After this tragic shooting at YWAM and New Life Church in Colorado, I want to ask this while at the same time wanting to be sensitive to any YWAM or New Life Church people who may stumble across this thread.

We've discussed the issue of self defense in previous threads and we've all fallen under vastly differing views.

There are those like me who believe in protecting our loved ones if something like a home intrusion occurred. There are those who claim they would do nothing to protect themselves or their family because Jesus taught about turning the other cheek. And there are those who fall somewhere in the middle.

At New Life Church on Sunday the killer was shot by an armed security guard at the church. She was a member of the church, and a volunteer security guard. As far as I know she is not law enforcement. Her actions probably saved who knows how many lives. I think she is a hero.

This is where we need to be sensitive to what we say because with as many people that are a part of YWAM and New Life, I am sure there are some who have visited this site.

But it is an interesting thing to ponder, and I think this is a great example of how, in this case, self defense and the protection of others was a right and godly thing to do. If their security had not acted as it had, or if they had no security at all, the damage done by this killer would have been far worse than we can imagine. It might have been another Virginia Tech. It ended up being tragic, but it could have been worse.

How do you feel about this. More importantly, what do you believe about this? Was the action taken wrong? Or was the response proper?

Again, as you respond, please think about what you post before you post it.

Krispy

krispy, I belive it is called justifiable homicide. She probably did the right thing. So many things to factor in.
Those in military and law enforcement have heavy duty stress when they kill and need counseling.
Audie Murphy, An amazing war hero,underwent post tramatic stress after the war.
Killing, even, justified is a bitter pill.
I believe it haunts the individual in the night.
We should pray for her.


David

David, absolutely. You're right. I was in combat situations during my hitch in the Marine Corps. It's not like the movies.

Krispy

This is one of those threads you would rather avoid. Or should I say, I would rather avoid.

I really don't know what to make of the situation
and whether or not she was right or wrong.

I know she's alive.

How much people will use scripture to applaud or condemn what she has done remains to be seen.

Some will quote 'you shall not murder', which in my eyes it wasn't murder.

Some will quote 'as much as depends on you, live peaceably with all men', and the attack wasn't up to her, it was due to the attacker that she did what she did.

So, it remains to be seen what others think.

What I do look at is the use of scripture in threads. Those that use opinion and reasoning are being pragmatic and I go deaf when people do that.

That's it from me.

God bless.

Jim wrote: "think that the words of Christ, the entire new Testament, and the true Church on earth (outside of the US) stand as a testimony against this abomination."

Abomination? I really wonder if you would call it an abomination if that securtiy just saved your MOM!!?...give me a break!!! Dear one, I like for you to walk up to those families who were saved and tell them this was an abomination!

On a side note that security guard they said was on her 3rd day of fasting for Gods will for her life while all this happened!

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Brent

Jim, before I comment further...please give me chapter and verse your referring to of these commandmants. Thanks!

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Brent

Here are a few. Let me also add that we are so surrounded by false christianity here in babylon that it makes it almost impossible to understand the word of God anymore. People who do not forsake their lives by staying awake at night praying in travail, selling their possesions and following the clear commands of Christ will never be able to comprehend actaully laying their physical lives down.

We talk so much about when persecution comes, the sheep will be divided from the goats. So are the sheep or the goats the ones now armed for self defense? A question we must ask to see through the fog of babylon.

In Christ - Jim

All scripture is from ESV
Luk 9:23 And he said to all, "If anyone would come after me, let him deny himself and take up his cross daily and follow me.
Luk 9:24 For whoever would save his life will lose it, but whoever loses his life for my sake will save it.
Luk 9:25 For what does it profit a man if he gains the whole world and loses or forfeits himself?
Luk 9:26 For whoever is ashamed of me and of my words, of him will the Son of Man be ashamed when he comes in his glory and the glory of the Father and of the holy angels.


Luk 14:25 Now great crowds accompanied him, and he turned and said to them,
Luk 14:26 "If anyone comes to me and does not hate his own father and mother and wife and children and brothers and sisters, yes, and even his own life, he cannot be my disciple.
Luk 14:27 Whoever does not bear his own cross and come after me cannot be my disciple.
Luk 14:28 For which of you, desiring to build a tower, does not first sit down and count the cost, whether he has enough to complete it?
Luk 14:29 Otherwise, when he has laid a foundation and is not able to finish, all who see it begin to mock him,
Luk 14:30 saying, 'This man began to build and was not able to finish.'
Luk 14:31 Or what king, going out to encounter another king in war, will not sit down first and deliberate whether he is able with ten thousand to meet him who comes against him with twenty thousand?
Luk 14:32 And if not, while the other is yet a great way off, he sends a delegation and asks for terms of peace.
Luk 14:33 So therefore, any one of you who does not renounce all that he has cannot be my disciple.
Luk 14:34 "Salt is good, but if salt has lost its taste, how shall its saltiness be restored?
Luk 14:35 It is of no use either for the soil or for the manure pile. It is thrown away. He who has ears to hear, let him hear."


Rev 12:10 And I heard a loud voice in heaven, saying, "Now the salvation and the power and the kingdom of our God and the authority of his Christ have come, for the accuser of our brothers has been thrown down, who accuses them day and night before our God.
Rev 12:11 And they have conquered him by the blood of the Lamb and by the word of their testimony, for they loved not their lives even unto death.
Rev 12:12 Therefore, rejoice, O heavens and you who dwell in them! But woe to you, O earth and sea, for the devil has come down to you in great wrath, because he knows that his time is short!"


2Th 1:4 Therefore we ourselves boast about you in the churches of God for your steadfastness and faith in all your persecutions and in the afflictions that you are enduring.
2Th 1:5 This is evidence of the righteous judgment of God, that you may be considered worthy of the kingdom of God, for which you are also suffering--
2Th 1:6 since indeed God considers it just to repay with affliction those who afflict you,
2Th 1:7 and to grant relief to you who are afflicted as well as to us, when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven with his mighty angels
2Th 1:8 in flaming fire, inflicting vengeance on those who do not know God and on those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus.
2Th 1:9 They will suffer the punishment of eternal destruction, away from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of his might,
2Th 1:10 when he comes on that day to be glorified in his saints, and to be marveled at among all who have believed, because our testimony to you was believed.
2Th 1:11 To this end we always pray for you, that our God may make you worthy of his calling and may fulfill every resolve for good and every work of faith by his power,
2Th 1:12 so that the name of our Lord Jesus may be glorified in you, and you in him, according to the grace of our God and the Lord Jesus Christ.

Jim, I had a quick thought because I am still reading your non KJV scriptures which I can say something about but will later...

Thought: Are you saying that the people in that church should of been killed? Did this idiot interupt Gods will in stopping people from being murdered?? Are you saying that God did not use that security guard? Because that idiot had ALOT of ammo left to kill well over a 100 people.
Just curious?

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Brent