Earth and every creature in it. We are, of course, the caretakers of the world that God gave to us. We shouldn't be wasteful or bad stewards. Yet we have every right to use it as we see fit in order to make a living for ourselves and our family. We can use the plants and animals for food and clothing, and consume trees, sand and mud to manufacture our homes. We should be mindful of species and prevent their extinction -- in a similar manner to how God protected them from extinction during the Flood. If we chop down trees, we could easily replace them with seedlings. In a sense, we are simply fulfilling our role as good stewards.

The danger in Ms. Pelosi's remarks, however, comes in the idea of [i]Earth-worship[/i]. There are individuals who promote the value of the Earth ABOVE the value of human beings. They stray from simply warning individuals about good stewardship and venture into chiding mankind for eating meat, "slaughtering" trees, or using resources for our own benefit.

It has always amazed me that some people are far more concerned with saving whales and penguins than the inhumane slaughter of unborn children who feel the pains of their murder. I have read about activists who chained themselves to trees; yet, these same activists mock anti-abortion demonstrators as being "mindless radicals." There is something wrong with this picture.

A few months ago, I read some posts on a message board at an environmental website. The more radical (and applauded) environmentalists went so far as to say that mankind needs to revert back to dwelling in mud homes, use no "fossil" fuels, and reject the use of automobiles or airplanes. Ironically, these comments came from some of the leaders of the movement. The others seemed to feel badly that they still used automobiles.

This is when we cross the plane of common sense. Such environmentalists no longer appreciate their dominion over the Earth -- but desire the Earth to hold dominion over us. This is contrary to the will of God. And those same environmentalists are also the most ardent supporters of abortion. Why? Because a larger population would "rob" the Earth of its "precious" resources. In other words, the respect the creation more than the Creator.

As believers, we should set an example in word and action. We should appreciate the things that God has given us and serve as a good steward of his gifts. If we own a home, we should keep it clean as best we can. If we hunt and kill animals, it should be in the knowledge that it provides food and skin. We should probably do our best to recycle, since we don't want excess cans and trash in our cities and towns. But we shouldn't allow Earth worshippers to dictate the morality of our habits. That role is reserved for God and the conscience that He has given us.

:-)



Lets see, sounds like; that's it, mindless political babel. :-(

 2008/4/25 19:31Profile









 Re:

Lets see, sounds like; that's it, mindless political babel.

.................................................
No sir, not political, not in my opinion. The world has labeled many things that are in direct obedience or disobedience to God as political and forbidden for Christians to discuss, such as this subject. I can assure you that the number of these things will grow, as the prince of the air plots and schemes how he can convince the Christians to be silent about what are the things of God and what are not. Man that's a pretty neat trick, the devil says, all I have to do is just get someone to label these things political and it puts it off limits. The really sad thing is, it is working for many who are really seeking to be pleasing to the Lord.

 2008/4/25 20:17
ccchhhrrriiisss
Member



Joined: 2003/11/23
Posts: 4529


 Re:

Dear pastorfrin...

Quote:
Lets see, sounds like; that's it, mindless political babel. :-(


How does this sound like "mindless political babel?" In fact, this is not political at all. A woman, who happens to be a high ranking politician, quoted a verse that doesn't exist.

You said that it was a "positive statement." I agreed -- to the extent that we have a responsibility of being good stewards of this world (because it is a testament of God's greatness). However, I warned that environmentalism can sometimes wander into worshipping the creation rather than the Creator. PETA, GreenPeace, et al., spend millions of dollars and hours tireless campaigning on behalf of whales, dolphins, and trees. I am not saying that such a thing is necessarily wrong. However, it is hypocritical when a person does such a thing yet also proudly supports abortion because of "love for the planet" (since they are quite concerned with overpopulation).

This is not "mindless political babel." In fact, dear brother, it is not "babel" at all. We live in a world where people proudly campaign both for the protection of trees and wildlife AND for the slaughter of innocent unborn children. The merits and/or hypocrisies of such a thing can be discussed without dismissing it as "mindless babel" -- in the same way you can discuss your particular beliefs about "Christian non-resistance." I will respect your views...even if I don't completely agree with all of them. I would ask that you to do the same. We are all searching for what is pure and pleasing to our Father.


_________________
Christopher

 2008/4/25 21:26Profile
pastorfrin
Member



Joined: 2006/1/19
Posts: 1406


 Re:

Quote:

moe_mac wrote:
Lets see, sounds like; that's it, mindless political babel.

.................................................
No sir, not political, not in my opinion. The world has labeled many things that are in direct obedience or disobedience to God as political and forbidden for Christians to discuss, such as this subject. I can assure you that the number of these things will grow, as the prince of the air plots and schemes how he can convince the Christians to be silent about what are the things of God and what are not. Man that's a pretty neat trick, the devil says, all I have to do is just get someone to label these things political and it puts it off limits. The really sad thing is, it is working for many who are really seeking to be pleasing to the Lord.





You all talk your politics;

I will continue being tricked into preaching Jesus Christ and Him crucified.

