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 Re:

Quote:
It concerns me that someone who says Jesus is not God considers themselves Christian.

Actually you can be a Christian and believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.
Quote:
Acts 8:37 And Philip said,[to the Eunuch] If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest[be baptized]. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.

Thats sufficient, we don't have to split hairs as to to the details.

I know that the word became flesh and dwelt among us, but if someone just believes that Jesus is the Son of God, so be it, I ain't going to argue with them and really neither should anyone else.

Let people grow, isn't it by revelation that the Father illuminates our understanding in these matters?
Quote:
Matthew 16:15 He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am?16 And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon BarJona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.

 2008/2/15 19:55
ginnyrose
Member



Joined: 2004/7/7
Posts: 7534
Mississippi

 Re:

Quote:
but "the Son of the Living God



Quote:
I refuse to 'humanize' the Eternal God, call Him 100% God + 100% Man, a 'godman' or anything other than "Hear O Israel, the LORD our GOD, the LORD is one".



Sharon, I cannot understand your problem in believing that Jesus was human and also divine. Mind if I resort to nature to illustrate?

I grew up on a productive farm that was highly diversified. Among other things, Dad had a dairy where we milked Holsteins, Ayrshire's, and Guernsey cows. Until he used AI services he had an Angus bull to service the cows. The offspring from these Holsteins, Guernseys or Ayrshire's all looked black like their sire, but also have the characteristics of their dam (mother). A dairyman would never consider using the offspring of a mix like this as replacement cows in the dairy herd because the Angus breed is not a dairy animal but a beef. The point is the calf had the traits of both parents. Now, why is it hard to understand the divinity of Jesus whose Father was God? and the mother was Mary?

ginnyrose


_________________
Sandra Miller

 2008/2/15 20:36Profile









 Re:

Quote:
the Scriptures do not require one to believe a "Jesus is YHWH' creed, but simply, as Peter declared, *"You are the Christ, the SON of the Living God"*. Jesus did not rebuke or correct Peter for that declaration,

I personally don't see a problem with Sharon's stand on what she believes to be true, according to the scriptures.

What she is not accepting is the Trinity. And who can blame her? The Trinity was introduced in the New Testament, before that people knew Jehovah as the One true God.

I think were splitting hairs here. Let the woman believe that Jesus is the Son of God. If Sharon believes also that Jesus is the way to the Father, that He is the Truth and the Life then let her dwell in the knowledge that has been given her. God forbid if anyone of us were to share how we see the God head, everyone would leave off Sharon and jump on us. :-(

 2008/2/15 20:55
Miccah
Member



Joined: 2007/9/13
Posts: 1752
Wisconsin

 Re:

Compliments wrote:


Quote:
I think were splitting hairs here. Let the woman believe that Jesus is the Son of God. If Sharon believes also that Jesus is the way to the Father, that He is the Truth and the Life then let her dwell in the knowledge that has been given her. God forbid if anyone of us were to share how we see the God head, everyone would leave off Sharon and jump on us. :-(



Compliments,

The issue here lies in that Sharon has an agenda to debunk the truth of the Gospel. Since coming back on the baords, Sharon now has an agenda of spreading this false teaching to the brothers and sisters here. Anyone that would question her beliefs are treated as being "close minded", which in effect can be said exactly the same back.

Do we role over and allow the gospel to be tread upon for the sake of being PC? What should we do if not to defend the Gospel with a passion? The agenda that is being spread here is not for a deeper understanding of the Lord, but to convert all to an false gospel, doctrine and belief. Titus specifically talks about what to do with people who try to do this.

Simpleliving said it the best. Debating it here will not change anyone's minds.

For the most part though, Sharon respectivly said goodbye, but then she continued to preach her agenda. This agenda very well may lead people to hell, much less her own soul.

So to stand aside and allow to be taught what is unallowable, is unacceptable for most people here. I for one respect Sharon as a human being and love her, but I will continue to contend for the Lord and the truth, regardless if it offends her. The gospel IS offensive to those that don't believe in its truth.

And the truth is that what Sharon is preaching IS a fake gospel. As with ALL other fake gospels, this one belongs in the garbage with the rest


_________________
Christiaan

 2008/2/15 21:16Profile









 Re:

I've been praying since 1:30 a.m. yesterday - Valentine's Day :-( -- with what to do with what I was made to realize at that time.

That was when I came to find out that I've made a horrible mistake, that has hit me very sharply in my heart. It's still hurting, yet I'm not sure if I can express it adequately.

I have told some on here that I remember what I post - (though looking back on some - I'm not pleased with myself ): - But I can't do "time" very well. I almost literally have no conception of time anymore. That's not my fault, but in this one instance - that inability may have caused me to hurt some very dear brothers here.
At the time mentioned above - I found this thread by clicking on a profile. https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=20396&forum=36#159777

In a number of my posts since that thread, I have said that the men weren't here for the whole discussion - only thinking of the other thread that preceded this one, on the same topic.

My deepest and most sincerest apology for my brain deadness in this. I said it in a few places because of the impact the Oct. issue had on us - so that by time Nov came - I just "let go and let God" through others, with a great sigh of relief. I let go of it at that point.

Those brothers did an admirable job and I learned from just sitting back and watching them.
They are members, that should be commended - not 'forgotten'.

Forgive me for my mental-time-lapses and lack of acknowledgment of a job well done.

Sincerely.




Editing to add: Coincidently - on NPR yesterday, they interviewed a Author who just published a book called "Where did I leave my glasses?". :-(
I took notes and wrote down the Authors name, etc..
Maybe I'm just now being led by The LORD to admit I may have what the title contains, "The what, when and why of normal Memory Loss", by Martha Weinman Leer.
Oh Dear LORD help us!

 2008/2/15 22:12
crsschk
Member



Joined: 2003/6/11
Posts: 9192
Santa Clara, CA

 Re: Challenged

Quote:
It would be nice, but ultimately I do not agree with the Board's practice and toleration of judging the Eternal Destiny of others whom they hardly know.



Do not know that is either the practice nor the example.

Quote:
**The story of Michael Servatus, who was burned at the stake for his pure monotheistic belief and rejection of the the trinitarian dogma and infant baptism, reminds us of how one (John Calvin), is venerated in the church today as one of the 'Fathers of the Reformation", with churches, schools etc being named after him. That he had someone slowly burned at the stake for [b]disagreeing[/b] with him, is one of those little secrets which christianity has chosen to sweep under the carpet. Michael Servatus was judged and condemned to die, while the true villian in the case has been honored among men, and his destructive Inquisitorial spirit is alive and well today.**



And the inference is that challenging your statements is ... equal to this absurdity?

Quote:
I refuse to 'humanize' the Eternal God, call Him 100% God + 100% Man, a 'godman' or anything other than "Hear O Israel, the LORD our GOD, the LORD is one".



[i]And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God[/i] ~ Joh 20:28

Thomas answering Jesus.


If you are offended, you are offended. It is unfortunate and would prefer to see you stay. But I have to ask when these declarations come forth what it is saying. If you were completely convinced of your stance then none of the challenges should present a problem whatsoever. This is similar to the test of the 'prophets' that raise an ire and a defense over their being put to the test of scripture, it doesn't compute and is telling of some lingering doubt that doesn't want to come to the surface.

The structure of this forum is such that we (the moderators) try and discern best how to deal with matters in any given moment. To be fair, I do not know that we might have done some things better, intervened at points, but again, we do not always catch every nuance that goes on in any given posting. Forgive us there.

Hope you might reconsider.



_________________
Mike Balog

 2008/2/15 22:17Profile
Tears_of_joy
Member



Joined: 2003/10/30
Posts: 1554


 Re:

Quote:
Complimennts wrote:

I personally don't see a problem with Sharon's stand on what she believes to be true, according to the scriptures.

What she is not accepting is the Trinity. And who can blame her? The Trinity was introduced in the New Testament, before that people knew Jehovah as the One true God.

[b]I think were splitting hairs here.[/b] Let the woman believe that Jesus is the Son of God. If Sharon believes also that Jesus is the way to the Father, that He is the Truth and the Life then let her dwell in the knowledge that has been given her. God forbid if anyone of us were to share how we see the God head, everyone would leave off Sharon and jump on us.