Romans 1:16
For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

1 Cor. 1:18-24
For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God. [19] For it is written, I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and will bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent. [20] Where is the wise? where is the scribe? where is the disputer of this world? hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world? [21] For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe. [22] For the Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom: [23] But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness; [24] But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.

1 Cor. 2:2
For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ, and him crucified.







 2008/4/25 21:27Profile









 Re:

You all talk your politics;
I will continue being tricked into preaching Jesus Christ and Him crucified.

................................................
Amen you preach Jesus and we will too and when they are converted they will stand against evil with us. Amen.

 2008/4/25 21:45









 Re: SPEAKER: Somebodies Bible! Save the Whales! White Rats!

This was actually written into the constitution of the sovereign state of Gommorah, and proclaimed every Spring, just before the Astarte worship began, and they began to experience the wonders of Nature...



Speaker Pelosi just forgot what testament she was reading. Save the whales!







Did you know that Adolph Hitler instituted a law, punishable by fine and prison, that stated the humane way to boil a Lobster.[ It had something to do with the water temperature, so the lobster would not suffer.] Really. I don't know if there was Satanic humor in it, or not. The SS , at the same time, threw Jewish infants alive, into vats of flaming Gasoline, as their mother's watched. You see, they did not rate as humans. The creation, though, was paramount in their ideology. The Devil warps thinking a little, EH?


Heavy metal strip mining in Colorado and the North West polluted many rivers, that could have solved So. California's water issues today, completely. Is abusing the Earth a wise idea? No. Of course, conservation of all resources are Godly, and wisdom. The question is, are they to be worshipped, or Exalted above the Creator, as has been discussed.

The answer, is up to you, and your inclination to love the Truth above all others.


 2008/4/30 8:20
roadsign
Member



Joined: 2005/5/2
Posts: 3777


 Re: idolizing our "home"

Quote:
'To minister to the needs of God's creation is an act of worship.


The “verse” in question may be Adam’s call to tend the earth – included with the many biblical references to nature – how nature glorifies the Lord. A call to care for the earth is not in itself unreasonable, as it is our way of loving fellow humanity. These days our very existence as a human race is being threatened by environmental threats and so it is not surprising that the earth is given a divine attribute. What we trust in and what we fear is what we are inclined to worship.

Quote:
mindless political babel.



While we can all have a good chuckle over such utter “stupidity”, we are sobered by the fact that we Christians have always been prone to create Biblical “absolutes” in the same manner – by trying to make the Word fit into common cultural views. A brief overview of church history would reveal that.

Let’s admit, we are still reeling from the past tendency to confuse the Biblical meaning of “Church”. Look at the far-fetched path that has taken many on – and causing our institutions to become idols. It has led to much bitter disappointment – yes, even anger and outrage, as the “idol” fails to provide as it was expected to.

Here we all are - on a “revival” site. As someone pointed out, it is easy to turn even the idea of revival into an idol of course based on biblical verses – or rather the interpretation of verses. You don’t even find the word once in the NT.

Today many are seeking a revival of our earthly “home” – that is the turf that sustains all of life. Today there are those (yes, even evangelicals) who believe that Jesus died to save the earth (literally). There are those who have been putting their trust in a future utopia on earth – and they adjust all their theology accordingly. That is no different in my mind than the idolatry of our environmentalists.

Perhaps the real problem is that many love this temporal life more than the life Christ has called us into: eternal life, the Kingdom of God.


Diane


_________________
Diane

 2008/4/30 12:04Profile
roadsign
Member



Joined: 2005/5/2
Posts: 3777


 Re: idolizing our "home"

oops - double...


_________________
Diane

 2008/4/30 12:04Profile
Compton
Member



Joined: 2005/2/24
Posts: 2732


 Re:

Quote:
While we can all have a good chuckle over such utter “stupidity”, we are sobered by the fact that we Christians have always been prone to create Biblical “absolutes” in the same manner – by trying to make the Word fit into common cultural views.



That's very true.

Paul Washer has observed that many in his denomination snicker at infant baptism, yet they themselves believe they are saved simply because, as little children, they recited a few unbiblical lines presumably inviting Jesus 'into their hearts' without the slightest understanding of the Gospel, or even a sorrow for sin. He calls this particularly evangelical example of biblical illiteracy the 'idolatry of decisionism.'

MC


_________________
Mike Compton

 2008/4/30 12:22Profile









 Re:

Quote:

roadsign wrote:
Quote:

Today many are seeking a revival of our earthly “home” – that is the turf that sustains all of life. There are those (yes, even evangelicals) who believe that Jesus died to save the earth (literally). There are still many who have been putting their trust in a future utopia on earth – and they adjust all their theology accordingly.

Perhaps the real problem is more universal than we think:


many love this temporal life more than the life Christ has called us into: eternal life, the Kingdom of God.





[b][size=medium]That eternal life starts at conversion, here on earth. Nuff said.[/size][/b]

 2008/4/30 12:45





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