On a first sight this reasoning seems innocent, but what a powerful danger of destruction it is hidden there. Karl, how much we should watch in these last days and ages when thousands of new doctrines of men will hit the church, just with one purpose: to put it away from the truth. Brother Karl, be careful not to be used by the enemy to support the untruth concerning fundamental things with the statements 'it is splitting hears'. What a times of delusion are coming from all sides! What a war it is under heavenly places, every evil force is with one purpose, to led astray from the truth. Be zealous for the truth brother, be zealous and burn for it, otherwise it is dangerous.

Sister Annie mentioned that thread, I will also, because it is important.

[url=https://www.sermonindex.net/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?mode=viewtopic&topic_id=20396&forum=36&start=0&viewmode=flat&order=0]Was God tempted to worship Satan?[/url]

When a brother Nile was in doubting times of the truth and was introduced in a Satan's doctrines, wildbranch, came and supported him and helping him for getting away for the truth and establishing in error. This is a terrible sin.

If wildbranch came here in a humble way to learn and ask it is one thing, but it is other thing that she is spreading agenda and sowing doubts in the mind of people. What if some new in the faith came and read her doctrines? We will be responsible for allowing her for spreading them.

These are not subjects of eating meat or not, it's about life or death, it's about the person of our Lord Jesus. There is not playing games with these things in the name of love and good will.

 2008/2/16 3:08Profile









 Re:

I don't fully know all of wildbranch's belief's concerning the Diety of Christ. I would say first that if she condemns those who believe Jesus is God then that would be a major problem on her part and a major red flag for Christians. If one believes in the strict interp of the law that "you shall have no other gods before Me" then it would reason that one would believe that christians break that law by worshipping Jesus, and the soul that sins shall die, meaning cast into hell.
Concerning the title "The Son of God". The Jew's recognized that that title was to claim Diety and took up stones to stone Him for it. I think John Chp 8 has that account.
Islam, the Quran, also recognizes that the claim to be the Son of God is a claim of Diety. (Read the english trans by ,Daywood I think).
Also in additon to all the plain scripture concerning the Diety of Christ I would recommend reading from "Dictionary of Early Christian Beliefs", by David Bercot, a former jehovahs witness, by the way. Look up Diety of Christ and see how the early christian leaders explain the mystery of the Godhead. These writers are "pre Nicene council"
God bless John

 2008/2/16 7:40









 Re:

Sharon, if you are still peering in, I found an interesting article that may be of some help to you. Maybe all of us for that matter. in either of these, neither side denies the Deity of Christ, but it just is something you said earlier, and maybe on another post.

Remember Jesus told the man on teh Cross next to Him, TODAY you will be with me in Paradise....AKA Abraham's Bosom.

I too think it would be necessary to study Leviticus, concerning the Lamb slain, and then the scapegoat who carried away the sins of the people.

It takes much help from the Holy Spirit to understand these truths, for our natural minds cannot truly grasp.

Faith is believeing what God said, even if we don't quite understand ourselves the intricate workings ....as in Creation. BY FAITH we believe God created the world, but were any of us here to see exactly how?

Once we take God at His Word, it's still ok to say....OK I believe You, but my mind needs to be renewed to understanding these things.....Our minds are renewed...and we have the Mind of Christ in these matters. The Natural man cannot understand the things of the Spirit, and this is why the Pharisees crucified Jesus Christ, because He said He was the Son of God. Only the True **Spiritual** seed of Abraham, and not only so, even the woman at the well....

Love in Christ
Katy


http://www.dr-fnlee.org/docs4/dgdoc/dgdoc.pdf

 2008/2/16 9:18
narrowpath
Member



Joined: 2005/1/9
Posts: 1522
Germany NRW

 Re:

wildbranch wrote

Quote:
I refuse to 'humanize' the Eternal God, call Him 100% God + 100% Man, a 'godman' or anything other than "Hear O Israel, the LORD our GOD, the LORD is one".



Here is a simple test in the bible.

1 John 4:2This is how you can recognize the Spirit of God: Every spirit that acknowledges that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God, 3but every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the antichrist, which you have heard is coming and even now is already in the world.

Do you believe that He
Did he His shed human blood or not?


Was he the son of man or not?
If he did not die as God in human flesh our sins are not forgiven and there is no hope at all.
God might as well pack up his whole universe because his whole plan of salvation would be undone.

Philip




 2008/2/16 9:35Profile





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